HP Reverb G2 - collaboration between HP, Valve and Microsoft

RuneSR2

More here - sounds big with HP working together with Valve and Microsoft:

https://uploadvr.com/hp-reverb-g2-teased/

RuneSR2

Soon available on Steam? The plot thickens, lol:

https://store.steampowered.com/app/1271440/Next_Gen_HP_VR_Headset/

kevinw729

Seems that Valve may be handing over more of their support to HP than to HTC - as they have ploughed their own path going forward. Now with the off the ear audio, and the new tracking, this will place the new headset in a very competitive position, especially with the CV1 now discontinued, and the issues with the Rift-S. Though I wonder if they will push this new headset in Consumer as hard as they have been working in Enterprise?

Shadowmask72

looks interesting. Probably the previously announced upgrade from HP. Working with Valve could be an interesting partnership in how it leverages against the Index.

kevinw729

Shadowmask72 said:

looks interesting. Probably the previously announced upgrade from HP. Working with Valve could be an interesting partnership in how it leverages against the Index.

Really  not sure if its "leverage", the best analogy is like Mercedes working with Ford on sharing licensed tech. There is no real way that the Reverb G3 will compete with the Index unless they can cost reduce this version, and their plans for a Index-Lite have been dealt some really harsh cards in the current climate. This may be a way to generate revenue without having to do the thing they hate so much (manufacturer and support).  The bigger question has to be will HTC be happy to see this and do they have any recourse?

RuneSR2

Really interesting to see the specs and price. With so many complaints about Index price I'd be surprised if the price goes beyond $800...

Looks like we're being flooded with Gen2 hmds these days.

kojack

Some leaks have apparently come out. (As usual, be cautious of any leak)

https://www.roadtovr.com/rumor-leaked-hp-reverb-g2-four-camera-new-controllers/

There's 2 pics, which show 4 cameras on the G2, what may be a hardware IPD slider and new controllers.

On May 28 HP and Microsoft are having a tech talk described as "Come learn more about HP’s vision for the future with exciting announcements and special guests from Microsoft. Join us for this special conversation."

The talk is by Joanna Popper, who is HP's Global Head of Virtual Reality, and John Ludwig, HP's Lead Product Manager for Virtual Reality.

I'd say its a safe bet that we'll get some G2 details there.

OmegaM4N

^^This could turn out to be a kind Index lite, or a index S if you will, meaning unlike a actual WMR HMDs, which have issues if they are not supported by steam vr game, this might be seen by SteamVR as a sort of index lite, and as such the controllers basic functions like the thumbsticks, touchpad and triggers will all work just like they do on the knuckles, hence removing any issues with controller support that the WMR controllers have at present with a lot of steamVR games, and that would be awesome.

kojack

I've heard that the IPD slider and padding are very similar to the Index's design, and the headphones appear to be off ear Index style. It's still WMR based on Microsoft's participation (and the potential reveal on thursday has two HP staff and an MS guy, nobody from Valve is listed). The controllers have the windows logo on two buttons.

I wonder how much of the 4 camera solution was on HP and how much on MS? Will we see more WMR headsets with 4 cameras?

I like that the controllers have a menu and windows button on each, which should eliminate the issue with the Rift/Quest where only the right controller has the system button, which is a problem for people with limited or no use of the right hand.

Kareshi

Some people have their skepticism on these leaks being real as they note the controllers look too similar to the Oculus ones, as well as the face buttons looking "exactly like the oculus ones".
I'm excited so I want to believe this leak, but we'll hopefully find out next week. 

RuneSR2

The most interesting stuff may be res and fov, sound does look like Index speakers. Controllers look ok, if these are real, battery time will be interesting - and tracking.

Kareshi

Doesn't the Gen1 Reverb have 2160*2160 per eye? I haven't experienced such high res before, but seeing others reaction, I think it's perfect for a VR for now. I do hope they do something like 130FOV which someone on reddit who "leaked the specs" said, but also have better lenses with bigger sweets pot.

Anyways, here check out the specs posted by the user u/Specspower on reddit:
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I am not under NDA and this can be considered hearsay, however here is what i have overheard to be the true specifications for the new hp reverb G2.

*The new reverb g2 has a 2160x2160 screen, with improved optics and a even sharper image and larger sweet spot then the original reverb. They are fresnel lenses

*Godrays are almost completely gone

*The refresh rate in the windows mixed reality application is maxed at 90hz however in steam it is 144hz

*The headset has the option of using windows mixed reality controllers or knuckles controllers and this may remain in the final unit as a duel option or just become one

*Inside out tracking and base station compatible

*The field of view was estimated at about a true 130 degrees and this is largely achieved by the position of the lenses, they are round but become triangular shaped on the edges towards your nose

*The new reverb g2 has over the ear headphones, with an option for your own headphones using a standard jack and they are testing the idea of including a bluetooth audio solution

*The headstrap is similar to the first reverb

*The padded face mask is a stitched leather and is removable

*The outside shell is some kind of brushed aluminium

*The front has a hp logo that lights up

* The weight is the same or slightly lighter then the original reverb

* The issue of seeing the border edge of the lense in the original reverb is solved

*The lenses are further from the eyes allowing glasses wearers ease of use

*The IPD adjustment is digital but works better then the original reverb

*The cable is roughly 15ft

*The connection is a mini display port and usb

The unit is a hybrid of the original reverb and the valve index, taking the best from both.

RuneSR2

Could be a true gen3 (ok at least 2.5 then, lol) hmd if that res, Knuckles support and fov are true. 
Still sounds nearly too good to be true, we'll see. Knuckles + 2 base stations will probably add at least $500 to total costs... 

Kareshi

RuneSR2 said:

Could be a true gen3 (ok at least 2.5 then, lol) hmd if that res, Knuckles support and fov are true. 
Still sounds nearly too good to be true, we'll see. Knuckles + 2 base stations will probably add at least $500 to total costs... 

After these bullet points, others have pointed out how it contradicts the image leaks, as well as how mini display port can only do 4k 30fps which would go against the 2160x2160 @ possibly 90Hz or more, etc.

RuneSR2

CallMeJay360 said:

RuneSR2 said:

Could be a true gen3 (ok at least 2.5 then, lol) hmd if that res, Knuckles support and fov are true. 
Still sounds nearly too good to be true, we'll see. Knuckles + 2 base stations will probably add at least $500 to total costs... 

After these bullet points, others have pointed out how it contradicts the image leaks, as well as how mini display port can only do 4k 30fps which would go against the 2160x2160 @ possibly 90Hz or more, etc.

Makes sense - dunno if 4k in 144 Hz is beyond current displayport limits too (HDMI 2.1 needed?). Also using these full specs, G2 would dethrone Index in every way, which might not be in Valve's interest. My guess is that HP wants a solution which isn't much more expensive than G1. 

snowdog

How can it have base station support? It doesn't appear to have light sensors on it or the controllers.

nalex66

snowdog said:

How can it have base station support? It doesn't appear to have light sensors on it or the controllers.

Probably like Cosmos, base station support means using Vive wands or Index controllers. The headset could have hidden sensors, or it could still rely on its cameras for headset tracking. 

kevinw729

snowdog said:

How can it have base station support? It doesn't appear to have light sensors on it or the controllers.

Wait and see

Kareshi

RuneSR2 said:

CallMeJay360 said:

RuneSR2 said:

Could be a true gen3 (ok at least 2.5 then, lol) hmd if that res, Knuckles support and fov are true. 
Still sounds nearly too good to be true, we'll see. Knuckles + 2 base stations will probably add at least $500 to total costs... 

After these bullet points, others have pointed out how it contradicts the image leaks, as well as how mini display port can only do 4k 30fps which would go against the 2160x2160 @ possibly 90Hz or more, etc.

Makes sense - dunno if 4k in 144 Hz is beyond current displayport limits too (HDMI 2.1 needed?). Also using these full specs, G2 would dethrone Index in every way, which might not be in Valve's interest. My guess is that HP wants a solution which isn't much more expensive than G1. 

Exactly, I think as far as Valve goes, considering the image leaks I think it'll be hardware specific like audio, face mask and head strap. Having Light house support would increase the cost of the headset imo. I expect the same res and 90Hz since it's a good middle ground in Hz, but really good in Resolution, we'll have to wait and see. But I expect more WMR 2.0 headsets to be shown next week as some has speculated considering some YTbers are under NDA by another headset that isn't HP.

Kareshi

kevinw729 said:

snowdog said:

How can it have base station support? It doesn't appear to have light sensors on it or the controllers.

Wait and see

Now this is interesting, I honestly expect one of these WMR 2.0 HMDs to be minimum $500, we'll see. 

OmegaM4N

^^I will take one for £450 if it has complete steamVR support on par with the Index, so if a game works with the index it will work with this new HMD, and moreso the controllers basic fuctions like thumbstick and buttons, something that held back the present WMR HMDs.

RuneSR2

OmegaM4N said:

^^I will take one for £450 if it has complete steamVR support on par with the Index, so if a game works with the index it will work with this new HMD, and moreso the controllers basic fuctions like thumbstick and buttons, something that held back the present WMR HMDs.

4k res could be tempting, especially if it works with base stations and Knuckles - but then again, 3 hmds will be too much - one will just end up collecting dust...

I still have one DisplayPort free, but it would probably never work with G2 and Index connected at the same time - that's the great advantage of having Oculus separated from Steam, they don't bother each other and have their own homes and stores, lol. Even if I accidentally start SteamVR while CV1 is fully activated, Index still takes priority. So 2 are nice, 3 would probably be a hassle...   

kojack

I run with 3 headsets connected at once: Rift CV1, Rift-S and Quest Link.

That's the great thing about the Oculus software, just click Set As Active next to the one you want to use and it works.

RuneSR2

Agreed, would solve all my worries if Valve did the same. Can't be hard with a Steam switch for choosing the active hmd... But if 2% of Steam users have a hmd connected, then maybe 0.001% have two, lol. 

OmegaM4N

I would just ditch the Dell and Vive and replace it with this one, assuming it was basically supported on steamVr as a index lite or S, but i would have to keep the CV1 because i have bought software on the Oculus platform and revive seems to be working with less and less these days, just found out Stern pinball no longer will works via it, i don't know if this is steam or oculus causing this, but it looked great on the Dell because of the 1440x1440 res, and i bought all the tables back in the day.

snowdog

I can't see a 2K headset being $450, probably more likely to be $600 I think. How much is the Reverb?

Shadowmask72

Yeh definitely on my list of upgrade from the original reverb.  I think they retailed at $649 for enterprise version and $579 home version iirc.

Kareshi

https://twitter.com/ZbyHP/status/1264957464258248705 more teases, keep an eye on the details of the video, they look just like the leaked images, so

Mradr

In a way it feels like a step backwards to what Oculus is offering for the same type of tracking - 4 vs 5 cameras. On the other hand - the headset is not that costly and 600-800 is the range I would spend for a higher end headset - so perfect middle ground for hardware/specs I be the most interested in. So far HP has shown in the past it can do VR over coughcosmoscough so looking forward to this release for sure! Also, keep in mind these headsets are just the next step up - I wouldn't call it a generational leap yet. Until we hear more on a number of different specs - I assume its more of a refresh of their current line up as things mature. For example, if the image is true - it looks like they are going for a more stream-line plastic shell vs gen 1 fancy looking shell.

Other things to keep in mind (base off the specs above):
1) IF they kept the same resolution but up the FOV - that means more pixels are spread across the screen thus lowering the PPD down witch isn't the best idea for screen image quality (something MRTV notice about the StarVR - but didn't directly say it when he compare it to Index). Granted - it was already high before - 16PPD is still much higher than a lot of current headsets.
2) If the Res didnt increase, that means  the screen it self got the improvements witch is good still - but might still explain a higher cost as the higher the refresh rates - the more cooling and power it takes along with cost.
3) If they do increase the Res - it also means it will take a larger video card as there is no offset technology like FOVA at play.
4) If they did go digital IDP that means they switch to a single display vs dual displays for each eye. Lowering the cost, but removing feature as we see with other VR products.
5) Increase FOV means all games REALLY need a FOV setting option. Even Aylx is missing this feature for headsets that have a higher FOV. Other wise side objects in view will pop in and out. This also puts more demand on the GPU inside of things.
6) Everything is still a trade off but improving non the less:3

Voodooimaxx

HP Employee

(Our comments are ours and NOT HP's)
5 points·16 hours ago
There are MANY things wrong in his post.

kojack said:

I wonder how much of the 4 camera solution was on HP and how much on MS? Will we see more WMR headsets with 4 cameras?

I think so if anyone else goes over to WMR - the tracking is done by MS - I would assume something from Samsung is just around the bin as well. The real question is if the other players will come back too or did they get burn off the deal enough last time? I also wonder if this is more of a play for MS in terms of trying to work with one partner to get it right than to have many and be across the board stretch. 

hoppingbunny123

how exciting. 

Luciferous

I refuse to get excited, my heart has been broken too many times I might go for mild but reluctant hope.