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Valve Index - Specifications released.

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  • MradrMradr Posts: 3,550 Valuable Player
    edited April 1
    DaftnDirect said:
    I think if Atm... I mean he who shouldn't be named were still here, this thread would have descended to the point that we'd be saying the same thing!
    Atmos:)? There were a lot of people like that over the years xD That just the most recent big one I can think of. I have no fear! Agree though:) The 20 post days of just him and Zen going at it:D
  • DaftnDirectDaftnDirect Posts: 5,296 Volunteer Moderator
    I'm sorry to say I got drawn in too. The more someone is anti-Oculus for the sake of being anti-oculus, the more frustrated I get. I'll have to learn to ignore.

    Love talking other manufacturers otherwise.
    Intel 5820K [email protected], Titan X (Maxwell), 16GB Corsair Vengeance DDR4, ASRock X99 Taichi, Samsung 500Gb 960 Evo M.2, Corsair H100i v2 Cooler, Inateck KTU3FR-4P USB 3 card, Windows 10 Pro v1903 (18363.535)
  • RuneSR2RuneSR2 Posts: 3,994 Valuable Player
    edited April 1
    logotomie said:
    rumored resolution is 1913x2125 per eye

    things are getting interesting. Lets see what kind of screen it is.
    ...if i just had faith in valve building hardware, so far they constantly failed in that department....


    Could be an April Fools' joke - but maybe not, I think this dude got it right:

    "With a 1.4 HW multiplier it would actually indicate exactly 1440x1600 per eye.

    Edit: note that a lot of people are doing the "90%" math wrong. It's linear in pixels."

    https://www.reddit.com/r/Vive/comments/b7xlmd/valve_index_resolution_leaked/

    I ate to few carrots as a child - now I need high Index to read this  ;)



    Intel i7 7700K (4.5 GHz); MSI GeForce GTX 1080 8GB Gaming X (oc 2100 MHz gpu boost, 11 GHz mem speed); 16GB Corsair Vengeance LPX DDR4 3200 MHz; MSI Z270I Gaming Pro Carbon AC (VR-Ready) mainboard; Samsung 960 Evo M.2 SSD + Toshiba P300 HD; Windows 10 OS; Valve Index and Oculus Rift CV1 - the latter nearly always using super sampling 2.0. 

    "Ask not what VR can do for you – ask what you can do for VR"
  • MradrMradr Posts: 3,550 Valuable Player
    Even if Valve Index does have amazing hardware even with in reasonable price point - there was still reasons I went Oculus over HTC. Simple fact - Oculus has the games and software coming for it. Wall Garden or not - having access to that software + steam store was an amazing grab hold at that time to not go Oculus. Even now - if you compare software - Oculus still has a leg up here and there. Steam VR still feels clunky to me compare Oculus' setup and in and out VR experience, so we will just have to see how Steam VR improves before the release of their HMD and a bit after (have to still get them bugs out, right?) Either way, this is why I am plan to get two again - but this time around I will write up a little review/blog on both. Try to get screen shots and everything else.
  • MradrMradr Posts: 3,550 Valuable Player
    edited April 1
    RuneSR2 said:
    Could be an April Fools' joke - but maybe not, I think this dude got it right:

    "That's 90% at 1913x2125, or 100% at 2016x2240.

    With a 1.4x multiplier (like Vive) that would indicate a 1440x1600 display -- which is exactly the Vive Pro spec."

    I ate to few carrots as a child - now I need high Index to read this 

    Another user also pointed out that each multiplier effects each headset differently - so that might be true for the Vive Pro - that doesn't mean those same settings would be true for the Vive it self. It's possible that the screens could be higher resolution than that. I'm not holding my breath tho xD but with such a large FOV - it does make me question if that is the right move for them to do so. That be the same PPD as the CV1 and Vive. I would assume if they're going to increase the FOV then they will increase the screen res to match it. Maybe not - who knows LOL

    Honestly - I think its a fake XD the screen grabbed is just too poor for something in 2019 that should be pretty clear xD
  • DaftnDirectDaftnDirect Posts: 5,296 Volunteer Moderator
    yeah it's just a shame whoever screen grabbed that was using 640x480 !
    Intel 5820K [email protected], Titan X (Maxwell), 16GB Corsair Vengeance DDR4, ASRock X99 Taichi, Samsung 500Gb 960 Evo M.2, Corsair H100i v2 Cooler, Inateck KTU3FR-4P USB 3 card, Windows 10 Pro v1903 (18363.535)
  • RuneSR2RuneSR2 Posts: 3,994 Valuable Player
    edited April 1
    Mradr said:
    RuneSR2 said:
    Could be an April Fools' joke - but maybe not, I think this dude got it right:

    "That's 90% at 1913x2125, or 100% at 2016x2240.

    With a 1.4x multiplier (like Vive) that would indicate a 1440x1600 display -- which is exactly the Vive Pro spec."

    I ate to few carrots as a child - now I need high Index to read this 

    Another user also pointed out that each multiplier effects each headset differently - so that might be true for the Vive Pro - that doesn't mean those same settings would be true for the Vive it self. It's possible that the screens could be higher resolution than that. I'm not holding my breath tho xD but with such a large FOV - it does make me question if that is the right move for them to do so. That be the same PPD as the CV1 and Vive. I would assume if they're going to increase the FOV then they will increase the screen res to match it. Maybe not - who knows LOL
     UplpadVR just published a piece about the leaked Index res - although today is the worst day for such articles  :D

    "While the image is low resolution, it’s still possible to make out the details by looking closely. The headset name seems to be ‘Unidentified HMD’ and the frametime indicator is clearly up to 11.1ms- meaning a refresh rate of 90 Hz

    Zooming in shows the current render resolution as 1913×2125. However, the render resolution is set to 90%, meaning at 100% it would be 2016×2240.

    It’s very important to note that a headset’s default render resolution is not the same as its panel resolution. In order to overcome the inherent image quality loss from barell distortion PC VR headsets by default render at a higher resolution than the panels.

    The original HTC Vive uses 1080×1200 panels and its default was 1512×1680. The Vive Pro upgraded to 1440×1600 panels and upped this default to 2016×2240- exactly what the video’s 90% resolution scaled to 100% would be. Both headsets used a render resolution 1.4x the panel resolution on each axis.

    So What Panel Resolution?

    The same default render resolution as the Vive Pro seems to indicate Index uses the same 1440×1600 OLED panels as the Vive Pro. Back when Index was first leaked a source told us the headset would have “Vive Pro resolution”- but it was unclear whether they referred to panel resolution or angular. Perhaps it was the former.

    However the other possibility is that Index’s render resolution is 1.0x instead of 1.4x. The original leaks of Index showed labels on the headset. One of these labels had a heading called “Display” with two options: BOE and JDI.

    BOE and JDI are both display manufacturers. BOE makes the 1440p LCD for the Oculus Go also used on Rift S, and JDI is rumored to be making the 2160×2160 LCDs for the HP Reverb

    Both companies have 2K LCD panels for VR releasing this year that could be suitable for Index if the headset will indeed improve resolution. BOE has a 90Hz 2160×2376 panel. JDI has a 2160×2432 120Hz panel."

    https://uploadvr.com/report-valve-index-dev-video-apparently-reveals-render-resolution-and-refresh-rate/

    I think Vive Pro res would be a nice target trying not to kill every GPU out there ;)

    Intel i7 7700K (4.5 GHz); MSI GeForce GTX 1080 8GB Gaming X (oc 2100 MHz gpu boost, 11 GHz mem speed); 16GB Corsair Vengeance LPX DDR4 3200 MHz; MSI Z270I Gaming Pro Carbon AC (VR-Ready) mainboard; Samsung 960 Evo M.2 SSD + Toshiba P300 HD; Windows 10 OS; Valve Index and Oculus Rift CV1 - the latter nearly always using super sampling 2.0. 

    "Ask not what VR can do for you – ask what you can do for VR"
  • WildtWildt Posts: 2,116 Valuable Player
    As long as we have good control of the render target, there's no reason not to crave the highest resolution panels we can get.
    Future proofing!
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    WMR: HP Reverb
  • MradrMradr Posts: 3,550 Valuable Player
    edited April 1
    BOE has a 90Hz 2160×2376 panel.  I think could be used if they did a 1:1. The problem comes down to lenses at that point. If their lenses fixes the reason we have to do distortion fix - then you could render at normal res than the upscale render we do now. I assume it really depends on when they could get these panels and if BOE saw a enough demand for them to really make them outside of special orders. If so the PPD would be around 16 for 135 FOV. That be amazing:O

    Really it sounds like it comes down to:
    1) If the new lenses are amazing to fix more than one major issue with current lens (including the GOs such as God Rays, color correction, and distortion)
    2) If they are - then might be able to push a little harder for the screens to be higher res than vive pro

    With that said though - Cost wise - if they do go with new higher res panels, lenses, controllers, and base stations - even if they take a hit - and take in no profit other than when they fix manufacturing cost - that still be in the upper 800$ price mark and if they do around 900$ to 1000$ mark. On the plus side - if your PC would run a Vive Pro already - your PC should now run a Index the same way either if they use the same panels - or used higher end panels and a more 1:1 scale. Either way - we already should know what hardware you will need if we just compare to the Vive Pro.

    Not sure about anyone else - but if they can keep the total package around that 800$ mark I think it be in a really amazing price point for all the features + FOV and Res.  That might make it good enough for the people that are waiting to get into VR or the next generatilon headset. If they do release HL 2.5 then you might have some killer AAA game that will set off the hype for VR again.
  • snowdogsnowdog Posts: 7,160 Valuable Player
    BOE also do 4K panels a suitable size for a headset too, they had them on view at a show some time last year. But they're probably saving them up for the CV2 in 2022 :tongue:

    If Valve are going for panels the same resolution as the Vive Pro, whilst that may SOUND great they won't look too good if the Index has a 135 degree FOV. :open_mouth:
    "This you have to understand. There's only one way to hurt a man who's lost everything. Give him back something broken."

    Thomas Covenant, Unbeliever
  • MradrMradr Posts: 3,550 Valuable Player
    edited April 1
    I'm sorry to say I got drawn in too. The more someone is anti-Oculus for the sake of being anti-oculus, the more frustrated I get. I'll have to learn to ignore.

    Love talking other manufacturers otherwise.
    Oculus is Anti-Consumer. 
    Do you have proof of this? After reading some of your post.. you seem to be breaking a few rules here. I understand you might not be happy with oculus but please understand your comments are against form rules. This will be your first warning.
  • DaftnDirectDaftnDirect Posts: 5,296 Volunteer Moderator
    @RobbyPentakill this thread isn't about bashing Oculus after your other threads created for that purpose have been closed.
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  • snowdogsnowdog Posts: 7,160 Valuable Player
    I'm sorry to say I got drawn in too. The more someone is anti-Oculus for the sake of being anti-oculus, the more frustrated I get. I'll have to learn to ignore.

    Love talking other manufacturers otherwise.
    Oculus is Anti-Consumer. 

    Actually I think you'll find that Valve are anti-consumer and anti-competitive, not Oculus. Why not start a thread about it?  :D
    "This you have to understand. There's only one way to hurt a man who's lost everything. Give him back something broken."

    Thomas Covenant, Unbeliever
  • RuneSR2RuneSR2 Posts: 3,994 Valuable Player
    edited April 1
    snowdog said:w
    I'm sorry to say I got drawn in too. The more someone is anti-Oculus for the sake of being anti-oculus, the more frustrated I get. I'll have to learn to ignore.

    Love talking other manufacturers otherwise.
    Oculus is Anti-Consumer. 

    Actually I think you'll find that Valve are anti-consumer and anti-competitive, not Oculus. Why not start a thread about it?  :D
    You do have a point, SteamVR Home has always been quite grey and dull, the only thing worse may have been the Steam VR intro.

    And the environment for the Knuckles demo, set on the surface of the moon, which reintroduce the damn grey! 

    Now compare to Oculus Home and First Contact, the difference in quality and warmth is just striking. Oculus is simply:



    (And no, I'm not trying to be funny - always loved Oculus' design, which sets them apart from everyone else in the best possible way. Oculus may be many things, but anti-consumer isn't one of them - at all) 

    Intel i7 7700K (4.5 GHz); MSI GeForce GTX 1080 8GB Gaming X (oc 2100 MHz gpu boost, 11 GHz mem speed); 16GB Corsair Vengeance LPX DDR4 3200 MHz; MSI Z270I Gaming Pro Carbon AC (VR-Ready) mainboard; Samsung 960 Evo M.2 SSD + Toshiba P300 HD; Windows 10 OS; Valve Index and Oculus Rift CV1 - the latter nearly always using super sampling 2.0. 

    "Ask not what VR can do for you – ask what you can do for VR"
  • RuneSR2RuneSR2 Posts: 3,994 Valuable Player
    snowdog said:
    If Valve are going for panels the same resolution as the Vive Pro, whilst that may SOUND great they won't look too good if the Index has a 135 degree FOV. :open_mouth:

    I think you're on to something - I just wish that problem could be solved - maybe if someone invented some special double lenses?  :D (ok, we'll see about that, really pumping up the hype here :blush: )
    Intel i7 7700K (4.5 GHz); MSI GeForce GTX 1080 8GB Gaming X (oc 2100 MHz gpu boost, 11 GHz mem speed); 16GB Corsair Vengeance LPX DDR4 3200 MHz; MSI Z270I Gaming Pro Carbon AC (VR-Ready) mainboard; Samsung 960 Evo M.2 SSD + Toshiba P300 HD; Windows 10 OS; Valve Index and Oculus Rift CV1 - the latter nearly always using super sampling 2.0. 

    "Ask not what VR can do for you – ask what you can do for VR"
  • RuneSR2RuneSR2 Posts: 3,994 Valuable Player
    edited April 1
    Deleted - somehow a double post was created. 
    Intel i7 7700K (4.5 GHz); MSI GeForce GTX 1080 8GB Gaming X (oc 2100 MHz gpu boost, 11 GHz mem speed); 16GB Corsair Vengeance LPX DDR4 3200 MHz; MSI Z270I Gaming Pro Carbon AC (VR-Ready) mainboard; Samsung 960 Evo M.2 SSD + Toshiba P300 HD; Windows 10 OS; Valve Index and Oculus Rift CV1 - the latter nearly always using super sampling 2.0. 

    "Ask not what VR can do for you – ask what you can do for VR"
  • KlodsBrikKlodsBrik Posts: 1,201
    Wintermute
    edited April 1
    Be good, die great !
  • KlodsBrikKlodsBrik Posts: 1,201
    Wintermute
    edited April 1
    httpsiimgurcomlgrnihWpng


    There is also this link that points towards a relese june 30.

    Be good, die great !
  • KlodsBrikKlodsBrik Posts: 1,201
    Wintermute
    This page mentions Valve Index Controllers and Valve Index Basestations as well as the hmd:
    https://steamdb.info/sub/354231/apps/

    Be good, die great !
  • MradrMradr Posts: 3,550 Valuable Player
    Idk - I hope that is just a see through and not the look of the front because my OCD to make it look even is killing me LOL
  • MradrMradr Posts: 3,550 Valuable Player
    The only thing to take away from the page is the min recommended spec - a 970!:O wow! That's pretty good actually. Sounds like they are banking on something cool about their software to get them that low.
  • KlodsBrikKlodsBrik Posts: 1,201
    Wintermute
    HLVR leaked gameplay footage, or Aprils fool joke ?

    Be good, die great !
  • Techy111Techy111 Posts: 6,596 Volunteer Moderator
    Any news anywhere on screen specs ?
    A PC with lots of gadgets inside and a thing to see in 3D that you put on your head.

  • MradrMradr Posts: 3,550 Valuable Player
    KlodsBrik said:
    HLVR leaked gameplay footage, or Aprils fool joke ?

    Hmm I've seen something like this before - i dont think this is real or if it is - it was a mod anyways.
  • DaftnDirectDaftnDirect Posts: 5,296 Volunteer Moderator
    edited April 1
    Something doesn't add up, 970 minimum? no.
    What's the power adaptor for? (cos that page seems to just be describing the headset, not basestation etc)
    Intel 5820K [email protected], Titan X (Maxwell), 16GB Corsair Vengeance DDR4, ASRock X99 Taichi, Samsung 500Gb 960 Evo M.2, Corsair H100i v2 Cooler, Inateck KTU3FR-4P USB 3 card, Windows 10 Pro v1903 (18363.535)
  • logotomielogotomie Posts: 81
    Hiro Protagonist
    the screenshot says  display port 1.2. That would not be enough for the higher resolutions discussed further up.
  • ShocksVRShocksVR Posts: 470
    Trinity
    edited April 1
    Ok I'm out.

    I was pondering on getting the Index, but it seems waaaay too rich for my blood ($800+).
    i7-7700k, GTX 1080Ti (11G) || MSI B150m (1 USB controller) + Inateck 4-port USB to PCIe (2nd USB controller)
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  • RuneSR2RuneSR2 Posts: 3,994 Valuable Player
    KlodsBrik said:
    I don't care if she's real or not, I think I'm in love  <3
    Intel i7 7700K (4.5 GHz); MSI GeForce GTX 1080 8GB Gaming X (oc 2100 MHz gpu boost, 11 GHz mem speed); 16GB Corsair Vengeance LPX DDR4 3200 MHz; MSI Z270I Gaming Pro Carbon AC (VR-Ready) mainboard; Samsung 960 Evo M.2 SSD + Toshiba P300 HD; Windows 10 OS; Valve Index and Oculus Rift CV1 - the latter nearly always using super sampling 2.0. 

    "Ask not what VR can do for you – ask what you can do for VR"
  • RuneSR2RuneSR2 Posts: 3,994 Valuable Player
    logotomie said:
    the screenshot says  display port 1.2. That would not be enough for the higher resolutions discussed further up.
    Vive Pro res should work just fine:


    Intel i7 7700K (4.5 GHz); MSI GeForce GTX 1080 8GB Gaming X (oc 2100 MHz gpu boost, 11 GHz mem speed); 16GB Corsair Vengeance LPX DDR4 3200 MHz; MSI Z270I Gaming Pro Carbon AC (VR-Ready) mainboard; Samsung 960 Evo M.2 SSD + Toshiba P300 HD; Windows 10 OS; Valve Index and Oculus Rift CV1 - the latter nearly always using super sampling 2.0. 

    "Ask not what VR can do for you – ask what you can do for VR"
  • logotomielogotomie Posts: 81
    Hiro Protagonist
    RuneSR2 said:
    logotomie said:
    the screenshot says  display port 1.2. That would not be enough for the higher resolutions discussed further up.
    Vive Pro res should work just fine:
    yes, but the vive pro pentile display at 135 fov seems not high res enough
This discussion has been closed.