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The Index thread (please keep to subject)

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  • RuneSR2RuneSR2 Posts: 5,569 Valuable Player
    dburne said:
    I would be more interested in hearing how the Index compares to a Rift S in Alyx.
    I myself am getting amazing performance in Alyx with my Rift S and it looks awesome. 
    You're also running 80 Hz with 80% of the Index physical res using a 2080 Ti, it probably should look and play beyond awesome ;) I fully agree, could be interesting with some real benchmarks - although probably not using Alyx unless we find a way to stop adaptive ss... 
    Intel i7 7700K (4.5 GHz); MSI GeForce GTX 1080 8GB Gaming X (oc 2100 MHz gpu boost, 11 GHz mem speed); 16GB Corsair Vengeance LPX DDR4 3200 MHz; MSI Z270I Gaming Pro Carbon AC (VR-Ready) mainboard; Samsung 960 Evo M.2 SSD + Toshiba P300 HD; Windows 10 OS; Valve Index and Oculus Rift CV1 - the latter nearly always using super sampling 2.0. 

    "Ask not what VR can do for you – ask what you can do for VR"
  • LuciferousLuciferous Posts: 2,424 Valuable Player
    edited April 15
    Yes sorry meant HP. Well my RTX2060 Super is recommended as low in Alyx (High in most games). Although as mentioned before I don't see any difference between low to ultra. If I am honest I do not pay a lot of attention to things like that. Not sure if more shadows are enabled? 

     For example in the scene where you see the floating cutlery I noticed they all have a shadow until you pick one up and then the shadow disappears. Let it go and it appears again. Do you get that? 

  • RuneSR2RuneSR2 Posts: 5,569 Valuable Player
    Yes sorry meant HP. Well my RTX2060 Super is recommended as low in Alyx (High in most games). Although as mentioned before I don't see any difference between low to ultra. If I am honest I do not pay a lot of attention to things like that. Not sure if more shadows are enabled? 

     For example in the scene where you see the floating cutlery I noticed they all have a shadow until you pick one up and then the shadow disappears. Let it go and it appears again. Do you get that? 

    Alyx is special - many times I've thought: "aha - these are lowres shadows - using Ultra will provide much better shadows!" - but so far Ultra provided the same shadow quality (or so similar I couldn't see any difference). Even tried to restart, because I thought Valve might have forgotten to mention that changing some effects requires a restart - but it was still the same. 
    It really feels like the game constantly adapts to your gpu capabilities, not only for ss, but also for other details... 

    Btw - without spoiling anything -  I need to talk to Valve about Jeff, socially he really can be a burden. I persuaded him to stay in his room yesterday, which also caused me to be somewhat emotionally affected, probably didn't stay with him for more than 10 min - and I probably need to see how he's doing ... soon .... deep double-sigh.   

    Intel i7 7700K (4.5 GHz); MSI GeForce GTX 1080 8GB Gaming X (oc 2100 MHz gpu boost, 11 GHz mem speed); 16GB Corsair Vengeance LPX DDR4 3200 MHz; MSI Z270I Gaming Pro Carbon AC (VR-Ready) mainboard; Samsung 960 Evo M.2 SSD + Toshiba P300 HD; Windows 10 OS; Valve Index and Oculus Rift CV1 - the latter nearly always using super sampling 2.0. 

    "Ask not what VR can do for you – ask what you can do for VR"
  • RuneSR2RuneSR2 Posts: 5,569 Valuable Player
    Forgot I had the CV1 activated when I started the Index today, but Index simply took over. At some point I tried Fujii and it would not start although I could hear the music, I then closed Steam and it was then I noticed one Oculus sensor being on. When I put on the CV1, Fujii was playing in that hmd, but without sound, lol. I've got the Steam version, and it does support native Oculus drivers - I guess that game got confused, lol.
    It's probably possible to use SteamVR with both Index and an Oculus hmd active, as the Index will dominate, but it's provably best only to have one active hmd when using SteamVR - although I did play several SteamVR games today that started perfectly with the Index. 
    Intel i7 7700K (4.5 GHz); MSI GeForce GTX 1080 8GB Gaming X (oc 2100 MHz gpu boost, 11 GHz mem speed); 16GB Corsair Vengeance LPX DDR4 3200 MHz; MSI Z270I Gaming Pro Carbon AC (VR-Ready) mainboard; Samsung 960 Evo M.2 SSD + Toshiba P300 HD; Windows 10 OS; Valve Index and Oculus Rift CV1 - the latter nearly always using super sampling 2.0. 

    "Ask not what VR can do for you – ask what you can do for VR"
  • Comrade_IvanComrade_Ivan Posts: 125
    Art3mis
    TomCgcmfc said:
    ordered a Quest w/Link Cable a few days ago.  It should get here in a few days.  What was I thinking, lol!  I'm going to blame the corona shutdown.
    Quest is still a pretty sweet headset. You can mod it to get as much as 15 degrees increase in FOV when compared to RiftS (if you have a massive IPD like I do). It's not quite like Index's FOV, but it's closer than any other headset out there. I'm glad I kept mine - it's about to get a ton of use.

    Maybe.

    Valve wrote back to me last night - when submitting a ticket you're asked to run a SteamVR hardware diagnostic utility and attach a file it spits out; it looks like it (correctly) reported that my Logitec controller was also plugged in at the same time, as well as a few other things. They gave me a list of things to try before we take a stroll down the warranty street. Fingers crossed (and drifting, lol)
    I was always put off because Pyro refunded, Tom was never enthusiastic and you were always using both headsets.

    I'll probably wait to see what plays out this year.
    That's probably a smart move. Yes, I'd drop a grand right now to get an Index, but that could be withdrawals talking, too. Index is a great second-first headset. First in terms of ending up using it 99% of the time, but a second headset one should buy (as the first gen clearly had some hardware issues)
  • pyroth309pyroth309 Posts: 1,715 Valuable Player
    Well that's good to hear.

    I was always put off because Pyro refunded, Tom was never enthusiastic and you were always using both headsets.

    I'll probably wait to see what plays out this year. HTC have a new one coming which looks interesting and it says no compromises (hope they include FOV in that statement).
    Not that it matters but I sold mine to a buddy. He tried it and loved it and glare didn't bother him as much as it did me for whatever reason.

    TBH only thing that stopped me from rebuying is real life restraints. The combination of my CV1, Odyssey and Quest are keeping me occupied for the time I do get. I've been waiting for a big GPU leap for at least 3 years now and I hope the 3080TI isn't too far away. I'm probably just going to make do with these and wait and see what the VR situation is at that point.

    As far as Index with Alyx....IMO, I really don't' see what the benefit of 144hz would be in a game like Alyx. The combat is super slow and you aren't exactly whipping your head around as most of the game happens in front of you. To me it would be a game to run at 80 or 90hz and push it for fidelity, especially on an older GPU like a 1080.
  • RuneSR2RuneSR2 Posts: 5,569 Valuable Player
    edited April 15
    pyroth309 said:

    As far as Index with Alyx....IMO, I really don't' see what the benefit of 144hz would be in a game like Alyx. The combat is super slow and you aren't exactly whipping your head around as most of the game happens in front of you. To me it would be a game to run at 80 or 90hz and push it for fidelity, especially on an older GPU like a 1080.
    Agreed, 120+ Hz would be great only if the increased refresh is "free" - that is, not causing noticeably reduced super sampling (res) - and that's another argument for a very fast gpu (and maybe also cpu). 
    Intel i7 7700K (4.5 GHz); MSI GeForce GTX 1080 8GB Gaming X (oc 2100 MHz gpu boost, 11 GHz mem speed); 16GB Corsair Vengeance LPX DDR4 3200 MHz; MSI Z270I Gaming Pro Carbon AC (VR-Ready) mainboard; Samsung 960 Evo M.2 SSD + Toshiba P300 HD; Windows 10 OS; Valve Index and Oculus Rift CV1 - the latter nearly always using super sampling 2.0. 

    "Ask not what VR can do for you – ask what you can do for VR"
  • TomCgcmfcTomCgcmfc Posts: 2,261 Valuable Player
    I'd be a lot more enthusiastic if Valve ever decided to actually ship these to Australia, lol!  I'll probably pick up the headset and controllers when they ever do so (already have 2.0 base stations).  One can never have too many headsets eh.

    Custom built gaming desktop; i9 9900k (water cooled) oc to 5ghz, gtx 1080 ti, 32 gb 3000hz ram, 1 tb ssd, 4 tb hdd.  Asus  ROG Maximus xi hero wifi mb, StarTech 4 port/4 controller sata powered usb3.0 pcie card, PCI-E PCI Express to USB 3.1 Gen 2 card, Asus VG248QE 1080p 144hz gaming monitor, Oculus Rift cv1 w/2x sensors, Vive Pro w/2.0 base stations/controllers, Quest w/Link and VD wireless (good/close 5Ghz wifi and PC with Ethernet cable to my Router).

  • LuciferousLuciferous Posts: 2,424 Valuable Player
    edited April 16
    Sorry Tom, I meant Comrade, you were actually quite enthusiastic  :)

    Would be great if I could try one out in a store, do you remember those places you could go and look at the thing you were going to buy. Ahhh the old days. 

    I have a dear set of friends but they wouldn't know one end of a computer from another. So no hope of them buying one. The number of football conversations I have had to sit through with glassy eyes. :)  
  • RuneSR2RuneSR2 Posts: 5,569 Valuable Player
    edited April 23
    Seems like a piece of cake getting the Index to Australia  ;)

    Australian Valve Index owner here - My first time VR impressions & Shopmate experience


    Hey everyone.


    So I wanted to talk about my experience purchasing the Valve Index when the orders first came up last month a few weeks before Half Life: Alyx came out. I stayed up all night hitting the refresh button like a maniac at 3:58AM to hit the order button as fast as I could so I could secure a kit for myself. And lo and behold, I was one of the lucky ones to get into the 2-4 week group.


    This is a breakdown of what everything cost me in AUD.


    Valve Index Total: $1,438.56


    Shopmate Total: $164.40


    • Base Charge: $22.95


    • Weight Charge: $103.95


    • Extra Cover: $37.50


    Vanguard Logistics (Customs Broker) Total: $370.38


    • EDI FEE – CUSTOMS: $88.00


    • GST PAID: $177.88


    • AUSTRALIAN CUSTOMS CLEARANCE FEE: $95.00


    • GST Amount (10.00%): $9.50


    $1,438.56 + $164.40 + $370.88 = $1973.84


    Grand Total: $1973.84 AUD


    The kit took about 3 and a half weeks to arrive from the time I hit the order button on the Steam page. As you can see, I had to go through Shopmate and hire a customs broker (Vanguard Logistics) which Australia Post recommended, so there were a few hoops to jump through. Pricey ones as you can see in the figures above, but not difficult to work your way around. The woman I spoke to over the phone had been dealing with a lot of people calling in trying to get their Index's shipped through Australia, so she knew what the deal was. She even mentioned her own son was trying to buy one and get one through the country.


    Time went on, and I bought some interlocking module jigsaw foam mats to prepare for the experience. These in my opinion, are absolutely essential to have, or at least some sort of padding/foam mat or surface to stand on while playing because standing can become tiresome after a while. It definitely improves the experience in terms of comfort, and it also gives you a sensory indication if you are moving too close to the chaperone wall (depending on how you have your room scale VR set up).


    $1973 AUD might seem like A LOT of money, and don't get me wrong, it is. However, I am a HUGE Half Life fan and I was fortunate enough to be able to afford the purchase and I can honestly say I have had no regrets since buying the kit. I finished Half Life: Alyx and was blown away by the experience. Admittedly, I did have to use the teleporting locomotion throughout the game, because continuous/smooth threw me off heavily as I couldn't build up my tolerance for it comfortably. However, once I play some other games with that style of locomotion and get my VR legs, I will, for sure, play through the game again with continuous locomotion, as I feel that was how the game was meant to be played.


    I have also been playing Beat Saber and I have been having an absolute blast. It's a great way to get some quick exercise and playing the game with mods and being able to download songs through the mod menu (which honestly feels like a cheeky in-game Limewire) is a great advantage that the PC version has over the console versions. It's also a great way to discover new music by sorting through what has been downloaded the most/rated the most, etc.


    I have briefly played Onward with a friend, and there was a hilarious glitch that I encountered where my gun flew out of my hands and yeeted off into the sky. I wish I got that recording through Shadowplay because I pretty much fell to the floor laughing when it happened. Onward is a pretty cool and immersive experience and is a must own if you have fellow friends that own VR headsets.


    So far, my experience has only been with these 3 games, but I have been having a serious amount of fun with this thing.


    Honestly whenever I don the headset on, and pick up the controllers. I feel EXTREMELY lucky to own one, despite paying nearly $2000 AUD for the damn thing, I feel like I'm carrying gold. This is especially being able to import one through to Australia, where the Index isn't for sale at the moment, and knowing that there are people in America that are still waiting to even pay for theirs. Even paying exorbitant prices for the knuckles controllers alone, which feel great in your hands and are super ergonomic.


    I just want to say that the wait will be worth it, and if you are a fellow Aussie looking at importing a kit, I would without a doubt say go for it, because it sure beats paying insane amounts through a scalper or second hand. Especially if you are a huge Half Life fan like I am. It was a week before Alyx was announced that I was telling my friends that I was going to play the final release version of Black Mesa, and bid farewell to the franchise knowing full well that there probably won't ever be another Half Life game again. The next week rolls by and Alyx was announced. Even after playing and finishing the game I still can't believe that I got to experience it, and that is actually happened. A freaking new Half Life game. Who would have thought?


    After looking online, it seems that all VR headsets are extremely hard to come by, and this is because people are purely buying one just to play Half Life: Alyx, which is just crazy.


    Anyway, those were some thoughts I just wanted to share. I hope this helps anyone else on the fence about buying/importing an Index. I honestly wish there was a way for me to share this kit out to as many people as I could to try it, because I know how important Half Life is to people. I feel honored in a way be owning an Index, it might sound silly, but with everything that's going on in the world right now, it certainly doesn't feel silly at all.


    Thanks for reading. If anyone has any questions about the Shopmate experience, let me know and I'll do my best to help.

    https://www.reddit.com/r/ValveIndex/comments/g6hl4f/australian_valve_index_owner_here_my_first_time/

    Intel i7 7700K (4.5 GHz); MSI GeForce GTX 1080 8GB Gaming X (oc 2100 MHz gpu boost, 11 GHz mem speed); 16GB Corsair Vengeance LPX DDR4 3200 MHz; MSI Z270I Gaming Pro Carbon AC (VR-Ready) mainboard; Samsung 960 Evo M.2 SSD + Toshiba P300 HD; Windows 10 OS; Valve Index and Oculus Rift CV1 - the latter nearly always using super sampling 2.0. 

    "Ask not what VR can do for you – ask what you can do for VR"
  • TomCgcmfcTomCgcmfc Posts: 2,261 Valuable Player
    Hope he never needs to RMA anything, lol!

    Custom built gaming desktop; i9 9900k (water cooled) oc to 5ghz, gtx 1080 ti, 32 gb 3000hz ram, 1 tb ssd, 4 tb hdd.  Asus  ROG Maximus xi hero wifi mb, StarTech 4 port/4 controller sata powered usb3.0 pcie card, PCI-E PCI Express to USB 3.1 Gen 2 card, Asus VG248QE 1080p 144hz gaming monitor, Oculus Rift cv1 w/2x sensors, Vive Pro w/2.0 base stations/controllers, Quest w/Link and VD wireless (good/close 5Ghz wifi and PC with Ethernet cable to my Router).

  • Comrade_IvanComrade_Ivan Posts: 125
    Art3mis
    TomCgcmfc said:
    Hope he never needs to RMA anything, lol!
    That weighed heavily on my mind before they started selling them in Canada. I was about to order one and have it picked up at a PO box across the border when, thankfully, it was announced Canada would be getting Indexes.

    Side note - Valve's RMA is amazing. I submitted my ticket after my left controller developed the dreaded drift, they gave me a few things to try (they didn't work), and so I got a new controller in 3 days... before I ever had to send my old one back!!! 

    In fact, they specifically said the following:

    Of course, I sent the old one back as soon as the new one showed up. I'm still a little blown away by their customer service!

    Oculus has been just as kickass to me too. I had an old out-of-warranty CV1 that needed a new audio ribbon inside the strap cause the old one failed. I was gonna take Palmer Luckey on his offer to get the repair kit free of charge, but Oculus replaced the headset for me no questions asked. And they full well knew the headset was at least 10 months out of warranty

    I still tried Palmer, on two occasions (just as a backup cause CV1 had a known flaw in the audio ribbon), but I never heard back. I think it was a stunt to get even with Oculus for being asked to leave
  • kojackkojack Posts: 6,472 Volunteer Moderator
    edited April 23
    For me, the price isn't a problem. But my general attitude is if Valve don't want to sell it to me, I don't want to boost Valve's numbers by jumping through hoops to trick them into selling me one.
  • RuneSR2RuneSR2 Posts: 5,569 Valuable Player
    edited April 25
    Been using Index for 9 months now, and apart for the drifting controller in October, everything else hasn't changed since I got the kit in July - it feels like new. But I'm also very careful with my kit, although I have been hammering the Knuckles into nearby walls and the ceiling from time to time :blush: After use I store the Index (same goes for CV1) in a bag with some access to air to prevent build-up of humidity and to avoid any dust. I carefully wrap the cable around the bagged Index - to avoid any twisting of the cable - and then the cable holds the bag in place.

    The new left Index controller has been working perfectly since Nov 2019, but otherwise my hmd really has not aged since I got it in July. In fact it has improved a lot due to automatic column correction. And SteamVR Home has improved to a degree where I prefer it compared to Oculus Home (even though I do love watching the old frigate and the buildings etc) 

    Both my base stations work perfectly - never been unplugged for 9 months, and they enter standby when not in use. My HMD is also unplugged for 9 months - with a constant nice blue light in standby mode.

    I don't have any glue-problem with the lenses at all. Never lost sound in the headphones. My cable-holder on the HMD has not broken - like I said, HMD is like new, no physical damage in any way. Even using glasses every time I use the Index, the lenses have no scratches. Actually I think my glasses protect the lenses, because my son greased the lenses with his eyelids (due to lenses being very close to the eyes), but my glasses save me from doing that, lol. 

    Btw, I do not sweat using the Index - my man cave in the basement is like a constant 68 F (20 C). Both my Knuckles also look like new - even though I've hit the wall a few times. No paint problems. Compared to the CV1 which often fogged up, Index has never done that - and it never felt more hot than CV1. Comfort is better with CV1, also due to the CV1 being more lightweight. 

    I take great care of my things - my CV1 is also in great condition, apart from some of the plastic turning whitish (due to age) - I do not step on the cable - I don't jump up and down or make a lot of wild movements, lol - so if you're into very heavy physical use - and if you're not very careful using your hmd - your experience might of course differ a lot from mine. 

    I have no idea how many hours I've used the Index, got this reading from SteamVR, but it probably also contains some CV1 hours, and I'm not sure the number is correct:


    My main problem with the Index is the vertical columns, but due to Valve's automatic column correction sometimes I don't see the columns and image quality is really awesome (no SDE), but other times I do notice the columns. I get the feeling that the columns are happening somewhat randomly, thus some days when powering up the Index I don't see them, while other days I see them more clearly. The CV1 SDE is like 20 times more noticeable than the faint columns, but striving for perfection these are the main thing I'd like to see improved with the Index. Note that my son never noticed the columns, you may have to know what to look for to see them. Funny that most Index users never mention the columns - am I one of the few to be able to see them? Some users also see them with the Rift-S, seems to be part of the lcd tech limitations. 

    Revive is also working amazingly - to a degree where I don't see any performance impact at all - besides the impact of using a 80% higher physical res than the CV1. CV1 is still great for very dark games and games profiting a lot from asw 2.0 and temporal antialiasing. I do get the feeling that everything the Rift-S can do, then Index can do a lot better - and setting up two base stations is extremely easy. 

    Intel i7 7700K (4.5 GHz); MSI GeForce GTX 1080 8GB Gaming X (oc 2100 MHz gpu boost, 11 GHz mem speed); 16GB Corsair Vengeance LPX DDR4 3200 MHz; MSI Z270I Gaming Pro Carbon AC (VR-Ready) mainboard; Samsung 960 Evo M.2 SSD + Toshiba P300 HD; Windows 10 OS; Valve Index and Oculus Rift CV1 - the latter nearly always using super sampling 2.0. 

    "Ask not what VR can do for you – ask what you can do for VR"
  • RuneSR2RuneSR2 Posts: 5,569 Valuable Player
    Btw, just took some "9 months" pics - yeah, I don't bag Knuckles, you may see some dust on those, lol:



    Close-up new left controller:


    Close-up - old right controllers (9 month of usage, never failed me):






    Haven't removed the plastic from the frunk cover yet, but it sits there nicely - why remove it? :D Face gasket feels completely like new - but found out so was my CV1 face plate even after more than 2 years, because the new one I bought from Oculus felt - and smelled - the same, so kinda a waste of money. - Unless you really sweat a lot, changing face gasket/plate may be a lot less important than many think... 
    Intel i7 7700K (4.5 GHz); MSI GeForce GTX 1080 8GB Gaming X (oc 2100 MHz gpu boost, 11 GHz mem speed); 16GB Corsair Vengeance LPX DDR4 3200 MHz; MSI Z270I Gaming Pro Carbon AC (VR-Ready) mainboard; Samsung 960 Evo M.2 SSD + Toshiba P300 HD; Windows 10 OS; Valve Index and Oculus Rift CV1 - the latter nearly always using super sampling 2.0. 

    "Ask not what VR can do for you – ask what you can do for VR"
  • OmegaM4NOmegaM4N Posts: 805
    3Jane
    ^^You are like me, treat your VR HMDs with kid gloves.....although my OCD would not allow me to leave anything switched on or sitting on standby while i was sleeping. lol
  • RuneSR2RuneSR2 Posts: 5,569 Valuable Player
    OmegaM4N said:
    ^^You are like me, treat your VR HMDs with kid gloves.....although my OCD would not allow me to leave anything switched on or sitting on standby while i was sleeping. lol
    Agreed, but if you turn the base stations off, then they will fully power on when you plug them in - the only way (I know of) to get them into standby mode is to provide them with that signal, when you exit SteamVR. If possible, you could just plug them in when you want to use them. 
    I have tvs and blu-ray players etc. using standby mode, guess standby mode with Index and base stations are similar.... I don't think Valve recommends unplugging when not in use. 2c.
    Intel i7 7700K (4.5 GHz); MSI GeForce GTX 1080 8GB Gaming X (oc 2100 MHz gpu boost, 11 GHz mem speed); 16GB Corsair Vengeance LPX DDR4 3200 MHz; MSI Z270I Gaming Pro Carbon AC (VR-Ready) mainboard; Samsung 960 Evo M.2 SSD + Toshiba P300 HD; Windows 10 OS; Valve Index and Oculus Rift CV1 - the latter nearly always using super sampling 2.0. 

    "Ask not what VR can do for you – ask what you can do for VR"
  • RuneSR2RuneSR2 Posts: 5,569 Valuable Player
    edited May 3
    Finally tried SkyBox, well had to since it soon won't be a free app, lol:


    Steam says it requires 10GB space which for years made me avoid the player, but it's an error, the app is like 500MB. 

    In short, I disliked all other SteamVR movie players, but this one is simply awesome! I could use res 200% and still get solid 90 fps. Checking the same 2k movies, the image quality was extremely much better using Index than CV1, due to much higher res and no SDE. I guess my local cinema is better, but this is getting so close that the difference may not be important to many. There is some glare using the Index, but when choosing a scene where you're placed in a virtual cinema, the ambient lighting reduce glare a lot (compared to a totally black background). It seems like res 200% works wonders, and maybe SkyBox did something to increase image quality? Watching the same movies using CV1 and Oculus Video, I got a lot more compression artifacts, but using Skybox the image quality in 2K looked much like 4K res and I saw no compression artifacts at all. Mp4 and mkv movies never looked this awesome in VR, again it felt really close to being in a real theater. Suddenly SkyBox became my no. 1 VR movie player, at least for the Index.
    Intel i7 7700K (4.5 GHz); MSI GeForce GTX 1080 8GB Gaming X (oc 2100 MHz gpu boost, 11 GHz mem speed); 16GB Corsair Vengeance LPX DDR4 3200 MHz; MSI Z270I Gaming Pro Carbon AC (VR-Ready) mainboard; Samsung 960 Evo M.2 SSD + Toshiba P300 HD; Windows 10 OS; Valve Index and Oculus Rift CV1 - the latter nearly always using super sampling 2.0. 

    "Ask not what VR can do for you – ask what you can do for VR"
  • OmegaM4NOmegaM4N Posts: 805
    3Jane
    ^^Skybox is good media app, i use it on the Go as it allows you to change colour saturation, brightness and contrast as well as enviroment, or just have the screen always in front of you, useful for when your sprawled out on the couch watching something.
  • kojackkojack Posts: 6,472 Volunteer Moderator
    OmegaM4N said:
    ^^Skybox is good media app, i use it on the Go as it allows you to change colour saturation, brightness and contrast as well as enviroment, or just have the screen always in front of you, useful for when your sprawled out on the couch watching something.

    Also it's air screen feature lets you network files easily, so you don't have to upload them to the Go or Quest. It's the best of the video players I've tried. Hopefully they'll add panorama viewing at some point too.
  • RuneSR2RuneSR2 Posts: 5,569 Valuable Player
    This was an interesting post - although I do not agree, I do understand his point about the large and sharp image (all over the lenses) using the CV1:

    Dissapointed about the Index and Valve, going back to Rift CV1 :(

    I'm coming from Rift CV1 (i also owned a Vive for short time) and i dont like the Index HMD. Its much heavier and the lenses are not really sharp (except the small middle area).

    Yeah the Resolution and small SDE is a nice upgrade, but after my second RMA HMD, im refund my Index now and go back to my CV1.

    The CV1 is so much lighter, the lenses got heavier godrays that sucks, but the lenses are razor sharp and i can read text 360° till the edges, that is not possible with the index, you still can read text with this lenses but its blurry and it sucks, if you prefer games like Elite Dangerous and reading text all the time, but even in no text games i hate this blurry lenses... i also got a unnatural feeling after using the Index already after 1hour and heavy eye fatigue and crossview feeling, that i never had in my 3-4years old preordered CV1.

    There is also IPD OFFSet bug (58mm comes in Popup View much to early and there is still room to the left side) on all my 3 Index Units, and Valve dont want to listen to me, im also reported this problem on this Reddit sub but its getting downvoted by clueless fanboys, there is no room for the truth on the internet (stolen from big bang theory) :D

    The build quality on each unit was very differend, in particular field related to the Lense Sharpness, my first unit got 40% FoV Sharpness, my second unit only had 10% FoV Sharpness and my third unit is around 20-30% FoV Sharpness and with stronger Godrays as the other 2 units.

    The RMA support was okay, but i had very long wait time between each massage, sometimes it took 2-3 weeks till i had a return label, anyways thats understand able because of covid-19.


    I hope the HP Reverb 2G dont have this Dual Lenses from the Index, i got a feeling this Lenses is my biggest Issues related to my bad experience.


    Just to let you guys know my IPD is 59,5mm and i try'd everything to adjust my Index, im even used the magnet mod, but nothing really helps.

    https://www.reddit.com/r/ValveIndex/comments/ggx1xg/dissapointed_about_the_index_and_valve_going_back/


    He could be wearing the Index wrong - using the Index image quality is like 10 times sharper in the center than CV1 ss 2.0, and you really got no SDE with the Index, but in the periphery the Index distorts the image significantly more than CV1. I don't notice that distortion in games - at all - but you would notice it if you're surrounded by a lot of text. 
    Some other Index users disagree with his estimates of fov sharpness, which should be much the same and could imply he's not wearing the hmds properly - but since he tried different units and I have not, can't argue much with his impressions. 
    Still I have been enjoying the Room VR a lot lately - due to its ultramersion textures (like Alyx and Boneworks) - and I'm using Index res 200% in solid 90 fps in that game. The image quality is so far beyond what I've ever seen using CV1 ss 2.0 that there's really no comparison. Also watching movies in Skybox is way beyond the CV1s capabilities, Index feels like being in a real cinema, CV1 has way too little res and way to much SDE for that. I think the Index needs res 150 - 200 % to shine, and if he never tried that the above review would be very flawed concerning Index sharpness. 
    Intel i7 7700K (4.5 GHz); MSI GeForce GTX 1080 8GB Gaming X (oc 2100 MHz gpu boost, 11 GHz mem speed); 16GB Corsair Vengeance LPX DDR4 3200 MHz; MSI Z270I Gaming Pro Carbon AC (VR-Ready) mainboard; Samsung 960 Evo M.2 SSD + Toshiba P300 HD; Windows 10 OS; Valve Index and Oculus Rift CV1 - the latter nearly always using super sampling 2.0. 

    "Ask not what VR can do for you – ask what you can do for VR"
  • RuneSR2RuneSR2 Posts: 5,569 Valuable Player
    Strange, but I wrote a post about Index being a superior choice for the new game Mini Motor Racing X on the Valve Index sub-Reddit. Because using Revive I get solid 90 fps even when forcing res 200% and 4xMSAA. And the game looks and plays beyond amazing. 
    Now I considered myself being kinda a swell lad by spoon-feeding the good stuff to other Index owners - and what happened? A great "thank you"? - No, the mods deleted my post!  :o  :# 

    Of course I didn't accept that - and wrote a longer complaint to the mods. They agreed and my post is now restored, but it showed me one thing that I wasn't much aware of. The mods told me that they as a rule of thumb do not want posts about games which do not fully and officially support the Index. It seems they don't care for Revive - and I sense some profound animosity toward Oculus. I've read several posts from Index owners stating "if it's not on Steam, then there's no buy". And several Index users seem extremely angry with Oculus about the walled garden. 

    Personally I love having the choice to support Oculus, and being able to play VR games on a broad number of hmds is - to me - a great way to increase adoption. I've paid more than 1k for my Oculus games, having to buy them all again on Steam would not make me in a good mood - also it would be annoying having to waste a lot of hard drive space. And many of my favorite VR games and apps are not available on Steam. 

    Really strange that some Index owners seem so angry with Oculus/Facebook that they refuse to use Revive. Like Oculus users are able to use Steam, Index users can benefit a lot from having some access to the Oculus Store - and stubborn Index users will be missing out on some of the most amazing VR titles ever made. 2c. 
    Intel i7 7700K (4.5 GHz); MSI GeForce GTX 1080 8GB Gaming X (oc 2100 MHz gpu boost, 11 GHz mem speed); 16GB Corsair Vengeance LPX DDR4 3200 MHz; MSI Z270I Gaming Pro Carbon AC (VR-Ready) mainboard; Samsung 960 Evo M.2 SSD + Toshiba P300 HD; Windows 10 OS; Valve Index and Oculus Rift CV1 - the latter nearly always using super sampling 2.0. 

    "Ask not what VR can do for you – ask what you can do for VR"
  • TomCgcmfcTomCgcmfc Posts: 2,261 Valuable Player
    I hate to say it but even Steam seems to occasionally put a spanner in the works with  Revive.  Some SteamVR updates have effected my Vive controllers big time, like recently with Lone Echo.  Both Steam and VivePort cater to most PCVR headsets and neither seem to be at war with each other.  Hopefully one day Oculus will put on their big boy pants and support other headsets.  They would pull in a heck of a lot more revenue and make a lot more PCVR friends imho.

    Custom built gaming desktop; i9 9900k (water cooled) oc to 5ghz, gtx 1080 ti, 32 gb 3000hz ram, 1 tb ssd, 4 tb hdd.  Asus  ROG Maximus xi hero wifi mb, StarTech 4 port/4 controller sata powered usb3.0 pcie card, PCI-E PCI Express to USB 3.1 Gen 2 card, Asus VG248QE 1080p 144hz gaming monitor, Oculus Rift cv1 w/2x sensors, Vive Pro w/2.0 base stations/controllers, Quest w/Link and VD wireless (good/close 5Ghz wifi and PC with Ethernet cable to my Router).

  • kevinw729kevinw729 Posts: 5,222 Valuable Player
    RuneSR2 said:
    .....
    Really strange that some Index owners seem so angry with Oculus/Facebook that they refuse to use Revive. Like Oculus users are able to use Steam, Index users can benefit a lot from having some access to the Oculus Store - and stubborn Index users will be missing out on some of the most amazing VR titles ever made. 

    Yeah, it is a bone of contention between the Oculus and Valve supporters - very antagonistic situation, going back to the beginning of this phase of VR adoption, and not helped by the information supplied to ZeniMax legal team by Valve - in the eyes of the Oculus-community.  Some review-bombing of HL:A can be attributed to this animosity. While at the same time Steam (Valve) have attempted to place roadblocks towards supporting Oculus content (as well as the issues with Revive) on their platform. 

    The hope is, now that many of the perpetrators have left their respective companies the feuds can be allowed to die down, and that we move forward to achieve greater VR adoption than create little eco-systems. 

    urdgfqqehbbb.png
    ** Second New Book **
    "The Out-of-Home Immersive Entertainment Frontier: Expanding Interactive Boundaries in Leisure Facilities"
    https://www.amazon.co.uk/Out-Home-Immersive-Entertainment-Frontier/dp/1472426959
  • RuneSR2RuneSR2 Posts: 5,569 Valuable Player
    Strange, but my Spider-sense is tingling every time I look at this one  :D

     
    Intel i7 7700K (4.5 GHz); MSI GeForce GTX 1080 8GB Gaming X (oc 2100 MHz gpu boost, 11 GHz mem speed); 16GB Corsair Vengeance LPX DDR4 3200 MHz; MSI Z270I Gaming Pro Carbon AC (VR-Ready) mainboard; Samsung 960 Evo M.2 SSD + Toshiba P300 HD; Windows 10 OS; Valve Index and Oculus Rift CV1 - the latter nearly always using super sampling 2.0. 

    "Ask not what VR can do for you – ask what you can do for VR"
  • kevinw729kevinw729 Posts: 5,222 Valuable Player
    RuneSR2 said:
    Strange, but my Spider-sense is tingling every time I look at this one  
    ....



    Yeah, that HTC Index looks legit! :D
    urdgfqqehbbb.png
    ** Second New Book **
    "The Out-of-Home Immersive Entertainment Frontier: Expanding Interactive Boundaries in Leisure Facilities"
    https://www.amazon.co.uk/Out-Home-Immersive-Entertainment-Frontier/dp/1472426959
  • RuneSR2RuneSR2 Posts: 5,569 Valuable Player
    Had a very bad experience today, but seems I got it fixed. Normally it's no problem updating Revive, but I think something went wrong with the new v. 2.0. At least the Revive Dash didn't update correctly after installation - and maybe here I did a great error of rebooting the rig. When rebooting I just got a black screen, not even a bios logo. Had to pull out all DisplayPort and HDMI connections, but still black screen. Here I kinda felt the first drop of cold sweat emerge...  :#
    Then I tried to remove all usb2-3 connections too, and that did the trick - Win10 started up again, phew. Started plugging CV1 in again including all sensors - everything still worked. Then Index - and black screen was back (another drop of cold sweat emerged). Removing the Index, everything worked again. Note, I did uninstall Revive 2.0 and went back to 1.9.2 which seems to work more or less perfectly. 
    Then when Win10 was running, I now reconnected the Index, and it worked fine when starting SteamVR. I was hoping that reconnecting Index while Win10 was running would restore normal display settings. And it actually seems to work - for the first time, I was now able to restart the rig and got into Win10 with both CV1 and Index connected.
    Seems like using Revive or maybe just having several hmds connected may create a delicate balance, but it has been working flawlessly for about a year. I'll be even more careful with Revive the next time, but of course I don't know if the situation was created by Revive or some rare random error... 
    Intel i7 7700K (4.5 GHz); MSI GeForce GTX 1080 8GB Gaming X (oc 2100 MHz gpu boost, 11 GHz mem speed); 16GB Corsair Vengeance LPX DDR4 3200 MHz; MSI Z270I Gaming Pro Carbon AC (VR-Ready) mainboard; Samsung 960 Evo M.2 SSD + Toshiba P300 HD; Windows 10 OS; Valve Index and Oculus Rift CV1 - the latter nearly always using super sampling 2.0. 

    "Ask not what VR can do for you – ask what you can do for VR"
  • Comrade_IvanComrade_Ivan Posts: 125
    Art3mis
    edited May 23
    RuneSR2 said:
    ... Normally it's no problem updating Revive, but I think something went wrong with the new v. 2.0. When rebooting I just got a black screen, not even a bios logo. I did uninstall Revive 2.0 and went back to 1.9.2 which seems to work more or less perfectly. 
    Didn't the Index subreddit moderators already tell you once not to talk about Revive (by deleting your post)? But then you had to post about that here, didn't ya? Be glad they only hacked your machine. Don't füćk with the Cosa Nostra. It'd be a shame if your computer accidentally caught fire.

    "Things burn, Colonel" 

    :smiley:

    I am, of course, joking
  • RuneSR2RuneSR2 Posts: 5,569 Valuable Player
    edited May 23
    RuneSR2 said:
    ... Normally it's no problem updating Revive, but I think something went wrong with the new v. 2.0. When rebooting I just got a black screen, not even a bios logo. I did uninstall Revive 2.0 and went back to 1.9.2 which seems to work more or less perfectly. 
    Didn't the Index subreddit moderators already tell you once not to talk about Revive (by deleting your post)? But then you had to post about that here, didn't ya? Be glad they only hacked your machine. Don't füćk with the Cosa Nostra. It'd be a shame if your computer accidentally caught fire.

    "Things burn, Colonel" 

    :smiley:

    I am, of course, joking
    Yes, but Moss isn't working that well with 1.9.2 (= does not always launch, but works perfectly when it does), I had to go into that fire - knowing I could sacrifice everything  o:)  ;)

    Kinda reminds me just why I might react strongly to forced updates, because some of us have been seriously burnt now and then by seemingly safe updates. And of course Revive may be in the red zone - not having been tested thoroughly by Oculus, Valve or MS before the release - I guess I forgot that, because the last 10 times it updated with no problems, but 2.0 might be a bigger jump...  :(

    Btw, a friend is sending me his 2k MSI laptop right now, because it fails to boot after MS forced the last Win10 update - and he doesn't know what to do. Not sure I do either, but I hope I'll find a way to make it work...
    Intel i7 7700K (4.5 GHz); MSI GeForce GTX 1080 8GB Gaming X (oc 2100 MHz gpu boost, 11 GHz mem speed); 16GB Corsair Vengeance LPX DDR4 3200 MHz; MSI Z270I Gaming Pro Carbon AC (VR-Ready) mainboard; Samsung 960 Evo M.2 SSD + Toshiba P300 HD; Windows 10 OS; Valve Index and Oculus Rift CV1 - the latter nearly always using super sampling 2.0. 

    "Ask not what VR can do for you – ask what you can do for VR"
  • Comrade_IvanComrade_Ivan Posts: 125
    Art3mis
    I'm hesitant to update to 2.0 after reading about your experience. I think I'll uninstall and wait for 2.1
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