Why is this cash grab/scam even on the Oculus Store? — Oculus
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Why is this cash grab/scam even on the Oculus Store?

Nobbs66Nobbs66 Posts: 722 Poster of the Week
This is such a blatant cash grab/scam it amazes me that it's allowed on Home. 

http://www.roadtovr.com/dating-lessons-review/
https://www.oculus.com/experiences/rift/1166940850052305/
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Comments

  • Blyss4226Blyss4226 Posts: 549 Poster of the Week
    edited December 2016
    Totally, I discovered it earlier and we were talking about it. Look at the bio of the guy who made it. This is his real bio.

    Magic Leone is an unusual dating coach. He came to the U.S. from India after his failed attempt at suicide when he discovered that his fiancé of 7 years was cheating on him.

    Magic studied the deep emotional and physical needs that fuel women’s sexual desires while counseling them on sexual health. Working with women, Magic developed an understanding of how most women want to be seduced. This knowledge led him to sexual encounters with more than 400 women, and ultimately to marry the woman of his dreams.

    Magic is known to be a tough coach who runs military-style workshops that force men to evolve overnight, but you may not know that he is actually a softy who craves chocolate 5 times a day. In fact there was a time Magic’s clients brought him chocolate to workshops as part of his compensation, and sometimes even as a form of bribe to make him go easy on them. Magic is also a movie buff. In his spare time (after he is done indulging in women), he secretly works on the screenplay that is his dream project.
    This isn't even in the Gallery! It's in the main part of the store. Just wow. It's also shown as Early Access on Steam, but NOT on Oculus Home.

    This people just prey on lonely hearts who have no other option and it's sick and sad. He's a scammer plain and simple and this "game" should not be on Oculus Home.
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  • kojackkojack Posts: 5,294 Volunteer Moderator
    I want to see his "Power Pose to Show Her You’re a Superior Man".

    Can it beat this?


  • ZenbaneZenbane Posts: 14,111 Valuable Player
    I'm speechless 
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  • GreymanGreyman Posts: 1,309
    Wintermute
    This one appears to have parallels with the censorship discussion, in that knowing where to draw the line is never going to be simple.  If you read the reviews of some of the more niche games, there will tend to be a wide range of views, but if one person likes it, should Oculus be removing it from their store?

    Hopefully, this thread will serve as a useful source of information to anyone thinking of buying it, but surely we we should let the market decide. With reviews like the one linked, that decision is likely to be a resounding "no".

    Personally, as a long-time-married, 54-year-old, I don't think that I will be buying this one.  :)

  • BlastaMastaBlastaMasta Posts: 183
    Art3mis
    Yes! It is a store in the end, I expect a little bit of quality control, this has nothing to do with censorship. I hate the amount of rubbish pumped out on steam, 40% of theirs library was made in 2016. This is not a good example to follow, have some standards for the loves sake. Like Jim Stirling said (thanks God for him) -Stop selling toys full of cum. And I agree


  • Hiro_Protag0nistHiro_Protag0nist Posts: 4,790 Valuable Player
    Oculus are starting from the beginning and I would love to see them doing things the right way and only letting good quality experiences onto their platform. 

    Let Google allow all-comers, keep Oculus Home regulated please.
  • EliteSPAEliteSPA Posts: 1,560
    Project 2501
    Really?!
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  • DaftnDirectDaftnDirect Posts: 4,802 Volunteer Moderator
    Tricky one. On the one hand I can see VR could provide a practice medium for people who find it difficult interacting with real people... I mean VR will become closer and closer to the real thing as the tech improves.
    On the other hand, is this the right app for the job? Is it a scam? maybe but is that because this type of app is a scam... or because this particular app is?
    I'd be cautious of branding dating apps a scam in general... I mean I have my own opinion but that's just my opinion! and a little reluctant to brand this one a scam more than any other without at least reading a review or two.

    any volunteers?
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  • Techy111Techy111 Posts: 6,171 Volunteer Moderator
    For the purpose of scientific research, I'm happy to experiment with any female forum members. And not that type of member ;)
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  • RorschachPhoenixRorschachPhoenix Posts: 1,594 Valuable Player

    Excuse my bad english. I speak to you through the google translator. :P
  • nalex66nalex66 Posts: 4,530 Volunteer Moderator
    edited January 2017
    This whole "Pick-up Artist" scene is super-creepy, and I'm disappointed to see it show up on the Oculus Store. I see these guys pop up online and in the news from time to time, blathering about how they can trick hundreds of women into sleeping with them like it's some form of revenge, while at the same time going on about how women are the cause of all their problems and are eroding the rights of men.

    We had one of them (@PeterAndrewNolan) show up in these forums a couple years ago, posting long-winded rants about how VR sex was going to liberate men from the machinations of women, and how the women's lib movement would therefore target VR and take it away from us. He got himself banned inside of a week, fortunately. Here's an old thread where he and our good buddy @cleverusername carry on with all manor of tinfoil hat stuff and women-hating.
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  • nosys70nosys70 Posts: 466
    Art3mis
    edited January 2017

    well , it's all about money, including oculus store and VR, so why should he not get the right to get his share.

    This forum has thread about porn VR and I don't know how many games where shooting and killing is the main concept. What a nice way to grab money.

    If you don't agree , you can still NOT purchase his apps, and even ignore it.

    But treating the app as a cash grab/scam is the worst thing to do (so if it really worked you would purchase it ?).



  • HoIIywoodHoIIywood Posts: 325
    Trinity
    edited January 2017
    It can't be any worse than this extremely condescending dripping with anti-white, anti-western sentiment 
    "documentary" 

    https://www.oculus.com/experiences/rift/1248924088498899/

    Home is starting to look like Steam Early Access. 

    I thought they were taking approval of apps seriously.

    nosys70 said:

    well , it's all about money, including oculus store and VR, so why should he not get the right to get his share.

    This forum has thread about porn VR and I don't know how many games where shooting and killing is the main concept. What a nice way to grab money.

    If you don't agree , you can still NOT purchase his apps, and even ignore it.

    But treating the app as a cash grab/scam is the worst thing to do (so if it really worked you would purchase it ?).




    1. Shareholders care
    2. Reputation of the host business who accommodates and enables
    3. It takes up unnecessary space
    4. Every time you see this, you could be looking at something more worth while

    Bed Bath and Beyond could sell Playboy magazines at the check out counter - it would be one heck of an increase in impulse sales for the company. 

    It's not about rights, it's about common sense and providing an appropriate environment for your customers.



  • elbofforelboffor Posts: 2,572 Valuable Player
    How long till we have an app in home that we can use to book prostitutes via the dark web?
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  • nosys70nosys70 Posts: 466
    Art3mis
    edited January 2017

    "Shareholders care" is the best joke I heard this year...

    Yeah, Shareholders care about their money.

    If killing puppies can grab them more money, they will.

    Once it won't anymore, they will put their money into another business.


  • RorschachPhoenixRorschachPhoenix Posts: 1,594 Valuable Player
    edited January 2017
    I don't see a problem here. Only a tendency to think in extremes.
    We can talk about feminazis, PUAs and all sort of things. But that is not what the forum is all about, right? This isn't reddit or 4chan.

    One question you should always think about is: "I am the target group?"
    It seems this is not the case. So, if nobody is the target group then this type of app will fail and nobody has to see it ever again. On the other hand: If there IS a target group for that, then maybe there is a reason for it to stay.

    But there is another question that should be asked specifically when it comes to VR: "What benefits do I have using it in VR?"
    It seems to me that it adds nothing to it. And that is maybe another thing that could lead into a failure. Because why should you buy it for VR? You could also buy some normal videos.
    Excuse my bad english. I speak to you through the google translator. :P
  • tranceology3tranceology3 Posts: 804
    3Jane
    elboffor said:
    Over 400 sexual encounters!!
    I heard 398 of them were with himself
    That Rosie Palm is such a slut!
  • RorschachPhoenixRorschachPhoenix Posts: 1,594 Valuable Player
    elboffor said:
    How long till we have an app in home that we can use to book prostitutes via the dark web?
    So, today you need an app for that?
    Excuse my bad english. I speak to you through the google translator. :P
  • elbofforelboffor Posts: 2,572 Valuable Player
    edited January 2017
    Well apparently we need an app to tell us how to scam women to sleep with us, you can sign up to morons who will spout shit about how "they" did it without VR as well, so I don't see how having an app to book prostitutes for you would be any different.
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  • RorschachPhoenixRorschachPhoenix Posts: 1,594 Valuable Player
    elboffor said:
    Well apparently we need an app to tell us how to scam women to sleep with us, you can sign up to morons who will spout shit about how "they" did it without VR as well, so I don't see how having an app to book prostitutes for you would be any different.
    There are a lot of people out there telling you shit about everything. But this is something special, right? I've seen a lot of people get offended by this.

    I am sure this app will NOT tell you how to "scam women to sleep with" you or anyone else.
    Excuse my bad english. I speak to you through the google translator. :P
  • ZenbaneZenbane Posts: 14,111 Valuable Player
    Am I the only one disturbed that the Age Rating for this is 17+ ???

    :#
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  • OpticKingOpticKing Posts: 1,185
    Wintermute
    Zenbane said:
    Am I the only one disturbed that the Age Rating for this is 17+ ???

    :#
    Gotta learn how to scam teh womens early, there's many many years of failure ahead for people like this, so why not get a jump start?
  • Blyss4226Blyss4226 Posts: 549 Poster of the Week
    Just FYI to make it clear(because apparently we didn't) - Nobbs and I sort of found this together and we were posting it because THIS GUY is a scam. The type of app alone is not a problem and indeed VR could actually lend itself to this type of thing extremely well. I'm not ashamed to admit I would be the exact target audience for such an app either.

    The problem is the guy, not the type of app. Because I WOULD be the target audience, that's why it upsets me. This guy goes around claiming he's this amazing dating coach.That alone is not a problem, but just google his name "Magic Leone" and there is a host more stuff about him and his very suspicious history. He claims he can seduce any woman ever, makes outrageous claims about himself, and so on and so forth. The hallmark of a scammer.

    I would have much less of a problem if it was in the Gallery section with the not so very well curated warning(though I still wouldn't like it tbh.) But because a section like that exists, and because this is not in it, it's almost like Oculus saying "We approve of this." Is that the message you want to send?

    Furthermore why is Steam showing it as early access and Oculus not?

    Anyway that was the point we were trying to make.
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  • ZenbaneZenbane Posts: 14,111 Valuable Player
    In related news,




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  • snowdogsnowdog Posts: 6,752 Valuable Player
    edited January 2017
    elboffor said:
    Well apparently we need an app to tell us how to scam women to sleep with us, you can sign up to morons who will spout shit about how "they" did it without VR as well, so I don't see how having an app to book prostitutes for you would be any different.
    There's been an app available for that for years - it's called Alcohol  :p
    "This you have to understand. There's only one way to hurt a man who's lost everything. Give him back something broken."

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  • RorschachPhoenixRorschachPhoenix Posts: 1,594 Valuable Player
    edited January 2017
    Blyss4226 said:
    Just FYI to make it clear(because apparently we didn't) - Nobbs and I sort of found this together and we were posting it because THIS GUY is a scam. The type of app alone is not a problem and indeed VR could actually lend itself to this type of thing extremely well. I'm not ashamed to admit I would be the exact target audience for such an app either.

    The problem is the guy, not the type of app. Because I WOULD be the target audience, that's why it upsets me. This guy goes around claiming he's this amazing dating coach.That alone is not a problem, but just google his name "Magic Leone" and there is a host more stuff about him and his very suspicious history. He claims he can seduce any woman ever, makes outrageous claims about himself, and so on and so forth. The hallmark of a scammer.

    I would have much less of a problem if it was in the Gallery section with the not so very well curated warning(though I still wouldn't like it tbh.) But because a section like that exists, and because this is not in it, it's almost like Oculus saying "We approve of this." Is that the message you want to send?

    Furthermore why is Steam showing it as early access and Oculus not?

    Anyway that was the point we were trying to make.
    But what specifically makes him a "scam"?
    "He claims to be an amazing dating coach." So, what? You can do that. Maybe he is. Can you proof him wrong?
    "He has a suspicious history." What does that mean? Was he a drug dealer?
    "He claims he can seduce any woman ever." Okay. That is called (bad) advertising. Of course he is not able to seduce any woman ever. But if you're going to sell your service, you don't say: "I cannot seduce all women. But I can seduce a lot." Did you ever watched an advertising? They lie to you all the fucking time. Not one product is as good as the advertising is telling you (not even the Rift! Look at the add for Edge of Nowhere! Here: )

    So, what you tell (and everyone does that) is: "I can seduce every woman ever!"
    It is just advertising to get people hooked. And in that way every form of advertising is a bit scam, right?

    So, what is the real problem here? The real problem is that nobody can proof that person wrong. But because of his very bold exaggerated advertising statements people are convinced that he must be a scam.
    Is anyone here able to tell if the guy lies or if his skills aren't good?
    I've read a movie criticism the other day. The author of that criticism said that the movie looks like a game from the 90's. Funny. Because he has no idea what he is talking about. And why is that?
    I am not able to tell you if one car mechanic is good at his job. Why? Because I have no clue about the topic. If a car mechanic tells me, that he could repair every car in the world, I could think: "That is a bold statement. He must be a scam!" But in order to proof him wrong, I'll have to see him fail. If he is able to repair every car I give to him, that does not proof that he is right, because he still had not repaired every car in the world yet. But at least he hasn't been proven wrong so far either.
    I could not tell if a musician is good at his job. You may could tell when he is really bad, because everyone who's listen to music has some minimal form of knowledge about that topic. But I can't tell the musician how to play his instrument to make better music.
    To know if something is a lie, you need to know the truth. To know if something is bad, you know what's good.

    Let's take a look on the store text:
    Dating Lessons developed by Cerevrum Inc. is the very first VR dating training course which will give a man the skillset to build a dating life he wishes for. Men are expected to be always strong, confident and charming. But it is not easy at all! How to approach a woman? What to say to interest her? With the help of Magic Leone (www.attractionmethods.com), every man gets a chance to overcome his low-esteem or shyness. 11 lessons and 7 practical interactive sessions will give men tools to enhance their power of attraction and develop behavior patterns to handle stress and anxiety. Following these simple pieces of advice you can change your dating life forever. We realize that dating is a universal topic which concerns everyone regardless of age, gender, orientation, and citizenship. We are starting with a course for men testing a new format, looking for feedback to see whether such content packaging finds its audience. As a next step, we would like to create a course for women.
    I marked the promises. I see nothing wrong here. Nothing. Everything on the list is absolutly possible. If this app is the way to go or if there are better methods to learn those skills, that is another type of question.

    On a private note: I do think that some PUAs are really good at what they are doing. You can learn a lot if you have enough dedication and disciplin. Learning "dating" or "flirting" is just some type of "controversial education", because many people are thinking that we are born with that skill (funny enough). Of course we are learning those social skills over time by practise (or maybe not, if you are sitting at home playing video games). And if not you're lacking of it.
    I do not know if that guy is good at what he is doing. The video does look a bit cheap. So, he doesn't seem to be good at presenting his knowledge in an VR Dating app. But that does not mean he is bad at the other things.

    It is also good to recognize your own lack of knowledge or competence in the topics you aren't good at.

    That all leads to the Dunning-Kruger-Effect (which is surprisingly funny and interesting at the same time):



    P.S.: I do have some knowledge on that topic. But I am not that good in english, especially at grammar. So, it took me about 3 hours to write this text. My friend the google translater is also bad at english I guess. But he would never admit. Cheers!
    Excuse my bad english. I speak to you through the google translator. :P
  • ZenbaneZenbane Posts: 14,111 Valuable Player
    I found that one App trying to charge money to cure a persons spider phobia to be more of a scam than this. You cant even have sex with a spider...
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  • OpticKingOpticKing Posts: 1,185
    Wintermute
    I personally agree with the OP. It seems just like a shot in the dark trying to cash grab from hopeless vr nerds (I can see people assuming anyone who uses vr regularly to be the stereotypical WoW guy from south park.) 10$ for this... "you want to touch the penis, yes?" stuff. That's a scam in my book. I'm not saying oculus needs to put EVERY game/app under a magnifier, but let's at least notice when we're being walked on by someone who's attempting to take advantage of "socially awkward nerds".

    Just my 2c.
  • ZenbaneZenbane Posts: 14,111 Valuable Player
    When is, "Yes", never the answer to that question?
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