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The Index thread (please keep to subject)

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  • RuneSR2RuneSR2 Posts: 4,908 Valuable Player
    RedRizla said:
    I'm trying to figure out why no company has released a VR headset that has the following. HP Reverb or Index Resolution, PlayStation or Oculus DK2 lenses, Oculus CV1 controllers and Light houses for tracking. A headset like this would be cheaper than Valve index and could probably sell for £700 or less. I'm still waiting for a VR headset like this to arrive.



    Oculus doesn't want external tracking, Sony needs everything to be extremely inexpensive, I don't know why HP went for WMR - maybe because MS is there to help and provide a platform. If Oculus was open to other hmds, I think HP could have chosen a different path (=much better controllers). 
    Index is great, but there's glare in dark games much like CV1. When using 144 Hz, big fov and bright games, I don't think Index has much real competition, but that'll require probably a RTX 3080 Ti or better in demanding games. For current and older games made for oled - and there are many such games - I'm not disagreeing with the dude who took this picture that he's got the most optimal solution for current games:



    Intel i7 7700K (4.5 GHz); MSI GeForce GTX 1080 8GB Gaming X (oc 2100 MHz gpu boost, 11 GHz mem speed); 16GB Corsair Vengeance LPX DDR4 3200 MHz; MSI Z270I Gaming Pro Carbon AC (VR-Ready) mainboard; Samsung 960 Evo M.2 SSD + Toshiba P300 HD; Windows 10 OS; Valve Index and Oculus Rift CV1 - the latter nearly always using super sampling 2.0. 

    "Ask not what VR can do for you – ask what you can do for VR"
  • Shadowmask72Shadowmask72 Posts: 4,045 Valuable Player
    edited February 24
    I sold the Index on its own last month for a very low price. Keeping controllers for Pimax 8KX whenever that arrives.


    System Specs: RTX 2080 ti , i9 9900K CPU, 16 GB DDR 4 RAM, Win 10 64 Bit OS.
  • RedRizlaRedRizla Posts: 6,989 Valuable Player
    edited February 24
    RuneSR2 said:
    RedRizla said:
    I'm trying to figure out why no company has released a VR headset that has the following. HP Reverb or Index Resolution, PlayStation or Oculus DK2 lenses, Oculus CV1 controllers and Light houses for tracking. A headset like this would be cheaper than Valve index and could probably sell for £700 or less. I'm still waiting for a VR headset like this to arrive.



    Oculus doesn't want external tracking, Sony needs everything to be extremely inexpensive, I don't know why HP went for WMR - maybe because MS is there to help and provide a platform. If Oculus was open to other hmds, I think HP could have chosen a different path (=much better controllers). 
    Index is great, but there's glare in dark games much like CV1. When using 144 Hz, big fov and bright games, I don't think Index has much real competition, but that'll require probably a RTX 3080 Ti or better in demanding games. For current and older games made for oled - and there are many such games - I'm not disagreeing with the dude who took this picture that he's got the most optimal solution for current games:




    I wasn't specifically talking about Oculus making the headset. I was asking why no other company had made a VR headset based on the things I've mentioned. Not only would it make the VR headset cheaper, but it would also make it the best VR headset out there.

    I appreciate finger tracking is cool and all, but it's expensive when added to controllers and just adds to the cost of the VR bundle. Lots of people are put off by the price of the Valve index, so maybe Valve should have also made some knuckles without the finger sensors. That would have allowed them to sell a much cheaper VR bundle, but for some reason these companies don't think like that. It's either too cheap with not enough features, or it's too expensive with things that are unnecessary at this stage.

    1) PlayStation lenses = No Glare.
    2) light House tracking = Great tracking.
    3) Oculus Controls = Good controllers and makes the VR bundle a lot cheaper.
    4) Higher Res displays = Makes VR look a lot better LOL.

    All the above could be done for around £700 or less. All the above would be a must buy VR headset for me if it existed :D
  • OmegaM4NOmegaM4N Posts: 695
    Neo
    ^^That is the setup i am heading towards, minus the wireless as i don't need it due to already have plenty of external cable......but i like the modular aspect of that mix and match, so knuckles next for me then if nothing new shows this year then i will grab a Vive pro hmd and that should finish my setup and see me happy for a few years. :)
  • RuneSR2RuneSR2 Posts: 4,908 Valuable Player
    RedRizla said:
    RuneSR2 said:
    RedRizla said:
    I'm trying to figure out why no company has released a VR headset that has the following. HP Reverb or Index Resolution, PlayStation or Oculus DK2 lenses, Oculus CV1 controllers and Light houses for tracking. A headset like this would be cheaper than Valve index and could probably sell for £700 or less. I'm still waiting for a VR headset like this to arrive.



    Oculus doesn't want external tracking, Sony needs everything to be extremely inexpensive, I don't know why HP went for WMR - maybe because MS is there to help and provide a platform. If Oculus was open to other hmds, I think HP could have chosen a different path (=much better controllers). 
    Index is great, but there's glare in dark games much like CV1. When using 144 Hz, big fov and bright games, I don't think Index has much real competition, but that'll require probably a RTX 3080 Ti or better in demanding games. For current and older games made for oled - and there are many such games - I'm not disagreeing with the dude who took this picture that he's got the most optimal solution for current games:




    I wasn't specifically talking about Oculus making the headset. I was asking why no other company had made a VR headset based on the things I've mentioned. Not only would it make the VR headset cheaper, but it would also make it the best VR headset out there.

    I appreciate finger tracking is cool and all, but it's expensive when added to controllers and just adds to the cost of the VR bundle. Lots of people are put off by the price of the Valve index, so maybe Valve should have also made some knuckles without the finger sensors. That would have allowed them to sell a much cheaper VR bundle, but for some reason these companies don't think like that. It's either too cheap with not enough features, or it's too expensive with things that are unnecessary at this stage.

    1) PlayStation lenses = No Glare.
    2) light House tracking = Great tracking.
    3) Oculus Controls = Good controllers and makes the VR bundle a lot cheaper.
    4) Higher Res displays = Makes VR look a lot better LOL.

    All the above could be done for around £700 or less. All the above would be a must buy VR headset for me if it existed :D
    Knuckles are slightly more complicated - maybe finger tracking is the most advanced feature - but to me it's just as much the pressure sensitive grip function - and the trackpad:

    I know I've shown it before, but the squeeze function is really awesome:



    - and the trackpads have haptic feedback - which is used in Garden of the Sea. But for now finger tracking is the only thing used in many games, while pressure sensitive grip function could mean a whole new level of interactivity if implemented correctly. I do hope it can be used in Alyx...
    Intel i7 7700K (4.5 GHz); MSI GeForce GTX 1080 8GB Gaming X (oc 2100 MHz gpu boost, 11 GHz mem speed); 16GB Corsair Vengeance LPX DDR4 3200 MHz; MSI Z270I Gaming Pro Carbon AC (VR-Ready) mainboard; Samsung 960 Evo M.2 SSD + Toshiba P300 HD; Windows 10 OS; Valve Index and Oculus Rift CV1 - the latter nearly always using super sampling 2.0. 

    "Ask not what VR can do for you – ask what you can do for VR"
  • RedRizlaRedRizla Posts: 6,989 Valuable Player
    edited February 25
    RuneSR2 said:
    RedRizla said:
    RuneSR2 said:
    RedRizla said:
    I'm trying to figure out why no company has released a VR headset that has the following. HP Reverb or Index Resolution, PlayStation or Oculus DK2 lenses, Oculus CV1 controllers and Light houses for tracking. A headset like this would be cheaper than Valve index and could probably sell for £700 or less. I'm still waiting for a VR headset like this to arrive.



    Oculus doesn't want external tracking, Sony needs everything to be extremely inexpensive, I don't know why HP went for WMR - maybe because MS is there to help and provide a platform. If Oculus was open to other hmds, I think HP could have chosen a different path (=much better controllers). 
    Index is great, but there's glare in dark games much like CV1. When using 144 Hz, big fov and bright games, I don't think Index has much real competition, but that'll require probably a RTX 3080 Ti or better in demanding games. For current and older games made for oled - and there are many such games - I'm not disagreeing with the dude who took this picture that he's got the most optimal solution for current games:




    I wasn't specifically talking about Oculus making the headset. I was asking why no other company had made a VR headset based on the things I've mentioned. Not only would it make the VR headset cheaper, but it would also make it the best VR headset out there.

    I appreciate finger tracking is cool and all, but it's expensive when added to controllers and just adds to the cost of the VR bundle. Lots of people are put off by the price of the Valve index, so maybe Valve should have also made some knuckles without the finger sensors. That would have allowed them to sell a much cheaper VR bundle, but for some reason these companies don't think like that. It's either too cheap with not enough features, or it's too expensive with things that are unnecessary at this stage.

    1) PlayStation lenses = No Glare.
    2) light House tracking = Great tracking.
    3) Oculus Controls = Good controllers and makes the VR bundle a lot cheaper.
    4) Higher Res displays = Makes VR look a lot better LOL.

    All the above could be done for around £700 or less. All the above would be a must buy VR headset for me if it existed :D
    Knuckles are slightly more complicated - maybe finger tracking is the most advanced feature - but to me it's just as much the pressure sensitive grip function - and the trackpad:

    I know I've shown it before, but the squeeze function is really awesome:



    - and the trackpads have haptic feedback - which is used in Garden of the Sea. But for now finger tracking is the only thing used in many games, while pressure sensitive grip function could mean a whole new level of interactivity if implemented correctly. I do hope it can be used in Alyx...

    The problem is, finger tracking will be useless if Valve index doesn't sell to the masses and it won't sell to the masses at the price it's at now. Finger tracking on controllers makes VR more expensive and should have come when VR headsets became more popular. That's unless you can do something like the Oculus Quest has done and make finger tracking available at no extra cost using a camera.

    What VR needs right now is a decent VR headset for around £600 to £700 and there isn't one out there. Well that's that's just my opinion and it's the VR headset I'm still holding out for after a 3 year wait. I had hoped HTC Cosmos would be worth a look but sadly it's pants. I want a VR headset to work out of the box or it goes straight back to the shop never to be purchased again. I'm not a beta tester for these companies unless they want to pay me for the feedback :)  
  • RuneSR2RuneSR2 Posts: 4,908 Valuable Player
    I fully agree that Index price may limit finger tracking adoption - but it seems that PS5VR may support finger tracking too:

    psvr 2 controller
    https://uploadvr.com/sony-psvr-2-controller-patent/

    I have much more faith in Sony promoting finger tracking than Valve - although Valve did make the very smart move of letting Knuckles compatible with Vive and base stations 1.0. You can just buy Knuckles if you have an old and dusty OG Vive and suddenly you have full finger tracking and more (and a free Alyx game). Also Pimax has added support for Knuckles - but I have no idea how widespread Knuckles adoption has become, but surely Valve may sell a lot more Knuckles than hmds... 

    Intel i7 7700K (4.5 GHz); MSI GeForce GTX 1080 8GB Gaming X (oc 2100 MHz gpu boost, 11 GHz mem speed); 16GB Corsair Vengeance LPX DDR4 3200 MHz; MSI Z270I Gaming Pro Carbon AC (VR-Ready) mainboard; Samsung 960 Evo M.2 SSD + Toshiba P300 HD; Windows 10 OS; Valve Index and Oculus Rift CV1 - the latter nearly always using super sampling 2.0. 

    "Ask not what VR can do for you – ask what you can do for VR"
  • RedRizlaRedRizla Posts: 6,989 Valuable Player
    @RuneSR2 - I very much doubt that the Sony controllers will be anywhere near as expensive as the Valve knuckles are. It's the price of the Knuckles that I'm talking about. They just make the Valve index kit too expensive for a lot of people and that's why I suggested they should have a kit without the finger tracking too.
  • RuneSR2RuneSR2 Posts: 4,908 Valuable Player
    RedRizla said:
    @RuneSR2 - I very much doubt that the Sony controllers will be anywhere near as expensive as the Valve knuckles are. It's the price of the Knuckles that I'm talking about. They just make the Valve index kit too expensive for a lot of people and that's why I suggested they should have a kit without the finger tracking too.

    Fully agree - my point was only that Sony may pave the way for PCVR finger tracking in general by releasing some cheap controllers with finger tracking - and this could increase the interest for such controllers among other PCVR hmd producers, hopefully. Not sure Valve will decrease Knuckles price anytime soon, they probably have problems making ends meet with all those RMAs, lol. 
    Intel i7 7700K (4.5 GHz); MSI GeForce GTX 1080 8GB Gaming X (oc 2100 MHz gpu boost, 11 GHz mem speed); 16GB Corsair Vengeance LPX DDR4 3200 MHz; MSI Z270I Gaming Pro Carbon AC (VR-Ready) mainboard; Samsung 960 Evo M.2 SSD + Toshiba P300 HD; Windows 10 OS; Valve Index and Oculus Rift CV1 - the latter nearly always using super sampling 2.0. 

    "Ask not what VR can do for you – ask what you can do for VR"
  • RuneSR2RuneSR2 Posts: 4,908 Valuable Player
    edited February 26
    Waltz of the Wizards has just been optimized for 144Hz - it's working even if you have a GTX 970!

    Scavenger update & the future of Waltz of the Wizard

    Valve Index 144Hz optimizations

    Those who follow us will know that we focus heavily on presence and immersion and an important part of that is high refresh rates and believable reaction times. VR is still pretty far from the timescale of reality, but we’re getting closer! Most Valve Index users can now run Waltz of the Wizard natively at 144hz for a stronger perceptual illusion of reality. This is, of course, in addition to the native support of natural hand interactions with Index controllers.



    The new graphical options in the settings menu are simplified for low, medium and high — and the lowest setting should enable 144hz for a big portion of low-end hardware. In our internal testing we have run Waltz natively at 144hz on the highest graphical setting on a GTX970 GPU and i7-4790 CPU. We’d love feedback on this so let us know what you think and what hardware you use to run Waltz at 144hz.

    Lower end hardware & laptops

    With the optimizations we’ve made Waltz of the Wizard should now be able to run on an even broader range of hardware at higher fidelity. For example, although this remains untested, even recent MacBooks should be able to run Waltz of the Wizard using dual-boot with Windows. We would love to hear if you try it on any type of laptop. While the early days of consumer VR weren’t very laptop friendly, we think the optimizations developers have made in recent years along with simplified setup with things like Oculus Quest and Link are making it a more viable option for a certain group of users.






    Release notes

    New content
    • Scavenger hunt - Embark on a new quest to discover what Skully’s hiding.
    • Experimental microphone input option (real-time echo for enhanced presence).
    • Magical ear trumpet - Magical device that reveals secrets from cursed artifacts.
    • Music box - Add some musical ambience to your magical journey.
    • Wands - Cast magic with a flick.
    • Wall Cabinet - Secret compartment that beckons to be unlocked.
    • Multiple objects (Statues, individual books, spirit bottles, jars and hats).
    • Added locomotion to all teleport scenes.
    • Multiple new Skully reactions.
    • Overhaul of impact audio.
    • Added realtime lights to the lantern.
    • Accessibility option added to menu for increasing or lowering player height.


    Optimizations and other changes
    • Major overall performance increase (144Hz on Index).
    • Improved loading times.
    • Overhaul of magical effects and particles.
    • Environmental lighting and effects greatly improved.
    • Quality settings added.
    • Experimental modes added to the menu, containing: Troll mode (second screen co-op), mic input reverb, smooth camera mode (second screen smoothing for better in-game screen capture).
    • Multiple bug fixes and improvements.
    • Improved post-processing and enabled HDR.
    Intel i7 7700K (4.5 GHz); MSI GeForce GTX 1080 8GB Gaming X (oc 2100 MHz gpu boost, 11 GHz mem speed); 16GB Corsair Vengeance LPX DDR4 3200 MHz; MSI Z270I Gaming Pro Carbon AC (VR-Ready) mainboard; Samsung 960 Evo M.2 SSD + Toshiba P300 HD; Windows 10 OS; Valve Index and Oculus Rift CV1 - the latter nearly always using super sampling 2.0. 

    "Ask not what VR can do for you – ask what you can do for VR"
  • Comrade_IvanComrade_Ivan Posts: 107
    Art3mis
    I already posted this on a Quest forum, but I thought I'd link the vid in here as well cause of the whole Index thing in the vid too (index part starts at 17:05).

    TLDR: In terms of hours spent in VR, Index is my main headset. But I'll be a hypocrite and boldly say that Quest is still the best first choice for a new VR user (mainly due to its modability - e.g. the 15 degree FOV increase hack):


  • RuneSR2RuneSR2 Posts: 4,908 Valuable Player
    Something is brewing in Mordor, or is it New Shire  :D 

    Introducing SteamVR Version 1.10
    "The Dashboard Update" (1.10.20)


    Update Highlights

    Today’s update features an improved Dashboard that gets you into your games quickly.

    The new dashboard is closer and curved for increased clarity, and presents a recent games list for jumping in right away. Desktop View now features individually resizable monitors, easier access to the keyboard, and a lights-off mode for enhanced contrast.

    Full Update Notes


    SteamVR Dashboard:
    • All-new dashboard, including an updated quick launcher.
    • Moved dashboard closer and added curvature.
    • Convenience feature: Quickly change volume by dragging left/right on the dashboard volume button.
    • Moved Dashboard Settings into Dashboard Page (advanced).
    • Added Dashboard position control (advanced)
    • Added Dashboard Settings to toggle UI elements.
    • Dashboard is re-positioned when you put on the HMD.
    • Refined keyboard appearance
    • Added a three second countdown before resetting the seated tracking origin through the dashboard.
    • Fixed face mouse on any headset using the generic_hmd controller type. (That is essentially every headset that doesn’t have a button, so Windows Mixed Reality and some others.).
    • Fix dashboard overlay tabs still showing even if vr::VROverlayFlags_VisibleInDashboard is false.
    • Fixed bug in IVROverlay::GetPrimaryDashboardDevice (returning the wrong thing when non-controller buttons brings up the dashboard for the first time ).
    • Fixed long messages sent to IVROverlay::ShowMessageOverlay cutting off the text and pushing the buttons off the bottom of the overlay for very long messages.
    • Fix list of overlays in “choose startup overlay apps” in the startup/shutdown settings.
    • Hid base station and camera rendering while the dashboard is visible.
    • Added Library welcome screen (when no games are installed).
    • Performance improvements while dashboard is visible.
    • Added haptic binding for Touch controllers in VR Dashboard.


    SteamVR Desktop View:
    • Split Desktop View into individual tabs for each system display.
    • Desktop View remembers the most recently viewed desktop.
    • Easier double clicking (laser mouse position is locked during clicks).
    • Added per-desktop scale control.
    • Added button to toggle keyboard.
    • Added “lights-off” mode.
    • Added support for swapped left/right primary mouse buttons.
    • Automatically detects changes in monitor topology.
    • Improved I-Beam cursor on high-DPI displays.
    • Enabled desktop view for monitors attached to a non-HMD GPU.


    SteamVR:
    • Restore texture size round to multiple of 4 for WindowsMR HMDs in GetRecommendedRenderTargetSize.
    • Settings UI supersample settings show the rounded resolution to match the internal behavior.
    • Fix “do not disturb” setting for notifications not taking effect until restart.
    • Fixed a bug where audio mirroring would not stay disabled after a SteamVR restart
    • Smoothed editor app connections by letting them send connection details through vr_init.
    • Lighthouse controllers and trackers can now go to the idle and standby states even if the HMD has not gone into standby. Fixed a bug where controllers could bounce between standby and active multiple times.
    • Fix a case where SteamVR would “forget” that an Unreal game was running after about a minute of playtime.
    • Added Overlay Render Quality Setting (Settings -> Video Advanced)
    • Fixed a crash bug in Room Setup
    • Fixed a crash bug in the Tutorial
    • Added cosmos support to the Tutorial
    • Updated some of the visuals and audio levels in the Tutorial
    • The Tutorial will no longer automatically start for headsets that have their own runtimes and chaperone, including Oculus Rift and Windows Mixed Reality. The Tutorial can still be started manually. Users with these headsets will instead see an overlay demonstrating how to access the SteamVR dashboard the first time they use SteamVR.
    • Performance improvements.


    SteamVR Home:
    • Fixed voice chat.
    • Fix for showing render models for generic tracked objects (e.g. Logitech Stylus).
    • Fixed rendering issues with the glow selection effect.
    • Fixed haptics triggered from scripts from being sent to all players.
    • Fixed missing help strings in tools.
    • Fixed some cases of unstable physics.
    • Fixed Rift-only tools crash.
    • Tools: Added option for map creators to bake lighting into textures.
    • Tools: Enabled cubemap fog.
    • Performance improvements.


    SteamVR Input:
    • Added “max zone” support to thumbsticks and trackpads. This is a region at the edge of the range that defines where 1.0 is.
    • Added dead zone support for trackpads to match thumbsticks.
    • Added “exponent” support for thumbsticks and trackpads. This lets a binding file control the curve of values between the deadzone and the max zone.
    • Added support for keeping a button “pressed” until the user stops touching that button. This can be useful in cases where the button needs to be pressed for a long time and holding the physical button down would cause fatigue.
    • Improved the performance of IVRInput::GetDigitalActionData and IVRInput::GetAnalogActionData.
    • Added descriptive tool-tips to multiple items in the Binding UI.
    • Added new Vive tracker roles for Knees and Elbows.
    • Added debugger to help developers and controller binding authors diagnose input issues with applications. To enable this option, turn on input debugging in developer settings, and then click the “Input Debugger” button in the controller settings.
    • Added Windows Mixed Reality controllers to the list of controller types that can be edited when the controller isn't physically present. This requires the Windows Mixed Reality driver to be installed, but does not require that any Windows Mixed Reality hardware be connected to the PC.
    • Fixed tracker positions not working for trackers that were configured to anything other than left or right hand.
    • Added ability to specify default legacy bindings via an action manifest via the boolean ‘legacy_binding_manifest’ node.
    • Fix a crash when an application manifest is corrupt.
    • Fixed applications failing to launch properly that were missing an ‘action_sets’ member in their action manifest.


    Linux:
    • Fixed a case where the dashboard would disappear.
    • Fixed a vrwebhelper crash on shutdown.
    • Fixed the 'Restart SteamVR' and other URL based shortcuts that are part of the new settings interface.


    Index
    • Max brightness extended to 160.


    Oculus:
    • Added headset icons for Oculus Quest.
    Intel i7 7700K (4.5 GHz); MSI GeForce GTX 1080 8GB Gaming X (oc 2100 MHz gpu boost, 11 GHz mem speed); 16GB Corsair Vengeance LPX DDR4 3200 MHz; MSI Z270I Gaming Pro Carbon AC (VR-Ready) mainboard; Samsung 960 Evo M.2 SSD + Toshiba P300 HD; Windows 10 OS; Valve Index and Oculus Rift CV1 - the latter nearly always using super sampling 2.0. 

    "Ask not what VR can do for you – ask what you can do for VR"
  • Hiro_Protag0nistHiro_Protag0nist Posts: 4,960 Valuable Player
    Who actually owns an Index here?  Is it a step up from the Rift S or is it a huge step up from the Rift S?

    Thanks.
  • RuneSR2RuneSR2 Posts: 4,908 Valuable Player
    edited March 4
    Who actually owns an Index here?  Is it a step up from the Rift S or is it a huge step up from the Rift S?

    Thanks.

    I have the Index, but not the Rift-S - in Boneworks Index is an incredible step up from CV1 ss 2.0. Also fov is much bigger than CV1 and 120+ hz is awesome - but my GTX 1080 is too slow in most games. But of course Index will have similar restrictions as Rift-S compared to oled hmds. 

    Valve - it seems according to VNN - now says new Index stock will be available Match 9th - but maybe only for a few minutes, lol  B)





    Search Index Reddit for Rift-S vs. Index comparisons, there are several. 
    Intel i7 7700K (4.5 GHz); MSI GeForce GTX 1080 8GB Gaming X (oc 2100 MHz gpu boost, 11 GHz mem speed); 16GB Corsair Vengeance LPX DDR4 3200 MHz; MSI Z270I Gaming Pro Carbon AC (VR-Ready) mainboard; Samsung 960 Evo M.2 SSD + Toshiba P300 HD; Windows 10 OS; Valve Index and Oculus Rift CV1 - the latter nearly always using super sampling 2.0. 

    "Ask not what VR can do for you – ask what you can do for VR"
  • RuneSR2RuneSR2 Posts: 4,908 Valuable Player
    Ok, it's not just VNN, it's official:



    Intel i7 7700K (4.5 GHz); MSI GeForce GTX 1080 8GB Gaming X (oc 2100 MHz gpu boost, 11 GHz mem speed); 16GB Corsair Vengeance LPX DDR4 3200 MHz; MSI Z270I Gaming Pro Carbon AC (VR-Ready) mainboard; Samsung 960 Evo M.2 SSD + Toshiba P300 HD; Windows 10 OS; Valve Index and Oculus Rift CV1 - the latter nearly always using super sampling 2.0. 

    "Ask not what VR can do for you – ask what you can do for VR"
  • Comrade_IvanComrade_Ivan Posts: 107
    Art3mis
    Who actually owns an Index here?  Is it a step up from the Rift S or is it a huge step up from the Rift S?

    Thanks.
    Got both (or at least I had both - Sold my Rift S couple of weeks ago).

    I think it depends on who you talk to and what they prefer. For me, FOV gain is more important than the resolution gain between the two. I hacked my Quest to do Rift S' job but with a massive FOV boost, and sold my Rift S (see my vid in this thread just a few posts above).

    Sounds like you're contemplating an upgrade, so I'll mention that Index is not a replacement for Rift S. Index is a great headset, and I'm spending a majority of my VR time in it, now that I own one. But I'm not sure that it's worth the 2.5 times the price of, say, Quest (which, when fully modded, is waaay ahead of Rift S - again, see the vid I made).

    Index also has glare comparable to CV1, and it doesn't look great when using ReVive. So if you decide to get one, keep your old headset. You'll need it for Oculus titles.

    To answer your question - for me, Index is a step up, but not a huge one.

    If you happen to be in Vancouver, consider yourself invited to come by, test my two rigs out and compare.
  • RuneSR2RuneSR2 Posts: 4,908 Valuable Player
    edited March 4
    It's starting - now, guess it's 10 AM in Los Angeles right now - ok, 10:08  <3

    Time to put the kids to bed "But hey Dad, it's only 7 PM! Yes, my sons, but you're looking so tired"  o:):D (Ok, joking, I'll have to wait a few more hours  :s )

    https://www.reddit.com/r/ValveIndex/comments/fdgqxx/join_me_in_the_new_alyx_home_enviornment/


    Intel i7 7700K (4.5 GHz); MSI GeForce GTX 1080 8GB Gaming X (oc 2100 MHz gpu boost, 11 GHz mem speed); 16GB Corsair Vengeance LPX DDR4 3200 MHz; MSI Z270I Gaming Pro Carbon AC (VR-Ready) mainboard; Samsung 960 Evo M.2 SSD + Toshiba P300 HD; Windows 10 OS; Valve Index and Oculus Rift CV1 - the latter nearly always using super sampling 2.0. 

    "Ask not what VR can do for you – ask what you can do for VR"
  • RuneSR2RuneSR2 Posts: 4,908 Valuable Player
    PS. Dude on Reddit seemed too quick - Alyx homes don't seem ready yet - read the comments:

    https://www.reddit.com/r/ValveIndex/comments/fdgqxx/join_me_in_the_new_alyx_home_enviornment/

    But fine with me, won't mind waiting another max. 2 hours ;)
    Intel i7 7700K (4.5 GHz); MSI GeForce GTX 1080 8GB Gaming X (oc 2100 MHz gpu boost, 11 GHz mem speed); 16GB Corsair Vengeance LPX DDR4 3200 MHz; MSI Z270I Gaming Pro Carbon AC (VR-Ready) mainboard; Samsung 960 Evo M.2 SSD + Toshiba P300 HD; Windows 10 OS; Valve Index and Oculus Rift CV1 - the latter nearly always using super sampling 2.0. 

    "Ask not what VR can do for you – ask what you can do for VR"
  • RuneSR2RuneSR2 Posts: 4,908 Valuable Player
    Just got an email from Valve a few minutes ago - now it's time to consider getting extra controllers, lol


    Intel i7 7700K (4.5 GHz); MSI GeForce GTX 1080 8GB Gaming X (oc 2100 MHz gpu boost, 11 GHz mem speed); 16GB Corsair Vengeance LPX DDR4 3200 MHz; MSI Z270I Gaming Pro Carbon AC (VR-Ready) mainboard; Samsung 960 Evo M.2 SSD + Toshiba P300 HD; Windows 10 OS; Valve Index and Oculus Rift CV1 - the latter nearly always using super sampling 2.0. 

    "Ask not what VR can do for you – ask what you can do for VR"
  • RuneSR2RuneSR2 Posts: 4,908 Valuable Player
    Intel i7 7700K (4.5 GHz); MSI GeForce GTX 1080 8GB Gaming X (oc 2100 MHz gpu boost, 11 GHz mem speed); 16GB Corsair Vengeance LPX DDR4 3200 MHz; MSI Z270I Gaming Pro Carbon AC (VR-Ready) mainboard; Samsung 960 Evo M.2 SSD + Toshiba P300 HD; Windows 10 OS; Valve Index and Oculus Rift CV1 - the latter nearly always using super sampling 2.0. 

    "Ask not what VR can do for you – ask what you can do for VR"
  • RuneSR2RuneSR2 Posts: 4,908 Valuable Player
    More  <3






    Intel i7 7700K (4.5 GHz); MSI GeForce GTX 1080 8GB Gaming X (oc 2100 MHz gpu boost, 11 GHz mem speed); 16GB Corsair Vengeance LPX DDR4 3200 MHz; MSI Z270I Gaming Pro Carbon AC (VR-Ready) mainboard; Samsung 960 Evo M.2 SSD + Toshiba P300 HD; Windows 10 OS; Valve Index and Oculus Rift CV1 - the latter nearly always using super sampling 2.0. 

    "Ask not what VR can do for you – ask what you can do for VR"
  • MradrMradr Posts: 3,617 Valuable Player
    edited March 4
    That looks like an old voodoo card lol. Them good old days of multi chip co-processors
  • WildtWildt Posts: 2,219 Valuable Player
    Mradr said:
    That looks like an old voodoo card lol. Them good old days of multi chip co-processors
    Yup. And you can run Half Life on them:
    https://thegeek.games/2019/03/12/half-life-running-on-voodoo-gpus-a-modder-made-it-possible-video/
    PCVR: CV1 || 4 sensors || TPcast wireless adapter || MamutVR Gun stock V3
    PSVR: PS4 Pro || Move Controllers || Aim controller
    WMR: HP Reverb
  • OmegaM4NOmegaM4N Posts: 695
    Neo
    edited March 5
    Ok which nice rich index owner is going to host steamvr rooms so all us non index poor cv1,vive, S, WMR owners can come look around the preview rooms......i promise i won't steam anything. lol
  • LuciferousLuciferous Posts: 2,314 Valuable Player
    All round runes for a VR sleep over :)
  • Hiro_Protag0nistHiro_Protag0nist Posts: 4,960 Valuable Player
    Who actually owns an Index here?  Is it a step up from the Rift S or is it a huge step up from the Rift S?

    Thanks.
    Got both (or at least I had both - Sold my Rift S couple of weeks ago).

    I think it depends on who you talk to and what they prefer. For me, FOV gain is more important than the resolution gain between the two. I hacked my Quest to do Rift S' job but with a massive FOV boost, and sold my Rift S (see my vid in this thread just a few posts above).

    Sounds like you're contemplating an upgrade, so I'll mention that Index is not a replacement for Rift S. Index is a great headset, and I'm spending a majority of my VR time in it, now that I own one. But I'm not sure that it's worth the 2.5 times the price of, say, Quest (which, when fully modded, is waaay ahead of Rift S - again, see the vid I made).

    Index also has glare comparable to CV1, and it doesn't look great when using ReVive. So if you decide to get one, keep your old headset. You'll need it for Oculus titles.

    To answer your question - for me, Index is a step up, but not a huge one.

    If you happen to be in Vancouver, consider yourself invited to come by, test my two rigs out and compare.

    I am considering the upgrade.  The only thing that puts me off is the tracking.  I never want to go back to outside-in.

    Thanks for the info Ivan.  Not sure how you can say the Quest is better than the Rift S - i had to sell my Quest after a few weeks - couldn't handle the downgrade in textures.
  • Comrade_IvanComrade_Ivan Posts: 107
    Art3mis
    edited March 5
    I am considering the upgrade.  The only thing that puts me off is the tracking.  I never want to go back to outside-in.

    Thanks for the info Ivan.  Not sure how you can say the Quest is better than the Rift S - i had to sell my Quest after a few weeks - couldn't handle the downgrade in textures.

    Outside-in, as far as tracking goes, is better tracking. But the pain of dealing with cables and lighthouses is definitely added friction. I got mine installed in a way that hides cables but I hope I don't have to make any changes to my setup for years to come.

    As far as Quest Vs. Rift S, check out the video I posted above in this very thread. Here's the link, just in case:

    https://forums.oculusvr.com/community/discussion/comment/733160/#Comment_733160
  • Comrade_IvanComrade_Ivan Posts: 107
    Art3mis
    edited March 5
    OmegaM4N said:
    Ok which nice rich index owner is going to host steamvr rooms so all us non index poor cv1,vive, S, WMR owners can come look around the preview rooms......i promise i won't steam anything. lol
    Lol

    I hosted a room last night (two actually), and I'll do it again tonight if you'd like. Luckily I have a kick-ass connection, so it should be a smooth experience for everyone.

    Side note - if you have a large playspace, try going out of bounds (walk IRL to a corner of your room, face the opposite corner, then teleport to the edge of play area and walk IRL past the edge. Then turn 180° twice - once IRL and once in VR, then rinse and repeat).

    I did this yesterday, walked waaay past the available playspace and was treated with an amazing otherwise inaccessible environments.

    You'll end up seeing through walls in some locations due to being on the back side of a rendered plane, but even so, the level of (and attention to) detail is astounding.

    Oh, and make sure you're supersampling as hard as your headset will allow - textures are the best I've ever seen
  • RuneSR2RuneSR2 Posts: 4,908 Valuable Player
    edited March 5
    All round runes for a VR sleep over :)
    Umm, visitors? Me? Suddenly the name @Comrade_Ivan@MowTin and @Shadowmask72 spring to mind  o:)

    Haven't even tried it yet - had to do some work, then the download finished 0:09 AM - had to go to bed.

    And today we've got no cable connection - the phone company has dug up the entire pavement to provide fiber internet - and unfortunately seems to have disconnected my connection. I've hooked up my Samsung S10+ and shared my 4G connection, but due to GB limitation told the kids there's no YouTube or Netflix. A technician won't be here before Monday. Signal strength in the VR man cave is quite weak.
    Intel i7 7700K (4.5 GHz); MSI GeForce GTX 1080 8GB Gaming X (oc 2100 MHz gpu boost, 11 GHz mem speed); 16GB Corsair Vengeance LPX DDR4 3200 MHz; MSI Z270I Gaming Pro Carbon AC (VR-Ready) mainboard; Samsung 960 Evo M.2 SSD + Toshiba P300 HD; Windows 10 OS; Valve Index and Oculus Rift CV1 - the latter nearly always using super sampling 2.0. 

    "Ask not what VR can do for you – ask what you can do for VR"
  • RuneSR2RuneSR2 Posts: 4,908 Valuable Player
    edited March 5

    Oh, and make sure you're supersampling as hard as your headset will allow - textures are the best I've ever seen

    Better than Boneworks, when Boneworks textures are best?

    Although it looks like Valve copied Dash, the new SteamVR user interface is really awesome - but not sure having a home in City 17 is ... cosy... We'll see  :D  
    Intel i7 7700K (4.5 GHz); MSI GeForce GTX 1080 8GB Gaming X (oc 2100 MHz gpu boost, 11 GHz mem speed); 16GB Corsair Vengeance LPX DDR4 3200 MHz; MSI Z270I Gaming Pro Carbon AC (VR-Ready) mainboard; Samsung 960 Evo M.2 SSD + Toshiba P300 HD; Windows 10 OS; Valve Index and Oculus Rift CV1 - the latter nearly always using super sampling 2.0. 

    "Ask not what VR can do for you – ask what you can do for VR"
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