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High end oculus vr.. don't hold your breath

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  • snowdogsnowdog Posts: 6,753 Valuable Player
    kevinw729 said:
    LuluViBritannia said:
    ....
    Do you mean that all the people praising the Valve Index actually had the chance to use it? I highly doubt it ^^'. 

    I think you know that I said many and not all  B) - it will be great when its in the hands of the majority though. Some unfiltered feedback on this will help all understand and not being under embargo for many will be a weight off.

    For now, all I heard was rumors on the specs and people stupidly believing in those rumors. As of today, the Valve Index barely exists officially. When the speecs are released, then, there will be matter to be hyped... if said specs are good, of course.

    Yeah, hype has shaped this phase of VR more than any other, and like in 1997 the bubble has burst and the consumer wants reality rather than the hypetrain - I see your passionate point. I just wonder how much specs will be trumped by content in this part of the race?

    Hum, no, it's not. Those headsets aren't part of the current VR ecosystems. And they aren't at the same level as the others in terms of specs.
    Sony did nothing for the PC VR market. I do respect them for their PSVR ecosystem though.


    Okay, I understand your point, but I do not see these aspects working in isolation - IMHO I think that the Sony has had a lot more influence on the VR scene than many like to admit, and the appearance of the Halo Strap (a blast from 1996) on the Rift-S came as a uncomfortable reminder. That Sony has cooled its future PSVR2 investment till the PS5 has been launched shows that they see the next-generation of VR this phase round coming more in a 2022 time-frame - which will be interesting. Maybe by then with Quest success under their belt the reinvigorated Oculus will consider CV2?


    Oculus have ALWAYS been considering the release of the CV2. The success or failure of the Quest will have nothing to do with the release of the CV2.

    They've had a plan for having three headsets going forward for some time now.

    Now they MAY have decided to postpone the release of the CV2 from this year to three year's time when the technology is ready and is cheap enough to produce without releasing a headset until 2022, but I think they were planning on continuing the CV1 until 2020, 2021 or 2022.

    Abrash has said that the tech in Half Dome won't be ready until 2022 at last year's Oculus Connect and I think the original plan in 2016 was to release it this year so Oculus have produced a stopgap with the Rift S until the tech is ready in three years time.
    "This you have to understand. There's only one way to hurt a man who's lost everything. Give him back something broken."

    Thomas Covenant, Unbeliever
  • dburnedburne Posts: 2,411 Valuable Player
    Zenbane said:
    RedRizla said:
    I'm just curious to know if we have had some bullshit thrown our way by Oculus. They kept saying they weren't abandoning PC -VR, but they have certainly made it look like it's not a priority by leaving Rift -S to Lenovo. Now there is no talk of a Rift 2 in development and that's a big change from what they were saying last year. Are we to believe that Rift -S is now Rift 2?

    You are only talking Hardware in all of that. PCVR is both hardware and software. Facebook and Oculus are releasing great new native PCVR experiences.

    And just because Oculus partnered with Lenovo doesn't mean, by default, that they have abandoned anything. Valve partnered with HTC for Vive, right? Partnerships are fine.
    No but in my mind it just shows where Oculus main focus is going to be for quite a while.

    Don

    EVGA Z390 Dark MB | I9 9900k| EVGA 2080Ti FTW3 Ultra |32 GB G Skill 3200 cl14 ram | Warthog Throttle | VKB Gunfighter Pro/MCG Pro grip | Crosswind Pedals | EVGA DG 87 Case|
  • inovatorinovator Posts: 1,852
    Project 2501
    Had you ever considered that why so many people are excited about the system is that they have had the chance to use it and even take it apart

    Do you mean that all the people praising the Valve Index actually had the chance to use it? I highly doubt it ^^'. For now, all I heard was rumors on the specs and people stupidly believing in those rumors. As of today, the Valve Index barely exists officially. When the speecs are released, then, there will be matter to be hyped... if said specs are good, of course.

     its important to remember the work that SONY had done with the Glasstron and the HMZ

    Hum, no, it's not. Those headsets aren't part of the current VR ecosystems. And they aren't at the same level as the others in terms of specs.
    Sony did nothing for the PC VR market. I do respect them for their PSVR ecosystem though.

  • snowdogsnowdog Posts: 6,753 Valuable Player
    RedRizla said:
    I'm just curious to know if we have had some bullshit thrown our way by Oculus. They kept saying they weren't abandoning PC -VR, but they have certainly made it look like it's not a priority by leaving Rift -S to Lenovo. Now there is no talk of a Rift 2 in development and that's a big change from what they were saying last year. Are we to believe that Rift -S is now Rift 2?

    I get that cheaper headsets means more sales and more sales means devs will create software, but why all the talk of half dome, eye tracking last, and now reel it all back in like it was never spoken about? So I tack it that a Rift 2 is not in development as of now is that correct?

    I also see people's point about creating for a cheaper market, but just like televisions there should also be a place for catering for a higher end on too. Maybe Oculus should be looking to cater for both the cheaper and more expensive headsets market, just like Samsung, LG and Sony do with their televisions. 

    See my post above. I think in 2016 they were planning on releasing the CV2 in 2019 with the Half Dome features but the technology either isn't ready or isn't cheap enough to produce.

    We'll have to wait until Oculus Connect 6 to find out the sort of time that we'll see the CV2 being released. Like I've said before we're not going to see Facebook ploughing millions of dollars into R&D for the Half Dome prototype and not release it until 2025 or even 2028 for their standalone headsets. They need high end PC VR because early adopters won't have a problem paying a little extra for the Tock to get it. The Tock (CV2) will be $599, and three years later the cost of manufacturing will have come down to see the Tick (CV2 S) retailing for $399 with a few improvements.

    They're not going to be releasing Tick after Tick after Tick and then wait 10 years or so to only see the tech used in the Half Dome prototype only being used in their standalone headsets. Not going to happen.
    "This you have to understand. There's only one way to hurt a man who's lost everything. Give him back something broken."

    Thomas Covenant, Unbeliever
  • kevinw729kevinw729 Posts: 4,502 Valuable Player
    snowdog said:
    .....
    Now they MAY have decided to postpone the release of the CV2 from this year to three year's time when the technology is ready and is cheap enough to produce without releasing a headset until 2022, but I think they were planning on continuing the CV1 until 2020, 2021 or 2022.

    Abrash has said that the tech in Half Dome won't be ready until 2022 at last year's Oculus Connect and I think the original plan in 2016 was to release it this year so Oculus have produced a stopgap with the Rift S until the tech is ready in three years time.

    Wow @Snowdog - that is a modification on your previous stance, I appreciate you being so even handed now, and admitting that things 'May" have changed. I stand by my opinion on the reality of the time line for a possible CV2 - and also include the caveat that all companies have "plans" its just which ones they execute on and at what time. I am sure the previous Ex-CEO was adamant that the CV2 he was envisaging was going to happen until the Ridt-S plan was dumped on him and he decided to leave than support it.

    It will be fascinating to see how much the Rift-S will change from the GDC reveal based on the feedback they are collecting. Speaking with one close to the operation it sounds like the earphones will make it into the final design - so someone is listening. I still feel however that much rests on market reaction to Quest, especially knowing that Samsung will be riding the GearVR image for their planned Standalone.
    P6ftmuw.jpg
    ** New Book **
    "The Out-of-Home Immersive Entertainment Frontier: Expanding Interactive Boundaries in Leisure Facilities"
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  • bigmike20vtbigmike20vt Posts: 3,825 Valuable Player
    @kevinw729 are you saying the riftS specs are not set in stone yet? That is surprising imo considering how close to launch we are (we are in the window already aren't we - spring?)
    Fiat Coupe, gone. 350Z gone. Dirty nappies, no sleep & practical transport incoming. Thank goodness for VR :)
  • dburnedburne Posts: 2,411 Valuable Player
    I think "tock" has definitely left the building, put away in some dark storage compartment with the door locked up.
    :'( 

    Now having said that, as much as I am disappointed with Oculus direction now, I will still likely get a Leno - er Rift S. Not for what I mainly use VR for though, wish it was but it will not be - I will be going with another brand for that, a brand that has PC-VR users in more of their strategic goals.  
    I will likely get the Rift S because I do still enjoy Oculus games, and see myself continuing to enjoy them - like with the upcoming Vador Immortal and Lone Echo 2. But I will use another headset for the bulk of what I do, namely flight simming.
    Don

    EVGA Z390 Dark MB | I9 9900k| EVGA 2080Ti FTW3 Ultra |32 GB G Skill 3200 cl14 ram | Warthog Throttle | VKB Gunfighter Pro/MCG Pro grip | Crosswind Pedals | EVGA DG 87 Case|
  • kevinw729kevinw729 Posts: 4,502 Valuable Player
    @kevinw729 are you saying the riftS specs are not set in stone yet? That is surprising imo considering how close to launch we are (we are in the window already aren't we - spring?)

    Totally agree - I was surprised when posts started that the company was listening to criticism and would consider changes to the final design to plicate concerns. I at first thought this was damage limitation, but one source assures me that an earphone solution has been added... we shall see?
    P6ftmuw.jpg
    ** New Book **
    "The Out-of-Home Immersive Entertainment Frontier: Expanding Interactive Boundaries in Leisure Facilities"
    https://www.amazon.co.uk/Out-Home-Immersive-Entertainment-Frontier/dp/1472426959
  • pyroth309pyroth309 Posts: 1,551 Valuable Player
    That was a great post @Zenbane. I don't want to quote it because it it's too long but that actually mirrors a lot of my thoughts. I think the main difference is that I actually really love simulations, especially combat simulators.

    A big barrier to my fully embracing and enjoying them is the fact that I am at a disadvantage from Target recognition because I can't clearly see what I am fighting against in the full realism games until they are close. After a while I get tired of fighting handcuffed and I just break out my track IR and go back to my 4K screen. It's very hard to see planes sneaking up on me or against the horizon in VR.  So for me resolution means a lot and I will pay for the upgrade. If you aren't into flight simulations or space games or driving games though, then functionally you really don't care that much and you're more interested in finding games that are just fun to play or have interesting mechanics. So I totally get that as well.

    Even though Oculus has done a great job providing a lot of content, most of what they have made has been too short to have any lasting impact in the grand scheme of things. So as you said we're stuck returning to games like Skyrim or fallout or subnautica etc. or one of the multiplayer lobby games like onward or Pavlov. It's definitely true that Valve has done little to help VR on the software side except provide a platform/steamvr for small devs to experiment on. I hope with them jumping in with an actual official Valve headset that they will start trying to push software and also I hope that they use their influence to convince more developers to support VR with their flat screen games. But you never know with Valve.

     I don't mind upgrading my PC itself because I still get use of it from flat screen gaming as I still do enjoy it. A couple of days ago I was wishing I had a 2080 TI to get my frames up in monster Hunter world with 4K texture pack with most settings on lol. 

     I think we're all in agreement about the software portion needing to be improved. You know there's been a lot of talk about Sony but even with their vast resources they are mostly putting out short experiences(barring a couple of exceptions). We're still in the proving grounds of VR as a viable long-term product. Most people still consider it a gimmick like the Kinect or something that's going to die soon. A lot of companies are still gun shy about making a big commitment to it until we know for certain that it's going to be around a long time. A lot of the cult hits though like beat saber and VR chat have done a lot to spread awareness on how good VR can be. I'm really expecting next generation to really blow up especially with Sony's commitment to a psvr 2. I think if they do it right and get a real tracking system they will be more inclined to spend more money on software and bigger titles. In the meantime I'm content to just get the best experience I can in simulations until good software arrives and more companies start developing games for both flat screen and VR. 

    Also, It's starting to happen more but I still think there needs to be a lot more crossover with flat screeners playing together so even though your friend may not have a VR headset you can still play the same game together. That's one of the best advertisements for VR is when they can see the things that you can do with your hands hopefully eventually feet.

    As far as rift-S (my phone always wants to type ass here lol, I didn't do it I swear) it has been covered here enough I don't really want to delve into that other than to say I have nothing against it other than feeling like it's priced a little high to start and it appears to signal a change of direction has mentioned.
  • ShocksOculusShocksOculus Posts: 377
    Trinity
    edited April 14

    I believe Oculus has hinted they would make an official addon headphones accessory for Rift-S (so it would release after Rift-S).  From the above discussion, that sounds to be the case and I'm glad they're doing it.

    I just hope the headphones are of the same quality as the existing CV1 headphones.

    **EDIT**
    @pyroth309 - Oculus is releasing 5 big Rift titles this year (with Asgard's Wrath stated to be a 30+ hour action RPG).  Even Respawn Entertainment (Call of Duty, Titanfall, Apex Legends [point being they make the top tier shooters]) is releasing an Oculus exclusive VR shooter this year.


    i7-7700k, GTX 1080Ti (11G) || MSI B150m (1 USB controller) + Inateck 4-port USB to PCIe (2nd USB controller)
    Oculus Rift S
    Oculus GO
    Oculus RIFT - 3 sensor Room-scale
  • snowdogsnowdog Posts: 6,753 Valuable Player
    edited April 14
    dburne said:
    I think "tock" has definitely left the building, put away in some dark storage compartment with the door locked up.
    :'( 

    Now having said that, as much as I am disappointed with Oculus direction now, I will still likely get a Leno - er Rift S. Not for what I mainly use VR for though, wish it was but it will not be - I will be going with another brand for that, a brand that has PC-VR users in more of their strategic goals.  
    I will likely get the Rift S because I do still enjoy Oculus games, and see myself continuing to enjoy them - like with the upcoming Vador Immortal and Lone Echo 2. But I will use another headset for the bulk of what I do, namely flight simming.

    Again, you don't spend that sort of money on something, show it at OC5 and then shelve it for 5-10 years until it becomes cheap enough to include on a $399 headset. Not unless you're insane. It'll be $599 in 2022 for the Tock and then $399 for the Tick in 2025. By that time we'll also start to see it appearing in their standalone headsets too.

    We'll see the CV2 releasing with features from the Half Dome prototype in 2022. We might not even see the varifocal feature until the next Tick in 2025.
    "This you have to understand. There's only one way to hurt a man who's lost everything. Give him back something broken."

    Thomas Covenant, Unbeliever
  • RedRizlaRedRizla Posts: 6,274 Valuable Player
    edited April 14

    I believe Oculus has hinted they would make an official addon headphones accessory for Rift-S (so it would release after Rift-S).  From the above discussion, that sounds to be the case and I'm glad they're doing it.

    I just hope the headphones are of the same quality as the existing CV1 headphones.


    Which is going to add to the cost no doubt and that isn't a good thing. Hopefully they just add these headphones to the box with Rift -S without a price increase. I don't want to start looking at £450 with headphones tbh. 
  • MradrMradr Posts: 3,348 Valuable Player
    edited April 14
    snowdog said:

    Again, you don't spend that sort of money on something, show it at OC5 and then shelve it for 5-10 years until it becomes cheap enough to include on a $399 headset. Not unless you're insane. It'll be $599 in 2022 for the Tock and then $399 for the Tick in 2025. By that time we'll also start to see it appearing in their standalone headsets too.

    We'll see the CV2 releasing with features from the Half Dome prototype in 2022. We might not even see the varifocal feature until the next Tick in 2025.
    But they did say they wont go above that 450$+ mark ~ unless they're lieing again or not being clear on their plans - that doesn't look likely. Instead - they will want to try and keep the jump from Quest2 to Rift S2 as close as they can meaning higher res screen (1440, 1620 per eye - aka - 3k) with more FOV (135). Eye tracking would require a bigger jump in resolution to 4k to make it worth and that seems unlikely to see 3 big leaps in one shot let alone 4. At this time - I feel like instead of PCVR getting the feature first - it'l be mobile first then move up to PCVR. This means we will be scaling with mobile hardware in what it can do vs what the PCVR hardware can do this way it fit most software. If that is the case - then instead of seeing eye tracking and 4k res in 2022  we will see it in 2025 instead.

    Also, yes companies do that all the time. They can either pay the money now to get a head in research - but if nothing is causing any computation then you can sit on that research and save a ton of money until something does. Intel does it all the time. Do you really think they don't have some cards up their sleeves? 

    Oculus could easily do this if they want to. Offering smaller jumps in between to keep the price low is how most of this works and will have people argue that keeping price low is the way to go because us (taking the words from CrashFu) we are rich snob boies for asking a slightly higher end headset.
  • LuluViBritanniaLuluViBritannia Posts: 462
    Trinity
    To say that Sony isn't any influence on the pc vr market makes me lol.
    Glad I made you laugh. Of course I assume it's a friendly laugh and not the usual disrespectful reaction we get on the net.
    Anyway, you didn't understand my point. I didn't say the PSVR was bad, only that Sony was not part of the PC VR market (given that the PSVR is on... console). The halo strap definitely comes from it though.

    For the headset itself, I always say the PSVR is not that bad. But people who say the visuals are close to the Rift... no, let's be real. Sim games clearly show the limit of the resolution in this headset: racing games are barely playable with it, you simply can't see far enough ^^'.
    No offense to your brother though. I have a brother as well, he never realizes when his games are laggy. Whenever he owns a new game, he tells me "I bought this, it's great, it runs very smooth", and when he shows it to me, it feels almost unplayable to me. My point is, brothers sometimes aren't very smart xD.


    kevinw729 said:
    It is going to be really hard for Indie and AAA game developers to consider their future VR development strategy:

    Do they support the Quest ecosystem.
    Do they support the Valve ecosystem.
    Do they create for independents like Pico and Samsung with their Standalones.
    Do they go high-end or do they go mobileVR (standalone) and with that support the best performance (Snapdragon 845 or higher), or work to backward convert their game to support SD835?
    Do they continue to support CV1 or VIVE?

    Or in reality, do they wait to see if Sony releases VR for PS5?

    That is the wisest message on this whole forum, thank you.
    This is the reality of the VR market right now: it's totally broken. This is due to the fact that so many actors joined in, in so little time. The technology (at least, this current wave) is barely 4 years old, but it has so many different ecosystems and they're all so different that you can't develop for all of them at once.

    As you said, it will only force devs to choose... or step aside to see how things evolve.
    OpenXR was the promise to put all those pieces together and make things easy for everyone. But not only does it take its time to come, it also won't solve it entirely. The PSVR will still have its own ecosystem. The Quest will still have its own library and will still have no official access to PC VR libraries. The devs will still have to choose.

    The worst thing is, this situation f*cked everyone up.
    - The game developers need to choose a "main" ecosystem or work extra hard to support everyone.
    - The VR actors have to ensure compatibility with their competitors' clients.
    - The potential consumers will be overwhelmed with so many choices they won't know how to choose.

    What should they do, now?
    Current VR results imo:
    - Great small apps. Great ports of bigger games.
    - Great VR-specific features. Not enough showcased!!!
    - Too many actors in the industry, the market is totally broken.


    My hopes for VR next gen:

    - Better ratio between visual quality and power needs. No more godrays and less SDE.
    - Full Body Tracking.


    "If you don't mind, do you want me to take you there? Where dreams come true."
  • pyroth309pyroth309 Posts: 1,551 Valuable Player

    **EDIT**
    @pyroth309 - Oculus is releasing 5 big Rift titles this year (with Asgard's Wrath stated to be a 30+ hour action RPG).  Even Respawn Entertainment (Call of Duty, Titanfall, Apex Legends [point being they make the top tier shooters]) is releasing an Oculus exclusive VR shooter this year.


    Yea I know, I meant up to this point. I hope what is coming is going to be excellent but I can't comment on it until I've played it.
  • inovatorinovator Posts: 1,852
    Project 2501
    To say that Sony isn't any influence on the pc vr market makes me lol.
    Glad I made you laugh. Of course I assume it's a friendly laugh and not the usual disrespectful reaction we get on the net.
    Anyway, you didn't understand my point. I didn't say the PSVR was bad, only that Sony was not part of the PC VR market (given that the PSVR is on... console). The halo strap definitely comes from it though.

    For the headset itself, I always say the PSVR is not that bad. But people who say the visuals are close to the Rift... no, let's be real. Sim games clearly show the limit of the resolution in this headset: racing games are barely playable with it, you simply can't see far enough ^^'.
    No offense to your brother though. I have a brother as well, he never realizes when his games are laggy. Whenever he owns a new game, he tells me "I bought this, it's great, it runs very smooth", and when he shows it to me, it feels almost unplayable to me. My point is, brothers sometimes aren't very smart xD.


    kevinw729 said:
    It is going to be really hard for Indie and AAA game developers to consider their future VR development strategy:

    Do they support the Quest ecosystem.
    Do they support the Valve ecosystem.
    Do they create for independents like Pico and Samsung with their Standalones.
    Do they go high-end or do they go mobileVR (standalone) and with that support the best performance (Snapdragon 845 or higher), or work to backward convert their game to support SD835?
    Do they continue to support CV1 or VIVE?

    Or in reality, do they wait to see if Sony releases VR for PS5?

    That is the wisest message on this whole forum, thank you.
    This is the reality of the VR market right now: it's totally broken. This is due to the fact that so many actors joined in, in so little time. The technology (at least, this current wave) is barely 4 years old, but it has so many different ecosystems and they're all so different that you can't develop for all of them at once.

    As you said, it will only force devs to choose... or step aside to see how things evolve.
    OpenXR was the promise to put all those pieces together and make things easy for everyone. But not only does it take its time to come, it also won't solve it entirely. The PSVR will still have its own ecosystem. The Quest will still have its own library and will still have no official access to PC VR libraries. The devs will still have to choose.

    The worst thing is, this situation f*cked everyone up.
    - The game developers need to choose a "main" ecosystem or work extra hard to support everyone.
    - The VR actors have to ensure compatibility with their competitors' clients.
    - The potential consumers will be overwhelmed with so many choices they won't know how to choose.

    To be fair I use a Playstation pro that may make enough of a difference for some of me opinions I made.
  • MradrMradr Posts: 3,348 Valuable Player
    edited April 14
    snowdog said:

    So what do you think Abrash will show and say at OC6? Nothing? Or the Half Dome prototype again and tell us that instead of 2022 we can expect it in 2025 or maybe even 2028 on their standalone and PC VR headsets..? That's not going to happen.

    Feel free to watch OC6 in 5 or 6 months and then start a thread called, 'Yup, the snowdog was right...I bow down to his infinite wisdom'

     B) 

    Oculus aren't going to fall behind too much in terms of technology, but they WILL delay things until the technology is READY. We've already seen this with the Vive controllers and Touch controllers.

    Other companies will have higher resolution displays, higher FOV, eye tracking and foveated rendering before Oculus do, but Oculus will do it BETTER and CHEAPER.
    Well they can SHOW anything - it doesn't mean it'll come out as we saw with last OC. So the argument there doesn't hold as much water as it would've in the past. Not that it can't happen - but as I said above - I dont think their goal is the same as it was just a year ago.

    Most of what OC6 will be about is Quest, Software, and how devs need to work hard to get their games onto it and working with the limits of the current vision tracking along with porting from PC over to it.

    As for demo of the future - they will go more into what they are working on - planning on in the future - an updated half dome - more information in how far they got with focal point technology and FOVA that information out. Short of that - we wont know anything else. I mean we wont know as much as we did last OC5. We will know they they are working on a GO2 but lack any information on if and when something might come out with them being vage again saying, "With in the next 5, 10, 15 years we will see xxx, xxxx, xxx-xxx".

    I am not saying they are behind - base off my past post - they are very much a head - so they might be sitting on that research to, as you said, wait till it gets cheaper. Over all - their focus right now is Quest and its very clear they want it to be a success for the future of VR.
  • inovatorinovator Posts: 1,852
    Project 2501
    I would like to see a huge adventure game made for the quest rather than dumbed down for it from the rift. If it sells well that will happen.
  • MowTinMowTin Posts: 1,502
    Project 2501
    The bottom line is: If you're an enthusiast, Oculus is not for you. And don't hold your breath for a cv2. 

    Only Valve can save us now. 
  • kojackkojack Posts: 5,294 Volunteer Moderator

    RedRizla said:
    I'm just curious to know if we have had some bullshit thrown our way by Oculus. They kept saying they weren't abandoning PC -VR, but they have certainly made it look like it's not a priority by leaving Rift -S to Lenovo.
    Although there's another way to look at that:
    Oculus had Xiaomi make the Go, while they worked on the superior Quest themselves.
    Oculus had Lenovo make the Rift-S, while they __________.

    Did working with Samsung mean they abandoned mobile?
    Did working with Xiaomi mean they abandoned mobile?




  • dburnedburne Posts: 2,411 Valuable Player
    edited April 14
    There will be nothing at OC6 regarding another PC-VR headset, only talk of the Rift S and software for it.
    Mark my words.
    ;)

    The rest will be about Quest and continuing software development for it, and to some extent Go.
    Don

    EVGA Z390 Dark MB | I9 9900k| EVGA 2080Ti FTW3 Ultra |32 GB G Skill 3200 cl14 ram | Warthog Throttle | VKB Gunfighter Pro/MCG Pro grip | Crosswind Pedals | EVGA DG 87 Case|
  • inovatorinovator Posts: 1,852
    Project 2501
    Probably true. Oculus will be the mainstream product. The other will hopefully take care of the rest.
  • CrashFuCrashFu Posts: 1,756 Valuable Player
    MowTin said:
    The bottom line is: If you're an enthusiast, Oculus is not for you. And don't hold your breath for a cv2. 

    Only Valve can save us now. 
    Because nothing says "Enthusiast" like getting your hardware from a company that is less than 1% invested in your hobby, and that has a proven track-record of abandoning their products immediately after release.

    Yep, that totally screams "Enthusiast" and not "Making rash, knee-jerk decisions in response to blind speculation"  :wink:

    It's hard being the voice of reason when you're surrounded by unreasonable people.
  • RedRizlaRedRizla Posts: 6,274 Valuable Player
    edited April 15
    kojack said:

    RedRizla said:
    I'm just curious to know if we have had some bullshit thrown our way by Oculus. They kept saying they weren't abandoning PC -VR, but they have certainly made it look like it's not a priority by leaving Rift -S to Lenovo.
    Although there's another way to look at that:
    Oculus had Xiaomi make the Go, while they worked on the superior Quest themselves.
    Oculus had Lenovo make the Rift-S, while they __________.

    Did working with Samsung mean they abandoned mobile?
    Did working with Xiaomi mean they abandoned mobile?





    How long do you reckon Oculus Rift -S has being in development? I thought that once Oculus released CV1, PC -VR, that Oculus would have started straight away looking at the next best PC -VR headset. All the talk was about Oculus Santa Cruz though, which I presume is Oculus Quest.

    I don't think Rift -S hasn't being in development for that long at all given the first thing we heard about it was when that guy left Oculus and Tech Crunch speculated it was because of a Rift -S. I'd never heard of a Rift -S up until that point. So did a lot of thought go in to Rift -S is what I wonder. 

    I know Oculus admitted Oculus GO was something they didn't expect would be such a success, and that it could have been designed better.

    I just want the best bang for buck PC -VR headset, but at the end of the day I guess we will know which one that is next month.
  • snowdogsnowdog Posts: 6,753 Valuable Player
    Mradr said:
    snowdog said:

    So what do you think Abrash will show and say at OC6? Nothing? Or the Half Dome prototype again and tell us that instead of 2022 we can expect it in 2025 or maybe even 2028 on their standalone and PC VR headsets..? That's not going to happen.

    Feel free to watch OC6 in 5 or 6 months and then start a thread called, 'Yup, the snowdog was right...I bow down to his infinite wisdom'

     B) 

    Oculus aren't going to fall behind too much in terms of technology, but they WILL delay things until the technology is READY. We've already seen this with the Vive controllers and Touch controllers.

    Other companies will have higher resolution displays, higher FOV, eye tracking and foveated rendering before Oculus do, but Oculus will do it BETTER and CHEAPER.
    Well they can SHOW anything - it doesn't mean it'll come out as we saw with last OC. So the argument there doesn't hold as much water as it would've in the past. Not that it can't happen - but as I said above - I dont think their goal is the same as it was just a year ago.

    Most of what OC6 will be about is Quest, Software, and how devs need to work hard to get their games onto it and working with the limits of the current vision tracking along with porting from PC over to it.

    As for demo of the future - they will go more into what they are working on - planning on in the future - an updated half dome - more information in how far they got with focal point technology and FOVA that information out. Short of that - we wont know anything else. I mean we wont know as much as we did last OC5. We will know they they are working on a GO2 but lack any information on if and when something might come out with them being vage again saying, "With in the next 5, 10, 15 years we will see xxx, xxxx, xxx-xxx".

    I am not saying they are behind - base off my past post - they are very much a head - so they might be sitting on that research to, as you said, wait till it gets cheaper. Over all - their focus right now is Quest and its very clear they want it to be a success for the future of VR.

    If you think for even a split second that Oculus won't release the Half Dome prototype as a consumer headset until 2025-2028 then you're insane. Seriously.

    And they're not focussing on the Quest only, they're developing ALL THREE of their product lines simultaneously. This is why you're seeing all three headsets sharing certain features. You'll see F8 and OC6 covering the Quest, the Rift S and the Half Dome prototype.
    "This you have to understand. There's only one way to hurt a man who's lost everything. Give him back something broken."

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  • MradrMradr Posts: 3,348 Valuable Player
    edited April 14
    snowdog said:
    If you think for even a split second that Oculus won't release the Half Dome prototype as a consumer headset until 2025-2028 then you're insane. Seriously.

    And they're not focussing on the Quest only, they're developing ALL THREE of their product lines simultaneously. This is why you're seeing all three headsets sharing certain features. You'll see F8 and OC6 covering the Quest, the Rift S and the Half Dome prototype.
    I gave a reason why that is so:) They are going to focus on smaller jumps if they keep in that price point. Base on the interviews - that seems to be the way they are wanting to go. The dude said that there isn't a market for anything above 450... what we want will just not fit into that price point let alone your higher price goes against what they said. Granted - if you are on my side - that is SILLY and I hope they release another HMD for us higher end value customers. People like CrashFu on the other hand says I am crazy for wanting this - so I don't know what to tell anyone at this point xD So if you are liking or saying his post are awesome - then you agree with him that they need to keep prices low and there for - that means we have to wait longer for bigger jumps in better specs and features. If you agree with me - then you believe Oculus should still release a headset in the 800-600- range still if we're on the edge of a big advancement anyways (see my example a few pages ago).

    https://translate.google.com/translate?depth=3&hl=de&nv=1&rurl=translate.google.com&sl=auto&sp=nmt4&tl=en&u=https://www.computerbase.de/2019-04/oculus-kein-high-end-vr-headset/&xid=17259,15700021,15700043,15700186,15700191,15700253,15700256,15700259
    High-end does not fit the corporate philosophy....

    Jason expects that a Rift-style headset with better technical specifications, priced at over € 449, would find virtually no buyers for the Oculus Rift S. Many people could not connect such a product and is therefore not pursued.

    Well - they kind of are though. Maybe not all 100% - but still a good 80-85% right now. Look at most Quest and Rift S interviews - they came out and said they were working on Quest - because their team is small - they gave the extra work of Rift S to LVO team instead so they can focus more on it. That is coming from Oculus own mouths. Remember, Quest isn't out yet - they still have a TON of work a head of them to lunch and get these devices into the hands of customers. Not just customers - but devs as well to get them start and working on software for the Quest too. It's not different back in OC4 where they focus on GO software. I mean we have a short history of how things went already.

    Unless they say something at F8 this year - I am not holding my breath for another 3 years just to find out:) Over all - I think they're going to go down this rout until either someone makes a big threat to their HMDs lines and they are force to show their hand or enough people leave the Oculus ecosystem. Valve might be a big enough threat for them to show their plans going forward at least for F8 or force them to say they are working on a CV2 with an idea release time frame. It's that - or they really did give up on PCVR and will just focus on mainstream VR with Quest and just throw PCVR a headset once in a while to keep their hands in all the pies as best as possible.

    Over all I don't like that Jason Rubin guy. He either is lieing about the 450 range or just really bad communication on his part. Until Oculus says more - we really don't know what is going on and we're getting mix signals on what to think about the future of Oculus and PCVR.
  • pyroth309pyroth309 Posts: 1,551 Valuable Player
    edited April 14
    Mradr said:

    Unless they say something at F8 this year - I am not holding my breath for another 3 years just to find out:)
    Yea, this, I could be dead in 3 years. Life's short and I've had too many people I know die unexpectedly.

    Corporations regularly change directions and waste millions on R&D that never sees the light of day. Just because they showed off a prototype a year ago doesn't mean it's guaranteed to come out, especially with so much change among management. Hell the company I work for spent nearly 300 million on a project that never got completed and is nowhere near as large as Facebook.

    Not saying Oculus won't come out with it, but I'm not confident they will either.
  • inovatorinovator Posts: 1,852
    Project 2501
    edited April 14

    There are members here that are in denial of what is happening and how Oculus is planning it's future. Time will show us all.
  • ZenbaneZenbane Posts: 14,111 Valuable Player
    edited April 14
    inovator said:

    There are members here that are in denial of what is happening and how Oculus is planning it's future. Time will show us all.

    Don't start insulting forum members personally. Especially in your case. You're probably the least impactful voice, but you tend to be the first to try to ridicule others. Stick to the topic as best you can so that we can all maintain a healthy dialogue.

    People are not necessarily in denial, they just have a different perspective. The concept of "different perspectives" isn't that hard to grasp.
    Are you a fan of the Myst games? Check out my Mod at http://www.mystrock.com/
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