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Oculus at GDC Discussion/News and Announcements Megathread

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Comments

  • SpuzzumSpuzzum Posts: 843
    3Jane
    I saw a video interview with one of the Oculus reps, and he was saying Oculus is moving away from the external trackers altogether, not just for Rift S. If the Rift S uses Constellation for the controllers still, I don't see why Oculus can't let us use the external cameras as well then. That would let the user buy a basic inside-out system, but have the option of upgrading their tracking by purchasing the external cameras. This is a downgrade as far as I'm concerned.
  • KoBak07KoBak07 Posts: 42
    Brain Burst
    I was not expecting much from the Rift S, with all the Rift 2 cancellation news, but this release for PC VR is a joke. It looks as a cheap rebrand of the "junk" WMR headsets out there. Sorry, but this does not push VR experience forward in anything I care about for the games I like to play. I honestly don't believe any more that we will ever see a Rift 2 from Oculus which is trying to be cutting edge. Don't get me wrong, I absolutely loved my Rift, in 2017. But in 2019 I feel I am ready to spend for something much more. I guess it will not be with O
  • CrashFuCrashFu Posts: 1,756 Valuable Player
    Spuzzum said:
    I saw a video interview with one of the Oculus reps, and he was saying Oculus is moving away from the external trackers altogether, not just for Rift S. If the Rift S uses Constellation for the controllers still, I don't see why Oculus can't let us use the external cameras as well then. That would let the user buy a basic inside-out system, but have the option of upgrading their tracking by purchasing the external cameras. This is a downgrade as far as I'm concerned.
    You seem to be assuming that the Inside-Out tracking will be bad enough that there would be some benefit to using the external sensors in conjunction with it..

    More likely, it will work just fine by itself, and adding externals would just add on the risk of judder due to bumped sensors or misbehaving usb ports, in exchange for no appreciable tracking improvements.
    It's hard being the voice of reason when you're surrounded by unreasonable people.
  • SpuzzumSpuzzum Posts: 843
    3Jane
    CrashFu said:
    Spuzzum said:
    I saw a video interview with one of the Oculus reps, and he was saying Oculus is moving away from the external trackers altogether, not just for Rift S. If the Rift S uses Constellation for the controllers still, I don't see why Oculus can't let us use the external cameras as well then. That would let the user buy a basic inside-out system, but have the option of upgrading their tracking by purchasing the external cameras. This is a downgrade as far as I'm concerned.
    You seem to be assuming that the Inside-Out tracking will be bad enough that there would be some benefit to using the external sensors in conjunction with it..

    More likely, it will work just fine by itself, and adding externals would just add on the risk of judder due to bumped sensors or misbehaving usb ports, in exchange for no appreciable tracking improvements.
    There's going to be issues of occlusion here and there...it's inevitable. Tested already pointed out issues it'll have with games such as the Echo series. There's also the fact you can't do full body tracking with inside-out cameras. Not that Oculus has trackers such as Vive does, but they said in the past that full body tracking was on the list of things they wanted in the future. As for risk of judder due to bumped sensors or misbehaving usb ports...c'mon, give us some credit. There's what...~1,000,000 or so Rift owners who had no problems setting up and maintaining our sensors, even going as far as buying a dedicated pcie usb card and stands for the sensors. They don't get bumped, and there's no misbehaving usb ports. Many of us do not want inside-out tracking for high end pcvr. If that's your thing...have at 'er. But they're pissing off a huge portion of their customer base with this. There's enough posts to back it up.
  • CrashFuCrashFu Posts: 1,756 Valuable Player
    Spuzzum said:
    CrashFu said:
    Spuzzum said:
    I saw a video interview with one of the Oculus reps, and he was saying Oculus is moving away from the external trackers altogether, not just for Rift S. If the Rift S uses Constellation for the controllers still, I don't see why Oculus can't let us use the external cameras as well then. That would let the user buy a basic inside-out system, but have the option of upgrading their tracking by purchasing the external cameras. This is a downgrade as far as I'm concerned.
    You seem to be assuming that the Inside-Out tracking will be bad enough that there would be some benefit to using the external sensors in conjunction with it..

    More likely, it will work just fine by itself, and adding externals would just add on the risk of judder due to bumped sensors or misbehaving usb ports, in exchange for no appreciable tracking improvements.
    There's going to be issues of occlusion here and there...it's inevitable. Tested already pointed out issues it'll have with games such as the Echo series. There's also the fact you can't do full body tracking with inside-out cameras. Not that Oculus has trackers such as Vive does, but they said in the past that full body tracking was on the list of things they wanted in the future. As for risk of judder due to bumped sensors or misbehaving usb ports...c'mon, give us some credit. There's what...~1,000,000 or so Rift owners who had no problems setting up and maintaining our sensors, even going as far as buying a dedicated pcie usb card and stands for the sensors. They don't get bumped, and there's no misbehaving usb ports. Many of us do not want inside-out tracking for high end pcvr. If that's your thing...have at 'er. But they're pissing off a huge portion of their customer base with this. There's enough posts to back it up.
    And only a couple of those "pissed off" people have any prior involvement with the community,  suggesting that the majority of complaints are coming from a small fringe group that has suddenly decided to be overly vocal.  :smile: 

    As for your other non-issues:   Compared to the ever-present risk of stepping / reaching outside of your sensor range, the Rift-S tracking will have FAR fewer issues with blind-spots and occlusion than the Rift.  The one and only theoretical situation that it would have a problem is performing dexterous actions directly behind your own head, and when have you EVER had to do that?

    Body Tracking?  You can't be serious.  Body tracking rigs exist solely for rich kids to show off in VR Chat.  They're something that 99.9% of the market would never waste their money on and that 99.9% of applications would never support. Body tracking is not a gimmick that Oculus or any other developer should be concerned with at this time.

    "1,000,000 people have never once had a sensor get bumped or a usb port misbehave"?   :lol::lol::lol:

    *ahem*  You're delusional.  Also, nobody is forcing you to trade your Rift in for a Rift-S just yet, so all you're really doing here is getting mad that Oculus had the audacity to make a product not specifically catered to you.
    It's hard being the voice of reason when you're surrounded by unreasonable people.
  • SpuzzumSpuzzum Posts: 843
    3Jane
    CrashFu said:
    Spuzzum said:
    CrashFu said:
    Spuzzum said:
    I saw a video interview with one of the Oculus reps, and he was saying Oculus is moving away from the external trackers altogether, not just for Rift S. If the Rift S uses Constellation for the controllers still, I don't see why Oculus can't let us use the external cameras as well then. That would let the user buy a basic inside-out system, but have the option of upgrading their tracking by purchasing the external cameras. This is a downgrade as far as I'm concerned.
    You seem to be assuming that the Inside-Out tracking will be bad enough that there would be some benefit to using the external sensors in conjunction with it..

    More likely, it will work just fine by itself, and adding externals would just add on the risk of judder due to bumped sensors or misbehaving usb ports, in exchange for no appreciable tracking improvements.
    There's going to be issues of occlusion here and there...it's inevitable. Tested already pointed out issues it'll have with games such as the Echo series. There's also the fact you can't do full body tracking with inside-out cameras. Not that Oculus has trackers such as Vive does, but they said in the past that full body tracking was on the list of things they wanted in the future. As for risk of judder due to bumped sensors or misbehaving usb ports...c'mon, give us some credit. There's what...~1,000,000 or so Rift owners who had no problems setting up and maintaining our sensors, even going as far as buying a dedicated pcie usb card and stands for the sensors. They don't get bumped, and there's no misbehaving usb ports. Many of us do not want inside-out tracking for high end pcvr. If that's your thing...have at 'er. But they're pissing off a huge portion of their customer base with this. There's enough posts to back it up.
    And only a couple of those "pissed off" people have any prior involvement with the community,  suggesting that the majority of complaints are coming from a small fringe group that has suddenly decided to be overly vocal.  :smile: 

    As for your other non-issues:   Compared to the ever-present risk of stepping / reaching outside of your sensor range, the Rift-S tracking will have FAR fewer issues with blind-spots and occlusion than the Rift.  The one and only theoretical situation that it would have a problem is performing dexterous actions directly behind your own head, and when have you EVER had to do that?

    Body Tracking?  You can't be serious.  Body tracking rigs exist solely for rich kids to show off in VR Chat.  They're something that 99.9% of the market would never waste their money on and that 99.9% of applications would never support. Body tracking is not a gimmick that Oculus or any other developer should be concerned with at this time.

    "1,000,000 people have never once had a sensor get bumped or a usb port misbehave"?   :lol::lol::lol:

    *ahem*  You're delusional.  Also, nobody is forcing you to trade your Rift in for a Rift-S just yet, so all you're really doing here is getting mad that Oculus had the audacity to make a product not specifically catered to you.

    I could care less about their 'involvement within the community'. Threads on Reddit as well as posts on twitter suggest people are pissed off if they move away from external trackers. You may not want them, but that's 'you'.

    As for reaching outside my sensor range...my area is 10'x10', and it has the guardian system. Any bigger, and I'd be hitting my walls. Inside-out tracking isn't going to do jack squat about that. Absolutely no benefit.

    As for body tracking...just do a google for 'Rift CV2 wishlist'...if it's not in the list from the OP, it's definitely suggested numerous times in the comments below. There's also a thread here about it, where it linked a thread about people using Vive trackers and lighthouses with their Rifts, as well as a link talking about using a spare Touch controller as a 'vr object' that could potentially be used to track the feet. On top of that, the haptic suits coming out track themselves. You may not want it, but there's a definite wish for it, and it's not just for dancing. Once they start tracking feet, then that opens the doors for games such as soccer, hockey, or even kick boxing.

    As for forcing me to trade my Rift for a Rift S...what the hell are you talking about? My comment was Oculus is moving away from external tracking...meaning any new headset, beyond Rift S, will be inside-out tracking. Nobody's forcing me to do anything. But the hardware we all bought will be completely useless. They've already said the new controllers will work with the old Rift and external sensors, just the old Touch won't work with the new headsets. My guess is because of the positioning of the led ring. So if the new controllers work with the old external sensors, then why wouldn't they be able to configure Oculus Home to use the external sensors instead if the user chooses to do so? That's not 'catering' to anybody. That's keeping your customer base happy and not force a downgrade on them.
  • SpuzzumSpuzzum Posts: 843
    3Jane
    edited March 2019
    Btw...that video was Tested's 'hands-on and impressions', and they were interviewing Nate Mitchell. He says himself Insight is not as good as the external trackers, saying there's a few areas where you'll experience occlusion...behind the back, when the controllers are too close to the headset, and when you cross one arm over the other. He says it's a trade-off, but they feel the benefits of the experience outweigh the disadvantage. Norm then asked him if they'd consider using both Insight as well as the external trackers...he said they'll listen to what the people want.
  • Hiro_Protag0nistHiro_Protag0nist Posts: 4,978 Valuable Player
    edited March 2019
    Spuzzum said:

    I could care less about their 'involvement within the community'. 



    ...or, are you using it correctly...?  I can't tell lol

    Best be safe - never say "I could care less"    B)
  • bigmike20vtbigmike20vt Posts: 4,153 Valuable Player
    Spuzzum said:

    I could care less about their 'involvement within the community'. 



    ...or, are you using it correctly...?  I can't tell lol

    Best be safe - never say "I could care less"    B)
    It is one of my pet hates too. Up there with this modern speak where "sick" is somehow good

    Fiat Coupe, gone. 350Z gone. Dirty nappies, no sleep & practical transport incoming. Thank goodness for VR :)
  • Digikid1Digikid1 Posts: 2,206 Valuable Player
    It is one of my pet hates too. Up there with this modern speak where "sick" is somehow good

    Yeah I am with you there.  Today's gen just don't know how to speak proper English.
  • RichooalRichooal Posts: 1,609 Valuable Player
    I don't know if this has been posted yet or not (I stopped trying to keep up after the first 40 pages of post GDC news)
    Anyway, interesting comment from JC about possible tethering on the Quest .............


    i5 6600k - GTX1060 - 8GB RAM - Rift CV1 + 3 Senors - 0 PROBLEMS 1 minor problem
    Dear Oculus, "If it ain't broke, don't fix it", please.

  • SpuzzumSpuzzum Posts: 843
    3Jane
    Spuzzum said:

    I could care less about their 'involvement within the community'. 



    ...or, are you using it correctly...?  I can't tell lol

    Best be safe - never say "I could care less"    B)
    It is one of my pet hates too. Up there with this modern speak where "sick" is somehow good

    My point was their involvement in the community bears no weight on their view as a paying customer. Just because someone doesn't post in the forums, doesn't mean their views aren't valid.
  • kojackkojack Posts: 6,417 Volunteer Moderator
    Yep, post count generally shouldn't be a judge of views.

    I've made only a couple of posts in over 10 years on the SFML forums (open source 2d c++ game engine), but I've been using SFML that whole time for personal projects and teaching it to games programming students. I know it inside and out. I just never embedded myself in their forum. (Not sure why)

    Then there's people who were on here who had lots of posts but their views were, umm, less than worthy. :)

    Let's not jump to conclusions.
  • CrashFuCrashFu Posts: 1,756 Valuable Player
    No, but someone who has never bothered to participate in our community before now and then suddenly shows up just to make a scene? That looks like a troll to me.   And when it's a number of people like that, saying the exact same things as each other?  Well that makes it look like an organized attempt by the anti-Oculus camp to manipulate the public opinion,  like they did years ago trying to get people to jump ship to the Vive.

    At best, I'd think they're just people who have been out of touch with the VR community / industry for a long time, now making knee-jerk reactions to developments they don't fully understand.  Either way, I'd rather be paranoid than assume honest intentions from every faceless rando who shows up and starts Oculus-bashing. 
    It's hard being the voice of reason when you're surrounded by unreasonable people.
  • SpuzzumSpuzzum Posts: 843
    3Jane
    edited March 2019
    Good grief. Get a grip. There's roughly 1,000,000 Rifts out there...you'd be lucky to have maybe 10% of those owners on this forum. There's people who never post in their lives, but only visit to get the info they need for whatever problem they face. That doesn't make them trolls if and when they voice their opinion. Thinking they are is just arrogant and dismissive.
  • MAC_MAN86MAC_MAN86 Posts: 2,262
    Wintermute
    1million is not a lot globally is it. I don't see Oculus selling 1,000,000,000 especially as probably half of the Rift Users will either stay OR get the Rift S OR move to another maker! What a pipedream :o
  • SpuzzumSpuzzum Posts: 843
    3Jane
    MAC_MAN86 said:
    1million is not a lot globally is it. I don't see Oculus selling 1,000,000,000 especially as probably half of the Rift Users will either stay OR get the Rift S OR move to another maker! What a pipedream :o


  • MAC_MAN86MAC_MAN86 Posts: 2,262
    Wintermute
    Spuzzum said:



    Precisely...1000 x a million is not possible when they are merely doubling each year. Like I say consider my statement and it looks already to be just 2million in 2019. Sure there's the existing years + secondhand market to accumulate but a loooooooong way to get to 1 billion (1,000,000,000 Oculus VR Users).
  • SpuzzumSpuzzum Posts: 843
    3Jane
    Sorry...I misread your statement. I read the 1,000,000,000 as 1,000,000. I just woke up. But my point was that there's roughly 1,000,000 Rift owners out there...and not all of them post or are even members of the forums. That doesn't make their opinions any less valid. Whether they leave for another headset maker or not is irrelevant to my point.
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