VR overhyped? - Page 4 — Oculus
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VR overhyped?

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  • 7andromeda77andromeda7 Posts: 136
    Hiro Protagonist
    @archaicbereft

    Just thought I'd share this with you...and everyone else listening of course!
    When you mentioned at the beginning of your post about the sense of just "looking at a flat screen"-
    I definately just experienced that. And it came in a demo that I was really looking forward to.
    Seza Peso. This is a real shock for me as I've had great moments of presence in things like RedFrame, Discovering Space and Live for Speed
    Literally nothing in the demo gave me that "can almost touch it" feeling. I remember watching reaction videos of the DK1 version and thinking woah, that has got to be the business!
    Maybe its the lower FOV? perhaps its the lack of control within the environment? I really dont know..but that was a real shock for me.

    I'm not concerned thou as there is stuff out there that really DOES work..
    archaic- have you tried Discovering Space?
  • WirelineWireline Posts: 1,203
    NerveGear
    I think there is a stage of 3d acclimitisation that happens. At first, I was seeing the 3D and was amazed by it, but now I am finding its as though the brain "accepts" the 3D as just being real. Nothing changed in my setup, I'm using the dame demos - the emotional impact and wow factor is whats actually missing, as opposed to any actual 3D effect.

    In movies, 3D effects are often exaggerated to have greater impact e.g. having stuff shoved in your face. Maybe more rift games need this exaggerated approach to counter "3D acceptance", if such a thing exists?
  • floydfreakfloydfreak Posts: 386
    Hiro Protagonist
    @ Ax23000 - Excellent post!

    I totally agree with you, & I don't mind admitting that I've been SO into a book, movie, game & not forgetting of course a good song too..
    It's all about 'getting into it' and letting go a bit I think!!

    AND a lot more factors too of course. However, I think that Ax23000's post is definitely pointing at the 'first step' so to speak.
  • archaicbereftarchaicbereft Posts: 363
    Hiro Protagonist
    Ax23000 wrote:
    snip
    I LOOOOVE Farscape! Cannot wait for the movie project they have going on to be revealed :D

    I guess I subconsciously "see the puppets" in DK2 however :(
    ryanyth wrote:
    So don't worry about not being immersed, instead feel proud that you are being invited
    to be one of the early pioneers to experience a taste of a whole new wave of visual entertainment of the future.

    I absolutely do, I love my DK2, I only meant Overhyped in comparison to the media, but now I see it's just me (the minority unable to achieve immersion or presence).... this has not stopped me from enjoying my DK2 for the plethora of other reasons it's still great.
    snip

    Yes I have tried Discovering space... I was unimpressed :(

    however I have tried Senza Peso on DK2 and I have had the opposite reaction to you, I LOVED IT... I think it's one of my favorite DK2 experiences so far, if not the best one I have tried personally.
    I literally had my mouth open on some parts and I really can see the potential for the hardware especially once we get higher resolutions fov etc....

    I guess we are all different, my brain seems a lot harder to please but it's not something I can control... I really try to be fooled.
    Almost any idea can seem obvious once the inventor tells you how it works.
  • RorschachPhoenixRorschachPhoenix Posts: 1,594 Valuable Player
    Hello,

    I have tested the DK2 on gamescom and was shocked in a very bad way.

    Because there are dozens videos and reports on the internet where people flipping out and saying how awesome and real the experience is. Like being transported to another world. Great immersion, etc.

    I was afraid that my expectations are too high. I was also afraid of motion sickness.

    When I tested the DK2 (Demo: Superhot) I couldn't think clear, but my subconscious mind thought: "This can't be! This isn't what I'd expected. The resolution is horrible. It's like wearing a screen in front of my head. I'm not in the game. There is no immersion. And I feel no presence at all. Where is the future I believed in? No motion sickness. That is good... is it? No feelings at all. I am shocked. Just play the stupid game. There's nothing left to see here."
    After 5 minutes or so I have to put the rift down. Next one!

    It was such a let down. It took 5 minutes to destroy what I believed in. Where was the technology of the future? All I wanted was a proof. A glance of the future.

    After that experience I was broken, because the Rift was the only thing I was interested in at that time. The Rift was the reason for me to visit gamescom.

    But I did not want to give up so easily. I wanted to test the Virtualizer... and the DK1.
    Immersion, presence... I had to experience something. But I wouldn't wait there for 8 hours. After an hour I thought to myself: I need to test DK2 again. I have to test another demo. Maybe the demo was the problem.

    So I tested DK2 again (Luckey's Tale - wanted to test EVE VR, but I couldn't): The resolution seemed better this time. Maybe because of the bright colors. Nice Mario 64 type of a game. And there it is... at least a little bit of 3D feeling. Better than nothing.

    Overall I think my expectations were way to high.

    A few weeks later I had the opportunity to test the DK2 private. Not at home, but somewhere else. I tested for 3 hours. No motion sickness. But Cyberspace made me dizzy immediately. I stoped it right away.

    I felt a glance of presence (weird feeling) in "Sightline: The chair" and "Lava Inc." "Lava Inc." was also uncomfortable. I felt a little dizzy (only a problem in rollercoaster games).

    In spite of my not that good experiences, it can only get better. And I think VR will be a huge thing. I am happy to see it happen.


    Greetings: Rorschach-Phoenix
    Excuse my bad english. I speak to you through the google translator. :P
  • ItsinthemindItsinthemind Posts: 485
    Hiro Protagonist
    Yes, you have listed good points why VR is not yet ready, but Cresent Bay already addresses many of these issues. One that I still find somewhat most spoiling is the framed vision and I think this will only be solved once the image is projected straight into the retina or some other very clever optical tricks.

    My main concern is that after the initial WOW the market will cool off so quickly that it just becomes another gadget like 3d TV and people will lose interest and not allowing us to recoup our investments (souped-up PCs, Software, goggles, time etc).

    There are plenty of other things which need to be solved beforehand, judder is another big spoiler. It's got to be as close to perfect as possible when hitting the shelves and ideally have a certain addictive quality to succeed, like our mobiles which offer something that people are now relying on and which cannot easily be achieved using alternatives. That something has to be something that will put it in most people's hands. I am not sure it will be games, but I can imagine it could be training, education and virtual communication etc. I am not yet convinced by the gaming aspect, but that will probably change once we are getting more used to this new medium and big AAA developers with the million dollar budgets will join in.
    http://www.lightandmagic.co.uk Fantasy becomes Reality
  • mrcrispmrcrisp Posts: 267
    Art3mis
    Yes, you have listed good points why VR is not yet ready, but Cresent Bay already addresses many of these issues. One that I still find somewhat most spoiling is the framed vision and I think this will only be solved once the image is projected straight into the retina or some other very clever optical tricks.

    Uh, the Rift image is `projected into the retina`, that is what the lenses are for and how the eye see's the Rifts image.

    Unless someone were to use marketing spiel such as `virtual retina display` cough cough- mentioing no names. :mrgreen: all light is `projected into the retina` when you see.
    PC Specs: i7-5820k, 16gb DDR4 2400mhz, MSI gaming mainboard, MSI GTX 980 4gb, Samsung Pro SSD, 2x1tb WD Black HDD, 700w Certified PSU, 3xAcer 27" monitor, 47" TV, Xbox360 Controller, CH Pro HOTAS, Fanatec Wheel+Pedals, Windows 7 64bit.
  • RorschachPhoenixRorschachPhoenix Posts: 1,594 Valuable Player
    Yes, you have listed good points why VR is not yet ready, but Cresent Bay already addresses many of these issues.

    I watched the livestream. Amazing anouncement! But I have to keep my expectations low this time.
    I am not yet convinced by the gaming aspect, but that will probably change once we are getting more used to this new medium and big AAA developers with the million dollar budgets will join in.

    I agree. I tested 12 demos or something, but there was no "real" game. It felt like nice experiments but nothing tangible.

    Funny thing: I tested the DK2 on gamescom. On the same day I tested Alien: Isolation (without OR) and felt way more immersed. Because the game builds great immersion. Graphics, Sound, Design... only the controller bothers me (PC player - keyboard and mouse is everything to me).
    Excuse my bad english. I speak to you through the google translator. :P
  • obzenobzen Posts: 713
    Nexus 6
    I would say so. I love VR, but I really don't see it as being for everybody.
    DK1 FREAK...Ntbt8Ya.gif
  • SharpfishSharpfish Posts: 1,300
    Trinity
    Yes, you have listed good points why VR is not yet ready, but Cresent Bay already addresses many of these issues.

    I watched the livestream. Amazing anouncement! But I have to keep my expectations low this time.
    I am not yet convinced by the gaming aspect, but that will probably change once we are getting more used to this new medium and big AAA developers with the million dollar budgets will join in.

    I agree. I tested 12 demos or something, but there was no "real" game. It felt like nice experiments but nothing tangible.

    Funny thing: I tested the DK2 on gamescom. On the same day I tested Alien: Isolation (without OR) and felt way more immersed. Because the game builds great immersion. Graphics, Sound, Design... only the controller bothers me (PC player - keyboard and mouse is everything to me).


    Seriously this is mostly a software issue. You mentioned exactly the problem. You played some trivial, cartoony demos and then played alien isolation (Non rift version) and felt it was way better. The latter is of course made to immerse and is inline with the kind of experience most of us VR nuts have dreamed of. DK2 certainly has flaws that don't help immersion BUT in my time with my DK2 I've found that it's software more than hardware letting it down, and when the software is good everything feels good.

    Sadly all the software currently available is only a hint at what's to come so people are forming opinions based on NON addictive 'experiences' that are designed to impress for a minute or two and then leave you feeling unimpressed. Take when the PS4 came out for example, a decent upgrade to the PS3 yet there wasn't really anything to show it off so many buyers probably felt unimpressed (and may remain so until UC4 or a proper Last of us Sequel... the next GT etc).

    The hardware definitely has to improve and Crescent bay appears to be a stepping stone towards 'bare minimum' hardware to do VR justice. I agree the FOV could and should be better in the future if we want better immersion, and certainly the resolution needs to be. However even in DK2 when you actually own one and use it, you recalibrate to the pixel density and ignore it automatically *IF* the software is done well. In my own software I'm working on I design so as not to highlight the low res/aliasing etc, and things feel super solid and immersive because the DK2's flaws are not being amplified. Many if not most of the available 'demos' currently for VR simply don't follow great design rules for VR, most are just cool ideas slapped into a HMD and hoping for the best (not ALL, there are a couple of standouts that really took time to try to do VR well given current constraints).

    It is still being worked on, the hardware and the software and once all the kinks are worked out things are going to be great. It's a bit like the dawn of videogames all over again, seriously, so much old thinking has to go, so many new solutions need to be found but it's exciting because it's a challenge and an opportunity. Within a couple of years we'll have amazing HMDs, proper VR controls and AAA built for VR games. THAT is when VR should be judged, not now based on essentially prototypes and works in progress.

    Some of us when we don a DK2 can see the possibilities of VR and what it's hinting at, as I guess Luckey himself did when he made his first successful prototype a couple of years back. THAT is what is exciting about VR as it stands today, the fact we are finally on the right track and the ball is rolling. I see the flaws of the DK2 but I see the exciting future it also hints at even more. It invokes my imagination even with the simplest of scenes about 'what if?' which traditional gaming had not done in a few years. And to know it's just going to get better and better means we shouldn't worry so much right now about the technicalities and focus on being creative and looking to the (near) future.

    DK2 is no consumer product, nor is Crescent bay. CV1 will be a much different experience all round from software to hardware to ergonomics.
    EX DK2, EX VIVE, EX PSVR, Currently RIFT CV1 | VR developer
    Poster of the week who never got a T-Shirt ;( dayum they looked tasty!
  • RorschachPhoenixRorschachPhoenix Posts: 1,594 Valuable Player
    Sharpfish wrote:
    Walloftext

    Thanks for sharing your thoughts. I agree on all points. :)
    Excuse my bad english. I speak to you through the google translator. :P
  • SharpfishSharpfish Posts: 1,300
    Trinity
    Sharpfish wrote:
    Walloftext

    Thanks for sharing your thoughts. I agree on all points. :)

    Hey I'm passionate about VR so I have a lot of thoughts. :) better than having none.
    EX DK2, EX VIVE, EX PSVR, Currently RIFT CV1 | VR developer
    Poster of the week who never got a T-Shirt ;( dayum they looked tasty!
  • RorschachPhoenixRorschachPhoenix Posts: 1,594 Valuable Player
    Sharpfish wrote:
    Sharpfish wrote:
    Walloftext

    Thanks for sharing your thoughts. I agree on all points. :)

    Hey I'm passionate about VR so I have a lot of thoughts. :) better than having none.

    For me it takes forever to write a text in english. So, I couldn't share all my thoughts, even if I wanted to.
    I try to write only if I can contribute to something. Or I write nothing. Sometimes it's not the badest choise. ;)
    Excuse my bad english. I speak to you through the google translator. :P
  • It is completely overhyped.

    It doesn't mean that it's not going to be good.
    NZ DK2 Order: May 26, 2014 06:00 PM PDT
    Status:Delivery Complete
  • goldenegggoldenegg Posts: 552
    Trinity
    I don't believe VR is overhyped. I think a major problem is that some people have unrealistic expectations.
  • RorschachPhoenixRorschachPhoenix Posts: 1,594 Valuable Player
    goldenegg wrote:
    I don't believe VR is overhyped. I think a major problem is that some people have unrealistic expectations.

    And that is (in my opinion) caused by all the youtube videos with the screaming people.
    Excuse my bad english. I speak to you through the google translator. :P
  • Affordable vr is in it's infancy it will push technology
    To new heights I have felt immersion personally but
    This is just the beginning trust me you should see
    The reaction of people I've shown it too mostly the
    Words that come out of their mouths is oh WOW
  • VizionVRVizionVR Posts: 3,022
    Wintermute
    My two cents:
    A lot of the hype comes not from what we currently have to work with, but from the potential of VR. It's the stuff we don't yet have that keeps a lot of us excited about VR. There are current games and apps that are overhyped (I wont name names), but VR, by itself, has been a dream for decades.
    Not a Rift fanboi. Not a Vive fanboi. I'm a VR fanboi. Get it straight.
  • vrcovervrcover Posts: 209
    Brain Burst
    Its the next medium that will replace TV so of course it is overhyped. Just with the invention of cars it will take a few years until the industry has found their baseline. Just look at AntVR or 3D Head... lots of people want to ride the hype wave.
  • ChristiaanChristiaan Posts: 386
    Art3mis
    A major moment for me, was spending the better part of an hour lapping Spa in the Ferrari in Assetto Corsa. I stopped the car and removed my wireless surround headphones with the intention of placing the on the passenger seat of the car. That would have landed them on the wood floor.

    What, I believe the OP needs, is hardware that is a good bit better. Once we can sustain presence, it will convince more folks. It really doesn't need to rival that of the eye in terms of resolution, but we must be convinced we are seeing "through" the screen into a world. Oculus WILL figure out what our visual system(s) require if they haven't already. They have the brainpower on-board to do it.
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