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Does updating Graphic Card drivers make a difference to your fps?

RedRizlaRedRizla Posts: 6,774 Valuable Player
edited August 20 in Off-Topic
Quick question. I have a Geforce 2080ti and wondered if updating your graphic drivers really makes such a huge difference to your fps? I ask because I have a 3D projector and since Nvidia decided to stop supporting Nvidia 3D, it has left me not being able to update to the current Nvida driver, unless I want to give up on 3D, which I don't want to do. Stability wise my drivers seem fine because I haven't had any crashing in the games I play, but I'm more interested to know if I will be losing out on higher fps? I did do a search and I saw that some people said the latest Geforce 2080ti drivers actually made their fps worse by 3 or 4 fps.
So are we just talking about a few fps here and there or can a driver boost fps by say more then this? Really pished off that Nvidia has stopped supporting 3D.

Comments

  • RuneSR2RuneSR2 Posts: 3,926 Valuable Player
    edited August 20
    Had that discussion last year with some dude thinking that during the years 2016-2018 his gtx 1080 had become much faster. But performance was exactly the same in several synthetic benchmarks like 3D Mark comparing with early 2016 results. 
    Maybe in some specific games performance has improved, more often I think Nvidia has just fixed errors. But if you don't experience specific errors or problems, upgrading a fully functional driver may not do much and can be a source of new errors. Valve recently recommended Forceware 417 for the Index just as an example that newer isn't always better.
    Intel i7 7700K (4.5 GHz); MSI GeForce GTX 1080 8GB Gaming X (oc 2100 MHz gpu boost, 11 GHz mem speed); 16GB Corsair Vengeance LPX DDR4 3200 MHz; MSI Z270I Gaming Pro Carbon AC (VR-Ready) mainboard; Samsung 960 Evo M.2 SSD + Toshiba P300 HD; Windows 10 OS; Valve Index and Oculus Rift CV1 - the latter nearly always using super sampling 2.0. 

    "Ask not what VR can do for you – ask what you can do for VR"
  • ohgrantohgrant Posts: 203
    Nexus 6
     I've never seen a huge notable difference in graphics driver updates. With that said I think the big danger for us 3D vision users in the future, is that Oculus will require a higher driver than 3D vision supports.
     Fortunately for now the 3D vision community has come up with a fix to keep 3D vision and still update your graphics driver. If you install the 3D fix manager, you will get the option to upgrade your driver. http://fixmanager.rentus.de/
     
  • RedRizlaRedRizla Posts: 6,774 Valuable Player
    ohgrant said:
     I've never seen a huge notable difference in graphics driver updates. With that said I think the big danger for us 3D vision users in the future, is that Oculus will require a higher driver than 3D vision supports.
     Fortunately for now the 3D vision community has come up with a fix to keep 3D vision and still update your graphics driver. If you install the 3D fix manager, you will get the option to upgrade your driver. http://fixmanager.rentus.de/
     
    @ohgrant - How does this fix the latest Nvidia drives that don't have the option to install Nvidia 3D vision in them? Just checking -Are you sure this works and how does it work if it's not included in the latest drivers?
  • ohgrantohgrant Posts: 203
    Nexus 6
    edited August 20
     Yea, it works for most that I read about. It works on my win 10 machine. There is a complicated way to do it manually, I believe it started here.  https://www.nvidia.com/en-us/geforce/forums/3d-vision/41/299949/the-way-its-meant-to-be-played/ 
     But the update in the fix manager will be automatic with the same results. There are many games that are really optimized well that were just OK before with the fix manager too, I highly recommend trying a few of their game fixes too.  When the fix manager handles it, it will connect online and find the latest driver and give you the option to install. If I remember correctly, you will need to go to NV control panel and enable 3D again.   
      Some other exciting news is Helix is working on a 3D Vision VR app and looking for names. Might be a bit of life left in 3D Vision https://www.nvidia.com/en-us/geforce/forums/3d-vision/41/306960/please-help-us-with-a-name/
  • Digikid1Digikid1 Posts: 2,059 Valuable Player
    No it doesn't work that way at all.  Drivers just control how the card is OPTIMIZED.  ONLY FOR CERTAIN GAMES will this increase FPS but only a little amount.

    @RuneSR2 your friend is hilarious.  I wish it worked that way.  LMAO!!!!!!
  • RuneSR2RuneSR2 Posts: 3,926 Valuable Player
    Digikid1 said:
    No it doesn't work that way at all.  Drivers just control how the card is OPTIMIZED.  ONLY FOR CERTAIN GAMES will this increase FPS but only a little amount.

    @RuneSR2 your friend is hilarious.  I wish it worked that way.  LMAO!!!!!!
    Exactly, often I get the impression that the very early drivers may be slightly faster than newer, maybe because for example Nvidia knows the cards are going to be tested all over the world by Anandtech, Tom's Hardware etc. But mostly I think Nvidia is pretty good at maintaining similar performance through the years. Often I use the Unigine Heaven benchmark, if I observe any difference with new drivers it's typically less than 1 %, and not necessarily an increase  :# But I did get similar results using 417 compared to older drivers from 2017. Not changing to newer drivers before I really need to.
    Intel i7 7700K (4.5 GHz); MSI GeForce GTX 1080 8GB Gaming X (oc 2100 MHz gpu boost, 11 GHz mem speed); 16GB Corsair Vengeance LPX DDR4 3200 MHz; MSI Z270I Gaming Pro Carbon AC (VR-Ready) mainboard; Samsung 960 Evo M.2 SSD + Toshiba P300 HD; Windows 10 OS; Valve Index and Oculus Rift CV1 - the latter nearly always using super sampling 2.0. 

    "Ask not what VR can do for you – ask what you can do for VR"
  • RosgilliesRosgillies Posts: 154
    Art3mis
    IMHO, drivers sometimes give a small fps benefit but mainly stability improvements are the most important, and that is what I`ve experienced most of all over the years. Currently on 436.02 WHQL.
  • RedRizlaRedRizla Posts: 6,774 Valuable Player
    edited August 21
    IMHO, drivers sometimes give a small fps benefit but mainly stability improvements are the most important, and that is what I`ve experienced most of all over the years. Currently on 436.02 WHQL.
    Not always the case because I just saw a YouTube video where someone bench tested a game and the latest drivers were worse then the previous driver. For some reason he got 3fps less with the latest driver in the game called "The Division".
    I also found the last driver that included Nvidia 3D vision made my 3D videos stutter, so I had to choose an older driver to stop this happening.
  • ohgrantohgrant Posts: 203
    Nexus 6
      One common thing I keep coming across when reading the 3D vision forums is the Win 10 1903 update, breaking support for the fix. If you don't mind being behind in Win updates, I'd defer all big Win updates for a while.  I also have read on the MTBS forums, that a windows 10 update has already broken the activation's for Tridef 3D. I have a strong feeling that when 3D vision no longer works, it will be because of a Windows update.
      Good news for now though, Nvidia 3D vision is coming to Steam VR via the Helix fix Aug 30  https://store.steampowered.com/app/1127310/HelixVision/
  • RedRizlaRedRizla Posts: 6,774 Valuable Player
    @ohgrant - I think I read that Tridef 3D were still taking people's money even though it was no-longer supported and couldn't be activated, or am I think of another program? I can't remember now it was that long ago.
  • ohgrantohgrant Posts: 203
    Nexus 6
    edited August 21
    Yes, there was a campaign to keep IZ3D alive and the owners set a real high price. The community tried but didn't come up with the $. I didn't frequent that forum and didn't read about it until it was all over with and nothing but spammers were in the forum.  I still use that old driver and monitor on rare occasion, great for DX 8,9 and some select 10 games. 
     Sad the developers didn't come up with a more reasonable price. 
  • ohgrantohgrant Posts: 203
    Nexus 6
     Red, one thing that has been on my mind since you asked the question is, are your concerns about FPS for casual gaming or VR, or are you looking for competitive edge in your 2D gaming?
     The reason I ask and you may already know all of this. If I'm understanding correctly, the FPS that you actually see is regulated by the refresh rate of your monitor. So if your using a 60 Hz monitor, 60 FPS is what you are actually seeing and all the monitor is capable of displaying.. Fraps or other benchmark apps may be telling you a much higher number, those frames are dropped resulting in screen tearing and the need for vertical sync.  
     The 3D Vision driver requires 120 Hz for it's page flipping output, but that's 60 Hz per eye and what you are seeing is really that of a 60 Hz monitor just in 3D. I would imagine playing competitively with 3D vision would put someone at a slight disadvantage with someone with a high refresh rate monitor. As would playing on a 60 Hz monitor. 
     The thought occurs to me that a high quality high refresh rate monitor is as important to competitive gaming as the GPU when FPS is paramount to survival. 
      These uber dorks set up a slow motion test to demonstrate. 
        https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tV8P6T5tTYs&t=342s
  • RedRizlaRedRizla Posts: 6,774 Valuable Player
    edited August 22
    Mostly for VR, but I'd like to think I'm getting the most fps out of 2D gaming too. I have a Geforce 2080ti and a 144hz monitor capable of both 3D and 2D at 144Hz. I also have a 4k Samsung Qled television capable of 120Hz at 2K. I guess after paying so much money for the Geforce 2080ti, I'm just worried I'm not getting the fps I should be getting. I don't mind losing a few fps here and there, but would hate to think I'm losing something like 10fps.
  • RuneSR2RuneSR2 Posts: 3,926 Valuable Player
    edited August 23
    RedRizla said:
    Mostly for VR, but I'd like to think I'm getting the most fps out of 2D gaming too. I have a Geforce 2080ti and a 144hz monitor capable of both 3D and 2D at 144Hz. I also have a 4k Samsung Qled television capable of 120Hz at 2K. I guess after paying so much money for the Geforce 2080ti, I'm just worried I'm not getting the fps I should be getting. I don't mind losing a few fps here and there, but would hate to think I'm losing something like 10fps.

    From time to time you can always install and try a new driver - and get your performance results maybe in TimeSpy and/or Unigine Heaven - or activate the performance HUD in OTT and test your favorite VR game. And then you can revert back to the old driver. So far I've had no luck finding great performance boosts in new drivers, if I wasn't forced to abandon 385 last year I'd probably still be using that driver ;-) When getting a new video card there're of course limits to the drivers you can use.
    BTW seems like Index would be an obvious choice with your love for 120 and 144 Hz - and when having a 2080 Ti under the hood ;)


    Intel i7 7700K (4.5 GHz); MSI GeForce GTX 1080 8GB Gaming X (oc 2100 MHz gpu boost, 11 GHz mem speed); 16GB Corsair Vengeance LPX DDR4 3200 MHz; MSI Z270I Gaming Pro Carbon AC (VR-Ready) mainboard; Samsung 960 Evo M.2 SSD + Toshiba P300 HD; Windows 10 OS; Valve Index and Oculus Rift CV1 - the latter nearly always using super sampling 2.0. 

    "Ask not what VR can do for you – ask what you can do for VR"
  • RosgilliesRosgillies Posts: 154
    Art3mis
    RedRizla said:
    IMHO, drivers sometimes give a small fps benefit but mainly stability improvements are the most important, and that is what I`ve experienced most of all over the years. Currently on 436.02 WHQL.
    Not always the case because I just saw a YouTube video where someone bench tested a game and the latest drivers were worse then the previous driver. For some reason he got 3fps less with the latest driver in the game called "The Division".
    I also found the last driver that included Nvidia 3D vision made my 3D videos stutter, so I had to choose an older driver to stop this happening.
    That`s why I stated "sometimes" after the word drivers. In fact I have just reverted to 425.11 from 436.02 due to problems encountered in ETS2 which were`nt present in 425.11. A nice stable "earlier" driver.
  • RedRizlaRedRizla Posts: 6,774 Valuable Player
    edited August 23
    RedRizla said:
    IMHO, drivers sometimes give a small fps benefit but mainly stability improvements are the most important, and that is what I`ve experienced most of all over the years. Currently on 436.02 WHQL.
    Not always the case because I just saw a YouTube video where someone bench tested a game and the latest drivers were worse then the previous driver. For some reason he got 3fps less with the latest driver in the game called "The Division".
    I also found the last driver that included Nvidia 3D vision made my 3D videos stutter, so I had to choose an older driver to stop this happening.
    That`s why I stated "sometimes" after the word drivers. In fact I have just reverted to 425.11 from 436.02 due to problems encountered in ETS2 which were`nt present in 425.11. A nice stable "earlier" driver.
    Yeah, sorry. I did notice you said: "sometimes", but I didn't see you mention that a new driver can also decrease fps. That's why I mentioned it.
  • SkScotcheggSkScotchegg Posts: 1,269
    Wintermute
    Hey Rune, how's it going with your Index mate?

    What games you playing? 

    Are you still loving your Index and controllers? 
    UK: England - Leeds - - RTX 2080 - Rift CV1 & Rift S - Make love, not war - See you in the Oasis!
  • RedRizlaRedRizla Posts: 6,774 Valuable Player
    @SkScotchegg - Wrong thread :)
  • RuneSR2RuneSR2 Posts: 3,926 Valuable Player
    edited August 23
    Hey Rune, how's it going with your Index mate?

    What games you playing? 

    Are you still loving your Index and controllers? 
    Yes to all - and I may add - keeping my post just slightly relevant to this thread  o:) - that I'm using Forceware 417 as Valve has recommended, not the new driver stuff  B)

    Right now I'm into Westworld:

    https://forums.oculusvr.com/community/discussion/79828/westworld-awakening-a-new-bar-for-story-driven-vr-gaming-reviews-and-impressions

    - Actually just having a glass of red wine and waiting for the kids to sleep, so I can download the new giant expansion to Vanishing Realms which should be out 12 AM PST (in about 1 hour). Hope it'll [email protected] using Index ss 200% for truly astonishing image quality. 

    My Knuckles work perfectly - they fit my hands like gloves - even faster to put on than Touch, because I don't need the lanyards. Even though CV1 is still connected I don't use it anymore, but the kids do. And I don't miss Touch - even if Touch was awesome. Knuckles are more advanced, you have more buttons and functions, maybe not great for newbies, kids or the elderly, but I truly love my Knuckles. 

    And now back to the thread's main focus... 
    Intel i7 7700K (4.5 GHz); MSI GeForce GTX 1080 8GB Gaming X (oc 2100 MHz gpu boost, 11 GHz mem speed); 16GB Corsair Vengeance LPX DDR4 3200 MHz; MSI Z270I Gaming Pro Carbon AC (VR-Ready) mainboard; Samsung 960 Evo M.2 SSD + Toshiba P300 HD; Windows 10 OS; Valve Index and Oculus Rift CV1 - the latter nearly always using super sampling 2.0. 

    "Ask not what VR can do for you – ask what you can do for VR"
  • jayhawkjayhawk Posts: 816
    3Jane
    The CPU actually makes more of a difference with FPS, not the GPU.
  • RuneSR2RuneSR2 Posts: 3,926 Valuable Player
    jayhawk said:
    The CPU actually makes more of a difference with FPS, not the GPU.
    Of course you need a fast enough cpu to get 90 fps, but many cpus can do that in current VR games. So I'd have to greatly disagree - when pushing high levels of ss, you need tons of gpu power, not the fastest cpu you can get. 
    Intel i7 7700K (4.5 GHz); MSI GeForce GTX 1080 8GB Gaming X (oc 2100 MHz gpu boost, 11 GHz mem speed); 16GB Corsair Vengeance LPX DDR4 3200 MHz; MSI Z270I Gaming Pro Carbon AC (VR-Ready) mainboard; Samsung 960 Evo M.2 SSD + Toshiba P300 HD; Windows 10 OS; Valve Index and Oculus Rift CV1 - the latter nearly always using super sampling 2.0. 

    "Ask not what VR can do for you – ask what you can do for VR"
  • RedRizlaRedRizla Posts: 6,774 Valuable Player
    edited August 23
    jayhawk said:
    The CPU actually makes more of a difference with FPS, not the GPU.
    That depends what resolution you play the games at, I see once we reach 4k there's hardly any difference regarding cpu and fps.



  • jayhawkjayhawk Posts: 816
    3Jane
    edited August 23
    RuneSR2 said:
    jayhawk said:
    The CPU actually makes more of a difference with FPS, not the GPU.
    Of course you need a fast enough cpu to get 90 fps, but many cpus can do that in current VR games. So I'd have to greatly disagree - when pushing high levels of ss, you need tons of gpu power, not the fastest cpu you can get. 
    I'm no expert by any stretch, but it's pretty common consensus among the gaming community, especially PC gamers that the cpu carries more weight for frames. Frames is what the title addresses.
  • RedRizlaRedRizla Posts: 6,774 Valuable Player
    edited August 23
    jayhawk said:
    RuneSR2 said:
    jayhawk said:
    The CPU actually makes more of a difference with FPS, not the GPU.
    Of course you need a fast enough cpu to get 90 fps, but many cpus can do that in current VR games. So I'd have to greatly disagree - when pushing high levels of ss, you need tons of gpu power, not the fastest cpu you can get. 
    I'm no expert by any stretch, but it's pretty common consensus among the gaming community, especially PC gamers that the cpu carries more weight for frames. Frames is what the title addresses.
    It depends on the game and resolution as is demonstrated in the Youtube video I've put up in this thread. If we are just talking about 1080p resolutions then yes you will get a 10 to 20 fps increase in some games. The fps start to drop from 2k though and by 4k there's not a lot of difference in fps between cpu's.
    Flight sims are usually known to rely more on cpu then gpu, as are a few game like Arma etc, but even those don't take advantage of all cores on the cpu, if there is an advantage to be made using more cores.
    @kojack might be able to help with this because I'm no expert myself. I just think the video I put up demonstrates some of what I'm saying though.
  • LeroyVRChristopherLeroyVRChristopher Posts: 9
    NerveGear
    Usually depends on the game, fps on some games is actually hurt by some updates.
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