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Will We See a CV2

TC1999TC1999 Posts: 179
Art3mis
edited October 2017 in General

So after watching OC4 I’m left with a very worrying thought “Is facebook more interested in creating a hardware that supports their social media structure then continuing to push the boundaries of high end pc based VR”

When facebook brought Oculus this was a fear that many expressed and now I’m wondering if this is now the case.

I love my rift having brought it a month after launch and with touch it’s given me lots of enjoyment. When I first saw Palmer Lucky talk about VR and the kickstarter campaign it was inspiring, especially for a long-term gamer like me.

When facebook brought Oculus, Touch and the current Rift where already well under development with the principals for both units in place.  

So why am I worried that we will not see a CV2.

OC4 starts with Zuckerberg saying he wants 1 billion in VR. Well that’s never going to happen from high end pc based VR. This only leaves low end low friction based VR. With the announcement of Oculus Go this fits that perfectly. Essentially a personal VR media viewer that will work well for all types of media from watching films, youtube, internet browsing and social media viewing.

Don’t get me wrong I love the idea of Go and have been waiting for standalone VR devise that is cheap and easy to use to watch films and do exactly what this will do, and I will buy one. Oculus Go is great to achieve this and to spread the idea of VR as well as Oculus brand awareness.

However does this new venture depart the focus aware from leading edge VR for enthusiastic PC gamers?

Zuckerberg has expressed disappointment that VR adoption has not grown as quick as they would have liked and I wonder if this is a small insight to what they really now want to do.

Yes VR adoption has not grown as fast as they would have liked but hang on a second what kind of adoption is truly possible for current VR.

Gaming right now is the natural fit for VR but VR is not a natural fit for gamers on a large scale. My great nephew is 13 and he plays games all day long if he could, either on his phone or on his xbox. For him gaming is either quick and easy or a way to talk to his friends online. He is not interested in great graphics, story lines or immersive gameplay, he wants awards, quick arena matches, collecting stuff and so on. He has GTA 5 and has never done a mission for him it’s about his friends meeting up and playing the game the way they want to. I asked him “is this how all your friends play games” and he said “yes”.

He has tried my rift but gets bored very quickly one because he’s not interested in playing a game for the game, his friends are not in it and the learning curve is more than he is prepared to put in to adapt to it. Maybe he is a lazy 13 year old, but aren’t most 13 year olds and this is the age group the current gaming industry is focused on.

So who is VR right now for, well I would say the older gamer who one has the money to spend, enjoys solo driven game or has a strong narrative, into sims and is willing to take the time to adapt to VR, that is not a large game base for mass VR adoption. As Palmer Lucky has said VR is for a subset of a subset of a subset.

So with this knowledge and sales feedback If I was the owner of a mass media platform and want to promote that platform high end VR would not be the way to go, low end low friction mass adoption would be my choice. Leading back to sadly again no CV2.

What else points to facebook moving away from high cost leading edge VR, what Carmack said in his talks and Q&A.

Firstly he said in his talk that almost made me shout was “if Go tanks then Oculus will focus back to predominantly high end PC VR” WHAT are you saying that Oculus focus is no longer on advancing PC VR. If that is true than it is very sad news for all VR enthusiasts who see Oculus as the leading light in VR. Also in a Q&A he talked about they have lenses that can achieve 140 degree view but are not using them.

In OC4 there was very little talk about continue funding for VR titles in fact no talk about funding. And there was no really big titles being showed for next year. So we have Marvel Powers United and possible Respawn doing something but we have no news on that. Not Very Encouraging.

Santa Cruz looks good but it’s not high end VR. I want high end VR, where is my leading edge in visual fidelity and FOV VR, Oculus?.

NOT COMING GUYS NOT COMING.

Price drop to £399 had to be done because very soon Vive and Rift will have inferior speks to upcoming HMD’s.

Samsung Odyssey is coming and yes the tracking is not going to be perfect but it will have better ergonomics and visual fidelity. When anybody tries my rift the first things they say is “it looks fuzzy, I don’t like the binocular look and it feels uncomfortable on my face”, don’t get me wrong they are also very impressed but it’s not enough.

So please oculus move towards the halo fit and get rid of the baseball camp fit. Bump up the screen and lenses.

This is what Samsung have done, don’t get left behind.  

So I hope the £399 is to clear stocks so that maybe just maybe a bumped up rift is coming.

Rift will even be lesser in visual fidelity then the $199 GO that’s mad and the media will have a field day with it.

The GO will have higher visuals and better lenses then the Rift, even Carmack said that the new LCD screens has more net gains now then OLED.

I wonder if these screens are the same as the ones Pimax are going to use?

Lastly the coming update for Home with Dash looks great and really looking forward to it. Please oculus let us know you are still committed to high end PC driven VR because this update is maybe a prelude benefit for GO and Santa Cruz.

I would have like to have seen some news about what Oculus is working on for higher FOV, better lenses, better fidelity, and better ergonomics. Even if this was not happening strait away and was coming down the pipe as Oculus did in OC3 last year with Santa Cruz, this would have created a buzz for VR on PC.

The silence is deafening

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Comments

  • ZenbaneZenbane Posts: 12,243 Power Poster

    The software is what will currently push the boundaries of Gen 1 PCVR. I love my Rift and I'm happy with many of my VR experiences over the last 17 months. However, nothing has really pushed those boundaries yet. The software hasn't even come close to making the hardware obsolete. And that's how it works in the Info Tech world.

    Even if a CV2 was offered right now, unless there is software to justify the upgrade then I wouldn't bother. It's not a problem limited to OH either, the software issue increases 10-fold when we look at Steam VR offerings.

    Oculus is still very much committed to high-end PCVR, and they said that 2019 is most likely the time for a CV2. I agree with that assessment.
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  • TC1999TC1999 Posts: 179
    Art3mis
    Yep totally agree with you, I would just have liked a little tease of whats to come.

    In terms of software yep it all works great and with a little more visual fidelity, and FOV this would only enhance the current software. From what I understand open vr and rift sdk can work with 140 degree FOV beyond that it gets more difficult and the screen has to be stretched without correction. This is what pimax is doing from what I understand. 

    Carmack said Oculus do have lenses that can do 140 FOV, man that would be great as I am now getting a little tired of the binocular effect. 

    I suppose I'm being a bit of a "Are We There Yet" and want the halo fit, 2k per eye, 140 FOV now or at least know it's on the way. 

    OC4 left me disappointed in some ways and excited in others. 




  • ZenbaneZenbane Posts: 12,243 Power Poster

    I'd say we are between 12-15 months before real talks of a CV2 start to come out. That's not too bad. I'm still waiting for the first big VR MMORPG!
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  • dburnedburne Posts: 1,623
    Project 2501
    I don't think Oculus is abandoning it at all, I think they have a plan for the next generation along with a timeline. Obviously it will probably require a little more powerful CPU and GPU's over what we currently have as well.

    Patience can be a good thing. In the meantime I am enjoying the heck out of my Rift.
    Don

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  • logotomielogotomie Posts: 33
    Brain Burst
    While i agree that software is underwhelming, i don't agree on that there is no reason for new hardware. I would pay 600 now for a CV2 with higher res/no pentile/better fill display, ideally also with increased fov. And no that does not require more hardware, less oversampling or even upscaling would be fine.
    Maybe i am more sensitive then others, but i can easier overlook the upscaling and veil effect of PSVR then the pentile pattern i see in CV1
  • MradrMradr Posts: 2,705 Valuable Player
    edited October 2017
    Zenbane said:

    I'd say we are between 12-15 months before real talks of a CV2 start to come out. That's not too bad. I'm still waiting for the first big VR MMORPG!
    I dont think we will see a VR MMORPG for a while. At least 4 years after CV2... sadly xD but it will come:)) Well at the level we will want it to be anyways. Sure, they can add VR to any current MMORPG - but a real design base one wont be for a while because of the required AI support. The current GPUs being release right now (10s and vega) are design to help jump start that and in 2018 with the release of their 11s and whatever AMD releases will be focus on it. 
  • snowdogsnowdog Posts: 5,327 Power Poster
    Oculus aren't talking about the CV2 yet because this generation is under 2 years old so far. It's way too early. We'll hear about the CV2 plans at OC5 for launch in 2019/2020.
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  • ZenbaneZenbane Posts: 12,243 Power Poster
    edited October 2017
    logotomie said:
    While i agree that software is underwhelming, i don't agree on that there is no reason for new hardware. I would pay 600 now for a CV2 with higher res/no pentile/better fill display, ideally also with increased fov. And no that does not require more hardware

    Higher Res and FoV wouldn't require a graphics card upgrade? What are you running now?

    No doubt that some people enjoy throwing away $600, but most people would rather put that money towards something more meaningful. We can take the best of the best VR experiences, and none of them get dramatically better by increasing Res and FoV. Certainly not $600 worth of hardware better.

    The reason everyone keeps dropping their VR prices (HTC, Oculus) is because the cost of entry is still too high. It's the same reason that PlayStation quickly sold more VR HMD's than both the Vive and Rift: console-VR is cheaper.

    So anyone bragging about being so willing to spend another $600 on another PCVR HMD is going against critical industry pricepoints. And when it comes to what is really happening in the industry (not just the few exceptions that like to throw money away), the software needs to drive the hardware.
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  • RonsonPLRonsonPL Posts: 1,114
    Trinity
    Oculus dropped PC VR long time ago. They were supposed to drive it, push it forward. They definitely are not interested in that anymore since FB acquisition. It was obvious years ago, when it turned out that their "best, thanx to the dedication of pushing PCVR as much as possible and thanx to the Samsung deal" turned out to be not much more than 1080p OLED screen with PenTile matrix, while budget oriented PSVR managed to get RGB. 
    Then we had the release with a joypad. Touch delay. Let's not bring back the original date planned for the release.
    The quality of the software on PC side also pointed towards that since a long time.

    CV2 will probably happen, but with no dedication. Look at Valve and their Vive.
    So, when everything is already there (displays, prices etc.) Oculus will regoin, while for now, they will simply allow the competition to overpass them. It's really sad that some we have to look at StarVR Pimax hand-on reviews to get quotes like those (about wide FOV HMDs):

    As soon as I put on the headset, I was amazed by the lack of black border within my vision. For the first time ever, I finally felt like I wasn't looking into a VR headset! "
    or
     "whole new level of experience". 

    Until real hardware becomes available, people won't understand. You can have a great example of how people might have absolutely no clue about what proper PCVR means and how it could be shaped both in terms of what's possible and in terms of business model. 

    Zenbane said:
    We can take the best of the best VR experiences, and none of them get dramatically better by increasing Res and FoV. Certainly not $600 worth of hardware better.

    So anyone bragging about being so willing to spend another $600 on another PCVR HMD is going against critical industry pricepoints.
    See? Compare what Zenbane wrote to what's said by people who actually had the chance to compare, and you see the problem. So many people think that when you make a game, it has to be Call of Duty. It has to be great cash grab, 12 year old kids must like it, and it has to bring billions every year, otherwise it's not worth the effort. Sorry to steal Jim Sterling's example here, but what can I say. It was a damn good example. Same with everything. What's happening now is the false assumption that only market which matters is the mass market, only group of people worth targetting is the biggest group of people. Meanwhile we had gaming industry 20 years ago which was doing pretty damn fine without having to sell 20 million of copies to make profit. The false assumption is that it cannot happen again. And what high quality VR is capable of in terms of creating unique market, is absolutely huge, yet so many people are unable to see it. That's why statements like that above are totally wrong. It doesn't matter what were the "industry pricepoints". Industry never had VR before. It's like saying that "better displays in a phone aren't beneficial to anyone" in 1998. Why would people pay more for a cellphone just to get better display for their SMS messages? Fast forward and suddenly millions of people pay 300$ for their phones instead of 40$ for another device offered in the same store, which also allows for phone calls and SMSes. 

    +50% FOV. Huge improvements in SDE, PPD, good blacks and details in blacks. Big investments in at least a few really big game titles. This is what should be aimed at and this is what should get a lot of effort to make it happen as soon as possible instead of (what happens now) just waiting until it somehow aligns all the puzzles by itself (which means 5-10 years lost). Sure, it doesn't matter for people who plan to be able to enjoy VR games 30 years from now. Not so great for those of us, who dream about VR since The Lawmower Man ignited the first VR craze.
    I wrote over a year ago that Valve doesn't look like PCVR's savior. I was right. Now I will write that Oculus is not the company to put all your hopes in, when you hope for proper quality (and scale in terms of software being released) PC VR.

    But eventually consoles will get something faster than tablet CPU.
    Eventually microdisplays, micro-LEDs, curved OLEDs, and maybe even specifically tailored for VR crappy LCDs appear in some of the devices. Eventually someone will realize the potential. Eventually something will start to move. Maybe it will be forever crawling, maybe we'll add more and more years to the "we lost this" count. But maybe the huge PCVR boom will happen. Now this hurra-optimistic scenario can happen in 2019-2020 instead of 2017, so I think PCVR enthusiasts are facing a really boring year or two. Unless something with proper FOV and resolution comes up first in a meaningful shape (tracking, price adequate to what the hardware offers, a way to reach more than 1000 gamers etc.).

    I don't know what to think about MS. They struggle to understand who core gamer or gaming is so they might be just dumb and don't want to go into VR with their Xbox X. But maybe it's the opposite? Maybe they don't want to poison the well and plan something only after the minimum quality acceptable by gamers is there? So maybe Xbox 4 released in 2019-20 with proper power and dedicated 140+°FOV and 4K displays?
    2019-20 are packed. Most likely new consoles from both MS and Sony, very likely RAM prices drop (faster graphics cards for less, especially in mid-high and high-end range, cause top of the line GDDR6 and HBM 2econo and HMB3 won't be cheap). Besides that a whole bunch of display technologies. New Displayport and HDMI 2.1 available in older (by then) hardware. New production process for CPUs. It might all align just well enough to allow the big jump.
    But for now. At least for a year, most likely 2, and way more if I'm (yet again) too optimistic, PCVR is burried, I'm afraid.
    Not an Oculus hater, but not a fan anymore.
    Still lots of respect for the team-Carmack, Abrash.
    Oculus is driven by big corporation principles now. That brings painful effects already, more to come in the future. This is not the Oculus I once cheered for.
  • flexy123flexy123 Posts: 781 Poster of the Week
    snowdog said:
    It's way too early. We'll hear about the CV2 plans at OC5 for launch in 2019/2020.
    Explain to me how a lone Chinese company on Kickstarter then pulls it off?
    What is "too early"? fb has BILLIONS. The Chinese can churn out a 5k and a "8k" right now, and facebook/Oculus can't? Really? Don't get me wrong! I know VERY WELL why Oculus does what they are doing right now, but don't expect me to get all gaga over "Go" and super-casual VR for the masses. I entirely agree with the OP.

    I had wished just one little mention of CV2..rather than endless hype about Android-based portable VR. This has its place, but it's not EXCITING.
  • ZenbaneZenbane Posts: 12,243 Power Poster
    RonsonPL said:
    Oculus dropped PC VR long time ago. T

    Nope, they didn't. I actually own one and the dedication to it by Facebook and Oculus has been stellar.


    RonsonPL said:
    CV2 will probably happen, but with no dedication. Look at Valve and their Vive.


    Well the CV2 won't be made by non-humans, so it will take some dedication. I don't know what fantasy world you live in where products are designed without any human dedication at all, but we are living in that sci-fi reality just yet, skippy.

    Comparing Oculus to Valve/Vive makes zero sense. They are a failed competitor that seems to have gotten everything wrong. You have more in common with the Vive via your posting style than Facebook has with their tech strategies.
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  • kojackkojack Posts: 4,636 Volunteer Moderator
    flexy123 said:
    snowdog said:
    It's way too early. We'll hear about the CV2 plans at OC5 for launch in 2019/2020.
    Explain to me how a lone Chinese company on Kickstarter then pulls it off?
    Except they haven't.
    They've made promises and have shown a few different prototypes that keep changing, but they haven't actually shipped a finished product yet (talking about the kickstarter 5k/8k/8k x, not the 4k that wasn't kickstarted). They are currently at the same stage as Sixense was during their Stem kickstarter.
    I'm not saying it's going to drag out for years like Stem, but it's too early to say they are pulling off or churning out anything when no consumer has received one and the kickstarter isn't even finished yet.

  • ZenbaneZenbane Posts: 12,243 Power Poster
    edited October 2017
    flexy123 said:
    snowdog said:
    It's way too early. We'll hear about the CV2 plans at OC5 for launch in 2019/2020.
    Explain to me how a lone Chinese company on Kickstarter then pulls it off?
    What is "too early"? fb has BILLIONS. The Chinese can churn out a 5k and a "8k" right now, and facebook/Oculus can't? Really? Don't get me wrong! I know VERY WELL why Oculus does what they are doing right now, but don't expect me to get all gaga over "Go" and super-casual VR for the masses. I entirely agree with the OP.

    I had wished just one little mention of CV2..rather than endless hype about Android-based portable VR. This has its place, but it's not EXCITING.

    Having billions is great, but unless they use those billions to build a real working Time Machine, then we all gotta wait for real-time progress to take place. These "chinese" folks you are referring to didn't build their own platform and fund their own suite of games. Oculus and Facebook did. The billions Facebook is spending is going somewhere, it's simply going to more than just gaming and hardware. Updates and innovation have to be strategic. You can't spray your money all over peoples faces and expect magic to happen lol

    If you want to see what happens when a company thinks that "having billions" is an auto-win, then check out HTC's progress.
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  • BeastyBaiterBeastyBaiter Posts: 758 Poster of the Week
    Ronson isn't totally off base. There really isn't anything stopping Facebook from dropping in a pair of screens with much higher resolution. Facebook simply does not want to do that at this time. There are valid reasons for not doing so right now (system requirements and cost being big ones) but not doing so does leave them in serious danger of getting left behind.

    Moving from now till the end of 2018, I think we'll see the Rift move from the high end to the mid range VR market. The price is now at $400 for the full kit, which seems mid-priced to me for such a device. If Pimax can actually deliver (bit of an if there), I can see them taking up the high end mantle along with Samsung while the Rift/Vive/WVR's make up the middle ground. PSVR and any other console headsets will be on the low end, as consoles are and always have been. And mobile is its own thing of course, I think there is a lot of money in it but it is a separate market.
  • ZenbaneZenbane Posts: 12,243 Power Poster
    edited October 2017
    Ronson isn't totally off base. There really isn't anything stopping Facebook from dropping in a pair of screens with much higher resolution. Facebook simply does not want to do that at this time. There are valid reasons for not doing so right now (system requirements and cost being big ones) but not doing so does leave them in serious danger of getting left behind.


    Just "dropping" them in? Like... send someone to your house and just drop the new screens in your headset? lol

    There's pricing, logistics, manufacturing, distribution. Complex stuff for some folks I suppose.

    Oculus just won 2 VR Awards in 2017, I'm not sure what danger you speak of nor who you think will leave them behind, but all that talk is pure fantasy at this point.


    BeastyBaiter said:
    Moving from now till the end of 2018, I think we'll see the Rift move from the high end to the mid range VR market.

    And what gave away that insight? The fact that the Rift is permanently $399 or that Oculus Go is priced at $199?

    What people call "high-end" will simply refer to beastly VR rigs that enthusiasts decide to build. But there's no real reason a headset should cost over $500 again anytime soon. The market itself is at mid-range now.

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  • danknugzdanknugz Posts: 1,987
    3Jane
    i sure hope not cause lets face it, CV1 kind of blows
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  • snowdogsnowdog Posts: 5,327 Power Poster
    flexy123 said:
    snowdog said:
    It's way too early. We'll hear about the CV2 plans at OC5 for launch in 2019/2020.
    Explain to me how a lone Chinese company on Kickstarter then pulls it off?
    What is "too early"? fb has BILLIONS. The Chinese can churn out a 5k and a "8k" right now, and facebook/Oculus can't? Really? Don't get me wrong! I know VERY WELL why Oculus does what they are doing right now, but don't expect me to get all gaga over "Go" and super-casual VR for the masses. I entirely agree with the OP.

    I had wished just one little mention of CV2..rather than endless hype about Android-based portable VR. This has its place, but it's not EXCITING.

    Good grief, it really isn't complicated. It's too early for both Oculus and HTC to release a second generation headset BECAUSE THIS GENERATION ISN'T EVEN TWO YEARS OLD. If either one of those two companies release a second generation headset next year they will end up alienating the majority of their customers that have bought their first generation device. Why would you buy a second generation device when you'll only get 2 years use out of it before the next generation comes out?

    Three-five years is the sweet spot. That's why the world and his wife are expecting the second gen headsets from Oculus and HTC in 2019/2020.

    Pimax don't have this problem because hardly ANYBODY bought their first generation product, because it was a pile of old pants only useful for watching films on. If their second generation headset is successful and sells a shitload they'll end up waiting at least three years before releasing their third generation headset for the same reason.

    As for @RonsonPL I'm convinced he's either more than a little insane or on drugs...or maybe a bit of both lol

    To say that the quality of the software that Oculus have released so far isn't good enough is completely ridiculous. The vast majority of software they've released has been of AAA quality and they've spent $500m funding it.
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  • TC1999TC1999 Posts: 179
    Art3mis
    I want to believe, I want to believe Oculus I really do that your are still commited to PCVR. 

    Many of of the questions and concerns here, have been repeated in most of the tech media. Even tested found it odd no tease of a cv2. 

    And what's the filming ban all about, Tested can not show any of thier interviews vie video or audio welcome to the control state, great work Facebook. 

    Going from prototype to manufacturing in china is quick DK2 went from single finished prototype to full manufacturing run in a day. 

    Holding the faith 
  • TC1999TC1999 Posts: 179
    Art3mis
    I know palmer is no longer around but him and others at oculus said when the CV1 was launched when asked about the life cycle that it would be longer than mobile but considerable shorter then console. Most interpreted this as 24 to 36 months. Since CV1 launch gpu power has increased two fold, we can now buy 12 core cpu and screen technology as improved and reduced in cost. Also with single pass stereo imaging becoming standard, single shade techniques the potential cpu, gpu strain has reduced buy upto 60%. 

    Im not respecting a cv2 next year but hints this year would have been nice with final product being shown oc5 shipping early 2019. 
  • snowdogsnowdog Posts: 5,327 Power Poster
    Mobile phone contracts these days tend to be 2 years, the console lifecycle these days is completely screwed because all platform holders apart from Nintendo appear to be releasing .5 versions of their previous consoles (the PS4 Pro and the Xbox One X). Console lifecycles used to be around 5 years long so it's reasonable to assume that this generation will last 2-5 years. That's why everyone thinks that this VR generation will last 3-5 years.

    Now you'll see Pimax launching their second generation headset sooner than that but the main players won't release their second gen headsets until 2019/2020.
    "This you have to understand. There's only one way to hurt a man who's lost everything. Give him back something broken."

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  • ZenbaneZenbane Posts: 12,243 Power Poster
    TC1999 said:
    I want to believe, I want to believe Oculus I really do that your are still commited to PCVR. 

    Many of of the questions and concerns here, have been repeated in most of the tech media. Even tested found it odd no tease of a cv2. 

    And what's the filming ban all about, Tested can not show any of thier interviews vie video or audio welcome to the control state, great work Facebook. 

    Going from prototype to manufacturing in china is quick DK2 went from single finished prototype to full manufacturing run in a day. 

    Holding the faith 

    How well did constant hardware upgrades work out for HTC? And what VR Software titles specifically are you holding your faith for? There must be some Software that will take full advantage of bigger Res and Fov to the point that you feel the need to keep the faith, so what is it?

    I know what it was for Vivarians: Onward. That didn't help the company recoup 27 months of financial loss though.
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  • ZenbaneZenbane Posts: 12,243 Power Poster
    Beautifully stated @Storm_Cloud.

    Threads like this are basically chastising Facebook and Oculus for not falling for troll bait lol
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  • MradrMradr Posts: 2,705 Valuable Player
    edited October 2017
    I think most of us didn't want to see a final product - but more of a crystal cove of what we saw with CV1. A prototype of what they're working on for CV2 and a path idea of what they are looking into going forward a bit:) Agree- technology has almost doubled in terms of hardware from when CV1 was release and that helps going forward, but there are still large problems going forward as not everyone jumps onto the newest stuff and or has the money. I understand why they are releasing Oculus GO and the other one - but just seems a bit silly not at least demoing out a little bit of the higher end stuff they're looking at:)
  • RoasterRoaster Posts: 1,050
    3Jane
    I think we'll see what the market wants with the onslaught of WMR headsets. Like it or not, MS gives a legitimacy to the idea of VR that will bring in some otherwise non enthusiasts.
    I think HTC was left behind because there were better phones available, maybe just camera specs, and the same will happen to Oculus. Yes, Oculus is the new HTC.
    Zenbane, don't kill yourself. 

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  • ZenbaneZenbane Posts: 12,243 Power Poster
    edited October 2017
    Roaster said:
    I think we'll see what the market wants with the onslaught of WMR headsets. Like it or not, MS gives a legitimacy to the idea of VR that will bring in some otherwise non enthusiasts.
    I think HTC was left behind because there were better phones available, maybe just camera specs, and the same will happen to Oculus. Yes, Oculus is the new HTC.
    Zenbane, don't kill yourself. 


    HTC didn't have the content, Oculus did. Everything in OH is what kept HTC lagging behind since the Steam VR offerings just couldn't keep up. Plus, HTC kept upgrading their hardware while also dangling talks of even more hardware upgrades. What's the point of upgrading a thing now when that thing is going to be replaced soon anyway?

    Facebook is busy dropping the price of both high-end and mid-range VR, so it wouldn't make sense to showcase the next CV2 just yet: that would directly work against the current marketing strategy.

    If Facebook would have unveiled CV2 plans, then this would be all the current headlines:
    "Facebook wastes time talking about Santa Cruz and Oculus Go to trick consumers in to buying a product that will become obsolete the moment they release the Rift 2."

    The reasoning behind the avoidance of "Rift 2" discussions is very sound; there are just too many people in the world that would use Rift 2 discussions against Facebook's Santa Cruz and Oculus Go plans. So when looking for someone to blame for the lack of CV2 news... point at the average consumer and the authors of clickbait articles.
    Are you a fan of the Myst games? Check out my Mod at http://www.mystrock.com/
    Catch me on Twitter: twitter.com/zenbane
  • RoasterRoaster Posts: 1,050
    3Jane
    Santa Cruz and Go may be really bad ideas that are being crammed down your throat.  They have a market though, and it's not the high-quality enthusiast.
    Yes a CV-2 would take away from their potential, and that is how it should be. Do you want a Go, or is it just a good marketing decision for Facebook? It's not for me.
    i7-5820K @ 4.2Ghz, water cooled, Asus X99-Pro USB 3.1, 48 Gb DDR4 2400, Samsung 950 pro M.2 SSD, GTX 980 Ti SC, 750w psu
  • ZenbaneZenbane Posts: 12,243 Power Poster
    edited October 2017
    Roaster said:
    Santa Cruz and Go may be really bad ideas that are being crammed down your throat.  They have a market though, and it's not the high-quality enthusiast.
    Yes a CV-2 would take away from their potential, and that is how it should be. Do you want a Go, or is it just a good marketing decision for Facebook? It's not for me.

    This comment comes from the point-of-view of a VR Gamer, not a business trying to make VR mainstream "for everyone."

    You say that Cruz and Go are being "crammed down our throat" but you forget that for the past year what was crammed down everyone's throat (including the throats of Facebook, Oculus, HTC, Valve) is that the price of quality VR is "too high." Cruz and Go are answering that call, but it is inevitable that a new group of complainers will rise up to cram something else down everyone's throat: "PCVR is abandoned 'cause no CV2 news."

    An organization like this is damned if they do, and damned if they don't. I know full well that Facebook and Oculus have not even come close to abandoning the PCVR market, and I am fully aware that a CV2 is in the works. If people want to complain because CV2 wasn't covered at OC4 then that's fine. At least it is only one thread/conversation so far instead of the multitude that spammed this forum, reddit, and facebook from April 2016 til April 2017; and those complaints were about the high cost of VR.

    Now that facebook has helped silence one group of complainers, I'm sure they will get to work on silencing the next.
    ;)
    Are you a fan of the Myst games? Check out my Mod at http://www.mystrock.com/
    Catch me on Twitter: twitter.com/zenbane
  • RoasterRoaster Posts: 1,050
    3Jane
    I am fully aware that a CV2 is in the works

    Do tell!
    i7-5820K @ 4.2Ghz, water cooled, Asus X99-Pro USB 3.1, 48 Gb DDR4 2400, Samsung 950 pro M.2 SSD, GTX 980 Ti SC, 750w psu
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