Facebook's Scandalous Business Tactics - Do Not Buy Oculus Products. — Oculus
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Facebook's Scandalous Business Tactics - Do Not Buy Oculus Products.

RiotsuRiotsu Posts: 14
NerveGear
Yeah, I'm fired up over this entire "no replacement cable" problem Facebook has come up with.  Everyone knows they're more than capable of making profit off of continuing to produce the cable required to run the rift, but are choosing not to in order to push us into buying a their newer HMD which isn't even an upgrade and is still full of problems.  Apple employs this scandalous, disrespectful and greedy tactic constantly with their products, and now Facebook is following suit, trying to make more profit off of forcing us previous customers to buy their new HMD's instead of replacement cables if we want to continue to use Oculus VR.

If I knew that they were going to discontinue production of the cables so early on, I would never have invested in Oculus tech.  This decision is a slap in the face to all that have invested in Oculus and will be a reoccurring issue with all future HMD's produced from this company.  This is not a tech company you can trust.  The $400 HMD you purchase here is not actually saving money if you have to replace the whole system every two to four years.  For my cousin, it would be less time before his next HMD purchase because he just bought the rift a few months ago and his cable is already wearing out (would, because he's not buying from Oculus again for this reason).

I've had to replace my cable three times in two years, primarily because the cord no longer works properly after a power outage, which is common where I live.  So, when the next random power outage happens, I'll no longer have access to the expensive VR hardware and software purchased primarily from Oculus, simply because a cord no longer works and there's no replacement.  At this point, it feels like I'm temporarily renting access to VR rather than an owner.

In conclusion, if you're interested in a VR HMD, do not buy from Oculus. Don't ever buy from Oculus.  Save up for tech that'll stretch your dollar into long-term use.
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Comments

  • inovatorinovator Posts: 1,942
    Project 2501
    edited September 6
    It's a mistatement to say it's still full of problems. White static is no longer
     a problem. I'm having no more blackout problems and using the Sony mantis headphone gives me a cv1 similar audio experience.  

  • inovatorinovator Posts: 1,942
    Project 2501
    Oh and tracking is much better with the update. 
  • RiotsuRiotsu Posts: 14
    NerveGear
    It's not a misstatement, I still hear people's microphones sometimes sending monstrous noises instead of their voice in multiplayer VR games, they always say they're using the Rift S.  So yes, it still has issues, though I'm glad you don't have them.
  • motorsepmotorsep Posts: 1,394 Oculus Start Member
    Riotsu said:
    The $400 HMD you purchase here is not actually saving money if you have to replace the whole system every two to four years.  
    By this token Sony and MS are equally "evil" since you have to buy new consoles every time they release a new one.
  • ShocksOculusShocksOculus Posts: 422
    Trinity
    Riotsu said:
    It's not a misstatement, I still hear people's microphones sometimes sending monstrous noises instead of their voice in multiplayer VR games, they always say they're using the Rift S.  So yes, it still has issues, though I'm glad you don't have them.
    And it'll get patched out.  The Rift S is steadily improving.
    i7-7700k, GTX 1080Ti (11G) || MSI B150m (1 USB controller) + Inateck 4-port USB to PCIe (2nd USB controller)
    Oculus Rift S
    Oculus GO
    Oculus RIFT - 3 sensor Room-scale
  • RiotsuRiotsu Posts: 14
    NerveGear
    motorsep said:
    Riotsu said:
    The $400 HMD you purchase here is not actually saving money if you have to replace the whole system every two to four years.  
    By this token Sony and MS are equally "evil" since you have to buy new consoles every time they release a new one.
    You misunderstand, we can still play the first Xbox consoles because we can still buy the hardware required to operate them.  We can't with Oculus Rift, because we can no longer purchase a replacement HMD cable. Once that cord expires, you'd have to purchase a new HMD.
  • RiotsuRiotsu Posts: 14
    NerveGear
    Riotsu said:
    It's not a misstatement, I still hear people's microphones sometimes sending monstrous noises instead of their voice in multiplayer VR games, they always say they're using the Rift S.  So yes, it still has issues, though I'm glad you don't have them.
    And it'll get patched out.  The Rift S is steadily improving.
    ...and in four years from now, that HMD will no longer be sold and they'll stop selling the replacement cable for that too, and you'll have to buy their next HMD model.  We can hope they fix the Rift S issues before those four years are up.
  • inovatorinovator Posts: 1,942
    Project 2501
    There are always a few people having issues but overall for the majority the issus are resolved.
  • jayhawkjayhawk Posts: 808
    3Jane
    Riotsu said:
    their newer HMD which isn't even an upgrade and is still full of problems. 
    This is where you lost credibility. I would highly disagree. The new HMD is an upgrade in many ways, and not still full of problems.
  • RiotsuRiotsu Posts: 14
    NerveGear
    edited September 6
    Even if you do consider the Rift S worth the purchase, it doesn't invalidate the point my post, but it does make the point of my post not your problem.
  • jayhawkjayhawk Posts: 808
    3Jane
    Riotsu said:
    Even if you do consider the Rift S worth the purchase, it doesn't invalidate the point my post, but it does make the point of my post not your problem.
    You might want to indicate who you are replying to, and you can't invalidate an opinion.
  • RiotsuRiotsu Posts: 14
    NerveGear
    My point is not an opinion, its business science. And I don't have to indicate who I'm replying to if it applies to multiple people, or if I don't want to.
  • ShocksOculusShocksOculus Posts: 422
    Trinity
    Riotsu said:
    Riotsu said:
    It's not a misstatement, I still hear people's microphones sometimes sending monstrous noises instead of their voice in multiplayer VR games, they always say they're using the Rift S.  So yes, it still has issues, though I'm glad you don't have them.
    And it'll get patched out.  The Rift S is steadily improving.
    ...and in four years from now, that HMD will no longer be sold and they'll stop selling the replacement cable for that too, and you'll have to buy their next HMD model.  We can hope they fix the Rift S issues before those four years are up.
    You're right! 4 years from now I will own the next Rift model; hopefully Rift 2  with eye tracking !
    i7-7700k, GTX 1080Ti (11G) || MSI B150m (1 USB controller) + Inateck 4-port USB to PCIe (2nd USB controller)
    Oculus Rift S
    Oculus GO
    Oculus RIFT - 3 sensor Room-scale
  • inovatorinovator Posts: 1,942
    Project 2501
    ShocksOculus said: kik

    Riotsu said:
    Riotsu said:
    It's not a misstatement, I still hear people's microphones sometimes sending monstrous noises instead of their voice in multiplayer VR games, they always say they're using the Rift S.  So yes, it still has issues, though I'm glad you don't have them.
    And it'll get patched out.  The Rift S is steadily improving.
    ...and in four years from now, that HMD will no longer be sold and they'll stop selling the replacement cable for that too, and you'll have to buy their next HMD model.  We can hope they fix the Rift S issues before those four years are up.
    You're right! 4 years from now I will own the next Rift model; hopefully Rift 2  with eye tracking !
    Like I said most rift users are no longer having problems. All through any hardware lifecycle there are always a few people that have problems.
  • DaftnDirectDaftnDirect Posts: 5,027 Volunteer Moderator
    edited September 6

    How does a power outage damage a cable?

    You said 'primarily caused', so what are the 'secondary causes'? are you sure something else isn't the primary cause, such as pulling or running your chair wheel over it? just curious.

    Also, it's best not to base your views of Rift-S problems on other people's posts unless you take into account the number of people who own a Rift-S vs the number of people who have posted about a problems they have (as opposed to the number of people who post about other people's problems, this post being an example), together with the number of people who have posted about problems being solved with the updates and the number of people who don't bother posting because they don't have a problem.

    Also, best not to make a judgement about whether the Rift-S is an upgrade unless you use one. Probably better to leave that judgement to those who've used both extensively. I value those opinions a lot, good and bad.

    Lastly, best not to adopt other people's problem as if they're your own generally but post if you have a problem with a Rift-S yourself. Same thing applies to any piece of hardware really.

    Just my opinion.

    Intel 5820K OC@4Ghz, Titan X (Maxwell), 16GB Corsair Vengeance DDR4, ASRock X99 Taichi, Samsung 500Gb 960 Evo M.2, Corsair H100i v2 Cooler, Inateck KTU3FR-4P USB 3 card, Windows 10 Pro v1903 (18362.239)
  • inovatorinovator Posts: 1,942
    Project 2501

    How does a power outage damage a cable?

    You said 'primarily caused', so what are the 'secondary causes'? are you sure something else isn't the primary cause, such as pulling or running your chair wheel over it? just curious.

    Also, it's best not to base your views of Rift-S problems on other people's posts unless you take into account the number of people who own a Rift-S vs the number of people who have posted about a problems they have (as opposed to the number of people who post about other people's problems, this post being an example), together with the number of people who have posted about problems being solved with the updated and the number of people who don't bother posting because they don't have a problem.

    Also, best not to make a judgement about whether the Rift-S is an upgrade unless you use one. Probably better to leave that judgement to those who've used both extensively. I value those opinions a lot, good and bad.

    Lastly, best not to adopt other people's problem as if they're your own generally but post if you have a problem with a Rift-S yourself. Same thing applies to any piece of hardware really.

    Just my opinion.


    You made me dizzy.

  • DaftnDirectDaftnDirect Posts: 5,027 Volunteer Moderator
    edited September 6
    inovator said:
    You make me dizzy.

    lol, sorry!

    Having worked in the electrical engineering sector for 32 years, I've yet to see any cable damaged by an outage. Even a voltage spike doesn't damage cables... a large current surge yes. But even then, it wouldn't happen to a device that has your PC in-line, acting as a buffer... not without the PC exploding first!

    Intel 5820K OC@4Ghz, Titan X (Maxwell), 16GB Corsair Vengeance DDR4, ASRock X99 Taichi, Samsung 500Gb 960 Evo M.2, Corsair H100i v2 Cooler, Inateck KTU3FR-4P USB 3 card, Windows 10 Pro v1903 (18362.239)
  • RiotsuRiotsu Posts: 14
    NerveGear
    edited September 6
    inovator said:
    You make me dizzy.

    lol, sorry!

    Having worked in the electrical engineering sector for 32 years, I've yet to see any cable damaged by an outage. Even a voltage spike doesn't damage cables... a large current surge yes. But even then, it wouldn't happen to a device that has your PC in-line, acting as a buffer... not without the PC exploding first!

    I think you don't have enough details about what happened and you're jumping to obviously unrealistic conclusions.  This wasn't the primary point of my post so I didn't want to go into detail, but since some people on this forum want to pick apart and outline every little sentence that I wrote and argue, I'll explain further.

    I've had 3 cables, the first one crapped out before my year was up so the replacement was covered under warranty.  The next two replacements that I've had after that failed in the same exact way.

    The cables worked fine for months.  I'm athletic in fast paced VR combat with 360' tracking so my cords get twisted and bunched up over time.  That, and my right thumbstick refuses to work when turning so in some games I can't use my controller to turn, and have to rely on physically turning.  The point where the cord gets knotted and bundled up the most is right behind where the headset itself grips the cord. 
    After the cord gets knotted up like that, when the power goes out and comes back on, I'll see bright red static streaming across the lenses when I put on the HMD.  If I pinch that knot, the red lines are gone and the vision is clear, except over time continual use with the damaged cord becomes harder to manage, to the point that pinching the cord no longer clears the image.  The red lines on all three cords, only appeared after a power outage.  Simply having the a knot in the cord's wiring wasn't enough to cause display issues

    I really wish I were lying about having to replace my cords due to power outages, then I probably wouldn't have had to make this post to begin with.
  • inovatorinovator Posts: 1,942
    Project 2501
    Riotsu said:
    inovator said:
    You make me dizzy.

    lol, sorry!

    Having worked in the electrical engineering sector for 32 years, I've yet to see any cable damaged by an outage. Even a voltage spike doesn't damage cables... a large current surge yes. But even then, it wouldn't happen to a device that has your PC in-line, acting as a buffer... not without the PC exploding first!

    I think you don't have enough details about what happened and you're jumping to obviously unrealistic conclusions.  This wasn't the primary point of my post so I didn't want to go into detail, but since some people on this forum want to pick apart and outline every little sentence that I wrote and argue, I'll explain further.

    I've had 3 cables, the first one crapped out before my year was up so the replacement was covered under warranty.  The next two replacements that I've had after that failed in the same exact way.

    The cables worked fine for months.  I'm athletic in fast paced VR combat with 360' tracking so my cords get twisted and bunched up over time.  That, and my right thumbstick refuses to work when turning so in some games I can't use my controller to turn, and have to rely on physically turning.  The point where the cord gets knotted and bundled up the most is right behind where the headset itself grips the cord. 
    After the cord gets knotted up like that, when the power goes out and comes back on, I'll see bright red static streaming across the lenses when I put on the HMD.  If I pinch that knot, the red lines are gone and the vision is clear, except over time continual use with the damaged cord becomes harder to manage, to the point that pinching the cord no longer clears the image.  The red lines on all three cords, only appeared after a power outage.  Simply having the a knot in the cord's wiring wasn't enough to cause display issues

    I really wish I were lying about having to replace my cords due to power outages, then I probably wouldn't have had to make this post to begin with.
    It sounds like your more physical in vr than average which is fine of course but the average person does have that kind of wear and tear.
  • DaftnDirectDaftnDirect Posts: 5,027 Volunteer Moderator
    edited September 6

    I didn't make any conclusions, I just asked the question. And I think you've answered it by saying the problem wasn't power outages in your area, which you said it was. It's more like the cord getting damaged from twisting and possibly shorting, causing blackouts at the screen. Not power outages in your area.

    The remainder of my post was about how it's better not to make judgements about the Rift-S unless you've had experience of it. Again, that's not jumping to conclusions, that really just good practice. In fact making judgements without using the kit would be jumping to conclusions.

    Intel 5820K OC@4Ghz, Titan X (Maxwell), 16GB Corsair Vengeance DDR4, ASRock X99 Taichi, Samsung 500Gb 960 Evo M.2, Corsair H100i v2 Cooler, Inateck KTU3FR-4P USB 3 card, Windows 10 Pro v1903 (18362.239)
  • RiotsuRiotsu Posts: 14
    NerveGear

    How does a power outage damage a cable?

    You said 'primarily caused', so what are the 'secondary causes'? are you sure something else isn't the primary cause, such as pulling or running your chair wheel over it? just curious.

    Also, it's best not to base your views of Rift-S problems on other people's posts unless you take into account the number of people who own a Rift-S vs the number of people who have posted about a problems they have (as opposed to the number of people who post about other people's problems, this post being an example), together with the number of people who have posted about problems being solved with the updates and the number of people who don't bother posting because they don't have a problem.

    Also, best not to make a judgement about whether the Rift-S is an upgrade unless you use one. Probably better to leave that judgement to those who've used both extensively. I value those opinions a lot, good and bad.

    Lastly, best not to adopt other people's problem as if they're your own generally but post if you have a problem with a Rift-S yourself. Same thing applies to any piece of hardware really.

    Just my opinion.

    You and every other commenter here have focused on only a little about I've said about the Rift S. 
    "which isn't even an upgrade and is still full of problems" yes this is my opinion based off other reviews.  If you don't like it, I don't care.  That wasn't the point of my post.  How are we to learn anything if we don't read what other people report from their findings?  Why read if you don't want to know what other people went through, how are we to communicate if we can't repeat other people's experiences?  I find that learning other people's opinions or their findings of other people's opinions can give me a more realistic idea of a product's worth than professionally written reviews that are meant to sell the product, even if it does outline some deficiencies.  You value a different kind of information, fine, you don't get to tell me what to write.

    If you're happy with your Rift S and you think it was worth the upgrade, good for you.  I don't care.  I wasn't speaking for you, I was only repeating what other Rift S owners have been reporting regularly, which is still a supportive detail for the point of my whole post.
  • RiotsuRiotsu Posts: 14
    NerveGear

    I didn't make any conclusions, I just asked the question. And I think you've answered it by saying the problem wasn't power outages in your area, which you said it was. It's more like the cord getting damaged from twisting and possibly shorting, causing blackouts at the screen. Not power outages in your area.

    The remainder of my post was about how it's better not to make judgements about the Rift-S unless you've had experience of it. Again, that's not jumping to conclusions, that really just good practice. In fact making judgements without using the kit would be jumping to conclusions.

    oh my god, you just want to argue pointlessly and refuse to read what I'm writing.

    "The red lines on all three cords, only appeared after a power outage.  Simply having the a knot in the cord's wiring wasn't enough to cause display issues".  So yes, the problem was from power outages in my area and it did not cause "blackouts at the screen," it was red lines streaming across the screens.

    That's it, talking to you is like talking to a wall.  Its pointless.  This post wasn't for you anyway.
  • DaftnDirectDaftnDirect Posts: 5,027 Volunteer Moderator
    edited September 6

    I focused on the 2 main parts of your posts. First the power outage in your area causing cable damage and the disadvantages of assessing negative views of hardware without considering the number of units sold or the positive views or the likelihood of people not posting if they have no problems.

    I haven't expressed a view about the Rift-S here. As I've said, I value views from people who've used it whether they are positive or negative.

    Intel 5820K OC@4Ghz, Titan X (Maxwell), 16GB Corsair Vengeance DDR4, ASRock X99 Taichi, Samsung 500Gb 960 Evo M.2, Corsair H100i v2 Cooler, Inateck KTU3FR-4P USB 3 card, Windows 10 Pro v1903 (18362.239)
  • RattyUKRattyUK Posts: 889
    3Jane
    If you get regular power outages it would make sense to invest in a UPS for your PC, at least then when the power goes off you will be able to shut the PC down gracefully, and save yourself a problem.
    Why you want to blame a business for your own mistakes I really don't know.  I'm sure the cost of a UPS would have been considerably less than the expense of buying 3 replacement cables...
    PC info: AMD Ryzen 7 2700X, Asus ROG Crosshair VII Hero, 16GB Tforce Pro Dark DDR4 3200, KFA2 RTX 2080 Super, Samsung 870 Pro M.2, 2x 240GB SSD, 3TB WD Green HDD & 4 TB Seagate Barracuda HDD, Corsair Modular 750w PSU, custom watercooling loop. (Win 10 Pro & Opensuse Leap 15.1 Linux) 32" AOC 4K Monitor.

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  • OmegaM4NOmegaM4N Posts: 526
    Neo
    edited September 7
    Evil, no, somewhat overly dramatic would you not agree, BUT!, i do understand your point about the cable, making it a proprietary cable in the first place then removing access to replacement cables just 3 plus years into the products life could come across as trying to force people to buy the next product up the line because they have no other option, a bit like Apple interfering with peoples products to quietly make them upgrade to a faster ones......i am on the fence at the moment over this, i just do not know what to make of it, i love my CV1 and my Go, but this is not a good situation at all.....if true.......would be great if they were just out of stock because if they appear again i will be grabbing one right away. lol
  • rednekcowboy77rednekcowboy77 Posts: 79
    Hiro Protagonist
    edited September 7
    Oculus has always employed shady tactics  They employ and spend money on shills to proliferate and derail any thread on here or reddit with anyone that has an issue with either "I have a perfect experience" posts or trolls to outright attack and belittle people that have real issues and valid complaints.  There is even a post from a user on these forums with a user stating that was the very reason they gave up and returned their Rift S.

    It can be found here:

    https://forums.oculusvr.com/community/discussion/76183/oculus-rift-s-black-screen-on-msi-laptop-with-mini-display-port-adapter#latest


  • ZenbaneZenbane Posts: 14,376 Valuable Player
    edited September 7
    Riotsu said:
    My point is not an opinion, its business science.
    Complaining isn't business nor science. You have the right to complain, but lets just be clear in that... all you have done so far is complain. No business science has been presented.

    Regarding your first post, you are very much jumping to conclusions and taking a few logical leaps. Case in point, many of us here have maintained our Rifts since launch (over 3 years) and never had to replace anything. My Rift and Touch controllers have taken a beating: Dropped, smashed, thrown, covered in sweat. And so far the only thing I've ever had to do was tighten the screw on the headphones. And I only had to do that once.

    The problem you are describing is clearly the result of the power outages you experience. The answer is incredibly simple:

    BUY AN UNINTERRUPTIBLE POWER SUPPLY
    Here's a link to get you started:

    This is not a case of scandalous business practices, this is a case of you living somewhere that has ongoing power outages and you never once deciding to resolve your issue with an easy UPS solution.
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  • rednekcowboy77rednekcowboy77 Posts: 79
    Hiro Protagonist
    Zenbane said:
    Riotsu said:
    My point is not an opinion, its business science.
    Complaining isn't business nor science. You have the right to complain, but lets just be clear in that... all you have done so far is complain. No business science has been presented.

    Regarding your first post, you are very much jumping to conclusions and taking a few logical leaps. Case in point, many of us here have maintained our Rift's since launch (over 3 years) and never had to replace anything. My Rift and Touch controllers have taken a beating: Dropped, smashed, thrown, covered in sweat. And so far the only thing I've ever had to do was tighten the screw on the headphones. And I only had to do that once.

    The problem you are describing is clearly the result of the power outages you experience. The answer is incredibly simple:

    BUY AN UNINTERRUPTIBLE POWER SUPPLY
    Here's a link to get you started:

    This is not a case of scandalous business practices, this is a case of you living somewhere that has ongoing power outages and you never once deciding to resolve your issue with an easy UPS solution.
    I agree 100%.  I'm in an apartment where a power outage actually blew my psu on my pc.  I was fortunate and my landlord covered the cost of the replacement but I've added a power supply into the mix simply to protect it as I got off lucky that the psu was the only thing that gave out.
  • rednekcowboy77rednekcowboy77 Posts: 79
    Hiro Protagonist
    The point where the cord gets knotted and bundled up the most is right behind where the headset itself grips the cord.  
    After the cord gets knotted up like that, when the power goes out and comes back on, I'll see bright red static streaming across the lenses when I put on the HMD.  If I pinch that knot, the red lines are gone and the vision is clear, except over time continual use with the damaged cord becomes harder to manage, to the point that pinching the cord no longer clears the image.  The red lines on all three cords, only appeared after a power outage.  Simply having the a knot in the cord's wiring wasn't enough to cause display issues

    I really wish I were lying about having to replace my cords due to power outages, then I probably wouldn't have had to make this post to begin with.
    Sounds to me like you don't take enough care of your equipment.  I, like you, only play active VR games--I didn't purchase my Rift, Rift-S or Vive to sit on the couch with a controller in my hand.  That being said, I have never--EVER had a knot in any of my cables. 

    However I take great care in my equipment.  I routinely untwist the cables when there is a break in gameplay and when I am done a session. 

    Regardless of how active you are, there is no reason for your cables to get twisted to the point there are actualy knots in them.  That is death to any cable and the only cause is pure negligence on your part.
  • andysonofbobandysonofbob Posts: 226
    Nexus 6
    Hi

    So, if you have red line showing on 3 different cables, it's probably not the cables. 

    Soz if you have already said this. Have you tried using a different port on your gfx card or plugging in a different output device to test the hdmi input, or a different USB port etc?

    Anything up the chain that can be affected by power outs?
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