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How close are we to deep dive/full immersion VR ?
Obsessed_With_Gaming
Posts: 1 NerveGear
in General
Will it happen within our lifetime ( in 20-50 years)?
By using Elon Musk's Neuralink (Neural Lace 2039???) ,NerveGear, nanobots, mind uploading maybe?
And if we were to achieve this would anyone still want to live in the real world apart from people who are maintaining the system and certain religious groups?(or at least take breaks from full dive VR)
And is this inevitable?
By using Elon Musk's Neuralink (Neural Lace 2039???) ,NerveGear, nanobots, mind uploading maybe?
And if we were to achieve this would anyone still want to live in the real world apart from people who are maintaining the system and certain religious groups?(or at least take breaks from full dive VR)
And is this inevitable?
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You could change your colleges avatars to kitties. And you will save time on way to work.
Full dive isn't necessary anyway. People need to understand that Virtual Reality is not a replacement of reality. It's a middle step between virtual worlds and the real one. As a computing technology, it will stick to audiovisual and haptics, and does not need to go further.
It's not forbidden to dream, of course ^^, but don't take fantasies as realistic expectations. Full dive is just that : a fantasy. It's very cool in the movies, but seeing it as the future of VR will only bring the real VR down.
My hopes for VR next gen:
- Full Body Tracking. Come on, Oculus!
- Eye tracking with foveated rendering. Must reduce the power needs!
- More big-scale games. I need a true VRMMORPG!
- Bigger community.
"If you don't mind, do you want me to take you there? Where dreams come true."
In the next 25 years:
1) We will have figured out a way to increase pixel count to a point you can't see them and with soo many it will be hard to know if you are looking at a real wall or a fake one (8k res with 16k upscaling or more).
2) We will have feedback systems that will recreate temperature and touch for our hands for both input and more realism.
3) We will have switch from LCD or very close to switching from them into eye focus projections.
4) Glasses style VR will be a thing instead of the bulky design we have now. I say - at least 75% smaller than they are now at least.
5) We will have flat lenses that will allow us to take away bulk - smaller designs - increase FOV - and adjustable focal points.
6) Focal points will be a thing along with Eye tracking and FOVA rendering.
7) Built in hardware that revivales computer hardware (it might come in a box instead you strap to your side).
8) Inside out tracking - allowing us to have freedoms that current static tracking doesn't allow
9) Early ideas on how we can move and do things without having to have a controller anymore
10) Increase FOV to a point it matches or closes matches your current FOV. There will be people saying it goes over their current eye rotations and others saying they still see black boxes if they move their eyes in a direction.
11) We will have figure out a way to track your mouth for avator usage. With eye tracking - we will also use that for aviators too. Taking this one step more - possible just scan your full face before you put it on.
12) AR with VR will be a thing - VR will support AR elements that will allow passthrough gaming and sight so will not want have to take it off as much.
13) With scale - we will instead be doing 1 - 1.5 - 2 - 2.5 - 3 - 3.5 - 4. The .5 are refreshes that include the newest tech but may not include new designs. Time between refreshes will be something in the 3-4 year range enough time for them to release a new HMD on every level - PCVR - Basic VR - Mobile VR. The idea here is that they will move features up focusing/squeezing as much performance as they can from the lowest device (micro optimizing) and applying that to the highest.
https://www.allaboutvision.com/conditions/bionic-eyes.htm
I quote: "the current implant has only 60 electrodes. To see naturally, you'd need about a million."
In order to get only one "VR eye" you would need about a million electrodes. Double that to get the full view in full dive. Then, count how much you would need for touch, temp, taste and everything else.
Now give me the price of the whole system. I know one electrode is very cheap, but millions of it? Plus the cost of the surgery operation?
It's simply not a viable solution, hence it won't happen.
For example, in the case of the sight, the current system (one screen in front of each eye) can already give you a proper result without the need of any surgery. Once the current issues have been resolved (resolution, FOV and lenses), VR systems will already give a proper sight in VR without any surgery.
My hopes for VR next gen:
- Full Body Tracking. Come on, Oculus!
- Eye tracking with foveated rendering. Must reduce the power needs!
- More big-scale games. I need a true VRMMORPG!
- Bigger community.
"If you don't mind, do you want me to take you there? Where dreams come true."
One way would have it resets itself over and over creating a image out of scan lines instead of raw input data. Do this fast enough - it wouldn't require half of what it take to recreate that image. What - 240 times? Cut that number in half if you up your grid array to double and then you can shut it down to 120 fps. Granted I am just using numbers here as I don't know how much resolution an eye can really see to how many electroids it takes to get a line, but the idea would still hold true for such a thing to happen in.
True - but the idea here is that it was possible to read and write back to the brain. A feed back system instead doesn't require writing to the brain and instead uses our hardware (such as skin) and recreates pressures and textures of an object that our brains (along with sight) will think it's touching an object. One way to do this is to use our own senor hardware like nerves and touch to recreate the idea in our brains.
Send the right signals down our nervous system (won't require surgery) you can recreate a rock in your hand. Not saying this is easy work here - but it is possible. On the other hand - the question - is this right - might come up. Meaning the technology might come along - but delay longer than it would normally to make sure it comes into the right age of such a technology of power. Sometimes slow and study does win the race lol.
It takes them extra time to find out the correct sizes of imperial/metric and then try to find the parts locally is a nightmare.
Surely, it is far greater to simply miss out a generation of tech (whatever it maybe circa) then widely accept a manufacturing standard to stick with it. This is a modern day problem of a throw-away society. I could only dream of a world in which everything is compatible and parts are available!
San Junipero
Don't read about it before hand as you'll spoil it. Just watch it (guaranteed you will love it) and tell me if your perspective is challenged.They said we would need surgery to use computers? Then they were damn wrong, lol.
I get your point: tech keeps improving to some extent, never say never, I know all that. In that case, that point simply doesn't apply as I'm not saying the tech is not feasible (okay, I did say the words "not possible" once, my bad, I take them back xD). I'm saying it will always be unpractical and that the current system will be just as immersive anyway.
Again, I'll give the example of sight.
- You could have surgery to get bionic eyes that can give you true sight in a VR world.
- OR you can just use the current VR system, that will give you just as good a sight without the need for any surgery. There's a clear winner here.
About the computers 100 years ago, what they did say is it would never take off if it kept the size of a big room. And they were right: computers took off because they got practical as they kept getting smaller and more powerful. The same for cellphones: the first generations were so big and not portable, so they didn't sell well. Then, they got smaller and this is what made them go mainstream.
As for this full dive solution, it will simply never be practical as you simply can't avoid surgery and the millions of electrodes. Hence, it will never happen.
And we're just talking of the tech side here. There's also the human side. The very fact that it requires surgery makes it not a viable solution for most people. Every surgery comes with a risk, and when we're talking about the brain, every risk is lethal or, at best, can make you mentally defective. It would be a shame to drool on your knees for the rest of your life just because a non-required surgery went wrong, don't you think?
Personally, as much as I love VR, even if Oculus themselves were to release a full dive tech, I certainly wouldn't take it if that required tempering with my body.
My hopes for VR next gen:
- Full Body Tracking. Come on, Oculus!
- Eye tracking with foveated rendering. Must reduce the power needs!
- More big-scale games. I need a true VRMMORPG!
- Bigger community.
"If you don't mind, do you want me to take you there? Where dreams come true."
Also, there may be a future where humans start to diverse with logic driven biological or technological evolution. It might be common place one day for a percent of the population to just get cybernetic implants from a early age. Of course there would have to be near 0% failure rates. The thing is, it's hard to comprehend how fast technology advances will be in 20years. We won't be using current tools and methods, We will have tools that speed up anything we are researching on a order of magnitude that is hard to imagine compared to current process. We are also just started a AI revolution(over next 10-20years) akin to previous industry revolutions but on a much faster scale. We won't see the sudden jumps until generation 3 VR devices, But from there on out, that is really when things will get nuts. 100-200 years for full brain read and writing is far too conservative IMO
http://www.gaming-disorder.com/
We need a REAL holodeck style tech.
https://uploadvr.com/electrical-nose-stimulation-could-let-you-smell-anything-vr/
If they are for real - than this will be deployable over night as this is one key area where VR would shine above all other ways to take in media. I say this feature alone would draw in thousands of people and give way to new ways we take pictures (image + smells) of places we been and seen.
Though can't lie xD having rods up my nose sounds a bit unpleasant, but I guess long as I can breath - having the ability to smell a rose can't be all that bad xD - maybe?
I don't believe it for a second
ah the possibilities.......
Bollocks to that. VR is the only way I can get close to naked ladies without the use of chloroform.
Thomas Covenant, Unbeliever
Replacement for Haptic Suit/Surgical Implants
Full suit (except head, of course) with small built in balloons to make pressure or touch sensation. It would be like mini reusable airbags that get activated by the computer program that reads physical touch. Even though this won’t allow pain you could feel if someone or something is simply touching you. Shooting RPGs would require something more advanced. The device (headset) will also carry some pressure sensors to ensure the device is being used. If not the system will shut down after a 10 minute wait time.
Movement
If we can read the waves we can set it up to only read movement and can activate the sleep cycle and produce the chemical in lucid dreams (allows you to control yourself but your body won’t move. Sorry, if you sleepwalk this won’t work for you) you could safely stop the body from moving. Also track eye movement to make the player control the avatar.
Smell
No feasible way to make smells but if the image is real enough your brain might make it smell like it is supposed to. It will use previous encounters to fill in the missing info. (Maybe, this isn’t my strong suit.)
Processing Speed
If you don’t have to move because of the paralyse, just lay down on a bed and have cords run from a super computer to your headset. Because you can’t move there is no danger of getting tangled and then you have the proper computer power needed for a good image. For a multiplayer game just hook it up to an internet booster or have it run on a huge server through the internet that has constant maintenance.
Addiction.
Set up a shut-down time for the server. This allows maintenance and stops people from using it to much. If the server is physical there is also no way to unlock it with our physically being at the server. During shutdown disconnect it from the internet and only allow hardware to access it.
Keeping it PG for kids
Set it up that people cannot make their own games. This keeps the usage PG and controls safety due to children. The group that rates games can then rate all the games for the device and it allows players to distinguish between the genre, rating, and graphics.
Cost.
Even if the system is expensive today, it might be something readily available in the future. Computers used to be huge and hard to get but now they are everywhere. Back then a computer was like 5000 dollars (plus inflation rate) now we can get one maybe 100th of the size for 40 bucks. With tech advancements this could be possible, but we need to work together.
Safety
Lock your Dahm door! Also no real money purchases in game but have it linked to an account on your computer. If real money can be used in game this could allow a black market system to be established. In the suit set up a pulse reader that shuts the system down if the heart rate gets to high. If the pulse reader reads no heartbeat but can detect that the suit is being worn set up a direct line to 911. This makes it so people won’t die because they cant call help and ensures help as quick as possible. For user security they must have a password. This includes a starting phrase to make sure the user doesn’t accidently start the system.
Language
Set up a mic. to speak or maybe read the brain waves to type out what you want to say. This wont allow talking but with some help from a online translator everyone could understand each other.
Settings
Make a “Report Bug” button or a detector/tracker in the system to find people going outside the game area. If they do this set up a 10 second warning screen to return or have an account reset. This will keep many people from going out map. If a player falls out of the map by accident have a safety option to track the player. This makes cases easier if a player gets reset but fell by accident. If the player can make a good case and has proof, their items will be replaced. To replace items the server will have a player catalog that records each players items when they log off. This will give a basic estimate on what to return. The player will lose all progress for that day but can continue. But if the account is reset and the player does not ask for items back in 5 days the data get deleted and the player will be forced to restart.
Settings… continued - tabs
Audio
Built in bluetooth headphones in the headset this tab will allow the player to control volume, allow voices, ect.
Video
Control Graphics and quality.
Advanced
Pain settings - allows small electric shocks to be administered through suit to the body. Cooldown time of 1 shock per 2 seconds will be added to stop continuous shocks. (bullet shots) there will also be 3 “are you sure?” pop up windows with the buttons switching places. This can be turned off at anytime. These shocks will leave a tingle but not harm the body. No shocks will be administered near the area of the heart to ensure safety.
“Report Bug” button goes in this tab.
Sensitivity.
Speaks for itself. Will allow the player to adjust sensitivity of the eye tracker and turning speed.
Log off
One pop up asking “Are You Sure You Want to Log Off?”
I just climbed into my jacuzzi and played Subnautica. It was much more immersive
...with Feelreal
Pre-order World's First Multisensory VR Mask on Indiegogo now:
https://www.indiegogo.com/projects/feelreal-the-world-s-first-multisensory-vr-mask--2
If we do get full dive I want a 360 complete DoF hamster ball rolling cage with some friction assist to enable jumping!
IM BATMAN!...……. In my dreams.
But not the crime fighter pish posh on that I wanna be the billionaire playboy who takes Russian ballet companies on clothing optional yacht cruises in the Mediterranean!
HUZZAH!
Basically, it's entirely within our reach.
By the way, I already have concepts for a few Full Dive Titles:
- Pokémon Mystery Dungeon: Tides of Destiny (Single-Player Full Dive Alola Region Mystery Dungeon Title)
- Pokémon Ultimate Mystery Dungeon (VRMMO Pokémon Mystery Dungeon Title)
- Pokémon: Eon Eternity Online (VRMMO Core RPG Pokémon Title, with Every Region from Kanto to Galar)
Yes, they're all Full-Dive Pokémon titles, which would most likely be a dream come true for Satoshi Tajiri.You wouldn't disagree to the development of Full Dive VR.Technology if you didn't actually somehow agreed to it being developed.
I guess if everybody's honest, h/s/d would somehow want it possible, but that's just my opinion...
...yawn...