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HTC Vive Reviews Thread

Shadowmask72Shadowmask72 Posts: 4,072 Valuable Player
edited April 2016 in General

Here's a thread for HTC Vive reviews (please post any you find) as the official launch is hours away.

Note: If you're not interested in the Vive on the Oculus forums then don't click the topic or read it.

Cramgaming.com



Destructoid

"VR is here, and I have been sold as a believer. While the Oculus is a very strong VR headset, the Vive feels like it's in a league of its own comparatively. The big sticking issue is how the market reacts to the price long term, and if development of new games maintains a consistent pace."

Kotaku

While the Vive’s best moments are some of the coolest I’ve experienced in video games, I can’t recommend purchasing it right now. You’d be spending $800 on something that’s going to be much better after months’ worth of software (and maybe even hardware) revisions, and there currently aren’t enough great games to justify the investment.

The Vive really is something you should see for yourself, but if you want to try it, go to a store that’s demoing it, or make friends with somebody who already ordered one. I’m excited about what the future holds for the Vive, but the future’s not here yet. 


The Verge 8/10


    GOOD STUFF
  • Lots of innovative motion control-based games and experiences
  • Emphasizes motion control and body movement
  • Rich, customizable user interface
  • Solid construction
  • BAD STUFF
  • Heavy and ungainly
  • User experience can be glitchy and confusing
  • Many games still feel unfinished
  • Highest total cost for a VR headset


POLYGON 8/10

So yes, the Vive asks a lot from anyone buying the platform, but it gives just as much back, if not more so. Everyone has the same reaction after a demo, in our experience: They remark on how complicated it seems and how little they’d want to set one up in their own home, and then they get wide-eyed and want to tell you all about how amazed they are by the experience. Valve’s challenge is to get the second part of that reaction to overrule the first, and the company will have an uphill battle on its hands, but it’s off to a very promising start.

GAMESPOT

Before you take the plunge with Vive, you have to prepare yourself accordingly. Unlike Rift, Vive comes with strict spatial requirements if you plan to utilize its hardware's full potential. It's not the easiest suite of hardware to set up, nor is it as refined as Rift, but Vive delivers the most advanced VR experience to date, a luxury that comes at a cost and with compromises. Where Rift feel's like a VR headset built for mainstream consumption, Vive caters to the hardcore crowd that will stop at nothing to get the best VR experience. Over time, Oculus can presumably catch up when it releases its Touch controllers and sells individual sensors to expand Rift's interactivity and motion-tracking capabilities. But for people who can't wait, who are willing to go the extra mile right now, Vive is the only way to experience today's most advanced VR technology from the comfort of home.

ENGADGET 

The Vive is no doubt the geekiest thing I have in my home right now -- and that's saying something. It's an impressive effort by HTC, which has had a rough few years in mobile, and Valve. It's oh-so-close to being the Holy Grail of VR experiences. It's just too bad that ergonomics get in the way of truly enjoying it.

At the same time, I'm sure there's a market for the Vive, even in its current incarnation. Hardware geeks are known for sacrificing their bodies for the glory of technology, and I'm sure they won't have a problem with a few aches and pains for glorious, immersive VR.

Tested - 




IGN Review - 9.3/10 


AMAZING

The Vive's room-scale VR and motion-tracked controllers make it an incredibly powerful system.


Pros:
  • Amazing VR
  • Room scale
  • Motion controllers
  • Comfortable
Cons:
  • Tracking issues



System Specs: RTX 2080 ti , i9 9900K CPU, 16 GB DDR 4 RAM, Win 10 64 Bit OS.
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Comments

  • edmgedmg Posts: 1,158
    Wintermute
    edited April 2016
    Note that the Destructoid review says it's actually a review of the same Vive Pre that's been reviewed dozens of times elsewhere. It's not the released consumer version.

    Of course, it also says Vive is much better than Rift because roomscale, then that they don't play roomscale games very much because of the hassle of setting it up to do so...
  • bigmike20vtbigmike20vt Posts: 4,153 Valuable Player
    edited April 2016
    i think it is fair right now to admit room scale is amazing and the vive is a huge advantage there.... on the condition that all these sites come back once touch launches and then re-evaluates. I can only afford 1 HMD and this generation I have chosen to go with the rift.... but ful room fully tracked VR does excite the hell out of me long term and right now the vive is the HMD to offer the best experience of that.
    Fiat Coupe, gone. 350Z gone. Dirty nappies, no sleep & practical transport incoming. Thank goodness for VR :)
  • ZoomieZoomie Posts: 1,777 Valuable Player
    Thank you so much for creating this thread.  I have zero issues with Vive reviews on the site but what I don't want to see is 5 different threads for each review.  Hopefully Cyber can keep things under control by merging similar content.  I'll read Vive reviews (of course) but many of us are still looking to discuss general VR and want to continue the existing threads without having to dig past 3 pages of propaganda.

    I have zero doubts we're about to be flooded with glowing reviews of the Vive.  I also think most of the reviewers will be lazy, and will compare the Rift to the Vive + Wands.  In that light, every single review will choose Vive over Rift because room scale VR makes for better reading and more hits on the site.  It's a brand new experience and HTC has gotten there first.

    For the members of this site who are getting both headsets, and who have generously offered to do a review for us:
    Would you please do some reviews using third party programs like E:D or Project Cars?  We already know interactive controls are enough to completely overshadow any other details between headsets, and unfortunately this is going to taint most of the big-site reviews.  Comparing the Wands to 'nothing' doesn't really tell us much.  I'm fine if you describe how awesome the Vive Wands are, but I will find direct comparisons between similar HMD features much more worthwhile.

    I'd love to hear how useful you find the front camera.  Please tell me which audio setup you prefer and whether FOV or SDE are an issue - and in what applications.  Talk about those dreaded 'god rays'.  Talk about long play-session comfort, eating, ambient noise, light leak, and whatever else you notice between the two.  Talk about how easy it is to clean!  Talk about whether the cord ever becomes an issue, either for length or design.

    Just please don't default to the lazy "Vive is better because room scale".  We know, we get it.  That's why I'm in line to order the Touch.  We'll get more than enough of that from the major review sites.

    Cheers,  

    Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic.
    - Arthur C Clarke
  • "If you have the space for it, for my money, the HTC Vive blow the Oculus out the water as a long term investment."

    I ordered Rift first on day 1 and still have it ordered but ordered the Vive 2-3 weeks ago when the 30 Rift launch games were released and I compared it to the "tech demos" of the vive.  Vive will be the keeper.  Every device has it's role, video game consoles are great for local social gaming with friends, PC for hi-fidelity games, and now VR.  Rift is simply games with a new perspective.  Vive is a new gaming experience.  I can't understand why anyone who has the minimal space wouldn't go with the Vive.  Is it the $200 price difference?  Who cares since you'll be paying on the back end for the Touch and still end up with a fragmented user base.   Saw a developer interview where they sat down with Valve and said the one thing they wanted was for Valve to ship a "complete" system.  Not a single add on peripheral in the history of gaming has been a success...and while Touch for Rift feels different as the controls can probably be patched in it still won't ever reach 100%.   

    Oculus got me interested in VR as it did for a lot of people on here I'll bet.  I wish they did better, just don't understand how they dropped the ball.  With Facebook's money and backing how did they let a company who invested into VR after they did beat them to the punch with motion tracked controllers?
  • WestaneWestane Posts: 31
    Brain Burst
    I very much want the Vive, I mean, I have it preordered, but I mean I very much want the Vive "features". I simply don't have the space for proper room scale. For social events I'll be dragging my computer out into the dining room as that's literally the only open 10'x10' patch of floor in my house! For the most part, the Vive will be a secondary HMD (Read: My wife's HMD) used for sitting/standing experiences with hand tracking...

    For me the Rift wins, only because I can't realistically support room scale. When the kids move out I'll be turning their room into a holodeck...

    That said I can't wait for Touch controllers.
  • edmgedmg Posts: 1,158
    Wintermute
    Vive is a new gaming experience.  I can't understand why anyone who has the minimal space wouldn't go with the Vive.
    Probably because it's not a new gaming experience that we're very interested in. I may have a chance to play roomscale games for a few months after my Vive arrives, as it looks like I'll have to remove the bed from the computer room (aka spare bedroom) to fit the Omni in there, but I can't imagine I'll want to bother with such constrained movement once I have the Omni.

    As I said above, even the Destructoid review that talked about how great roomscale games are compared to Rift games was written by someone who apparently didn't think they were actually great enough to be worth moving their PC to somewhere they could play them.

    Does not compute, Will Robinson!
  • V-WalkerV-Walker Posts: 108
    edited April 2016
    Of course, the majority of Vive reviews are going to compare it to rift, that is what customers have done. And of course in most cases the reviews are going to favour Vive over rift because that's what most customers have done. And there a list of very good reasons they (and us) prefer vive over rift, they are all spelled out in that review (and I'm sure Cnet's upcoming review along with Polygon, Endgaget, ars technica, forbes and pretty much any site that has had them both in) will also favour the vive.

    That is what reviews are for, they are meant to tell a consumer who is faced with a choice which is the better choice at this time for the purpose both choices are made to serve.

    We already have a very vocal "Pro rift" poster in this thread laying down some ground rules that we are supposed to follow when reading these reviews, apparently enlightening us as to what is 'fair' not, so can the opposite also be taken notice of, that to be fair to Vive we do not need a hundred posts in this thread telling us any of the following:

    1. The reviewer is "Biased" because "reasons"
    2. The Vive is "only reviewing better because of controls and touch will be out 'soon'"
    3. The Vive is only better if you want to do roomscale

    All of these points and have already been addressed in this first review (pre or final is of no consequence here they are all but the same except final is even more comfy and has bluetooth and better cabling).

    1. The reviewers are not biased, can people finally accept that? Along with us users stating our preference not making us a "fanboy", it just means we like what we see from Vive and don't like what we see from Rift. Your favourite company can't win everything, or evertime, and it's really, really ok to "let go" of that emotional attachment, finally, in the face of undeniable positives for Vive when it comes to actual Virtual Reality (the  area that I'd wager almost 100% of users originally signed up here for including the most ardent "rift only" fan)

    2. No the Vive isn't only reviewing better because it has controls, that touch will address (when? Latest rumour is it could be pushed to 2017 or at least for many on the waiting list - either way it's still an unknown as is their roomscale ability for fully robust tracking - there are already some tracking bugs showing up for rift even with just standing or fast head movements, see r/oculus for details). Vive is reviewing better not just because of controls, but as pointed out in the review, the ability to do seated, standing and roomscale RIGHT NOW. The front cam even for seated is an amazing and super useful thing to have (the review even said this alone makes the Vive the best HMD for seated too!), the comfort myth put to rest, the reviewer wore it for 8 hours, no ring on their face, no discomfort. Vive is super adjustable, nicely balanced and feels light even if it's not technically ligher than Rift. It has better face cushioning, no light leak around the nose, fits great for glasses and has convienience features that place it way above rift for every day use (all of this is written clearly in the review)

    3. No, roomscale is obviously a genuine next level of VR and amazing, why anyone would want to be without that if they have the space and say they are fans of Virtual Reality is beyond me, but nonetheless that is not only why the review is positive. It's the combination of that ability RIGHT NOT along with "Best for seated" and having proper controllers RIGHT NOW. Also, comfort, features, and build quality (strong and robust, easy wipe clean etc)

    As for how useful is the front camera? Well we don't need to live with it for weeks to know exactly how much its needed, even for seated. Anyone who was in a DK2 for a long time such as myself and many of you, know how annoying it was to be totally cut off and having to remove it to find things. In the rift, with glasses, the lack of cameras is even more annoying - reviews have stated that, once you are strapped in and finally get it just right (with glasses) you think "where's my controller" or want a drink etc and... off it comes again. Anybody already should know, if they've tried VR, that a front cam is kind of essential. I was shocked when rift CV1 didn't have one, as far back as crescent bay and DK2 we were talking around the net about how much it could do with a camera. That, and other strange ergonomic flaws are as they are for the purposes of form or design, or weight, but they were very bad decisions from oculus, and they will learn for generation 2. The lack of proper input bundled in is their biggest mistake (I see this written around the net and official reviews a lot), but the lack of all those little extras like Vive has it their overall mistake. That stuff adds up to a great experience in and for VR. Anyone who can deny that is more than biased. way more.

    I know it's hard for anything or anyone that is pro-vive around here to be treated anything approaching "fairly" so I'm not sure why others who don't treat vive and those interested in it fairly are so fast to call out others as being 'unfair' (or disliking their posts for being as objective as possible while stating the clear and obvious positives to the Vive). It's time for that to stop no? You dont own oculus, you don't OWE oculus, they are big boys who can take care of themselves, and they need to work harder, a lot harder, to create a fully compelling VR system that will resonate as well as Vive with both hardcore VR fans and the general public. It's time to stop giving them a free lunch, it's a dis-service to VR to keep covering up for them or turning on positive vive posts/posters like this one.

    If VR is your goal, you have nothing to lose by finally accepting Vive is a much better VR system, for the foreseeable future, and not to have to defend rift and its own plus points, veering into mis-information, to try and blur the differences. The reviews from impartial third parties are what sell one system or another (along with great word of mouth) so before burying infomation on a public forum like has happened a couple of times now with mine and other vive posts, I think it's time to stop, assess where you are coming from (is it pro VR or confirmation bias? is it fair acceptance of how Valve/HTC got so much right and Oculus got a lot wrong or is it just shouting over and chasing away any information or points of view that causes personal, emotional issues in your minds).

    I'll copy and paste this reddit post that summed up the reviews key points, this forum and the dislike system is not a crutch for anyone's inability to handle objective and positive opinions and information on a competing product they haven't invested in. It's still going to get buried I'm sure but please ask yourselves WHY would you do that, as some of the biggest fans of VR on here? Maybe it's time you finally disconnected from brand loyalty, emotional attachment and the small confirmation biases and just let both systems BE, and live or die on their own qualities or flaws?

    And of course we accept many people simply do not have room for roomscale (yet) but there's more to this than just that, also please remember a massive amount of people do have room for roomscale (inc myself)

    See you in VR folks!

    ====

    Key quotes

    Summary

        If you have the space for it, for my money, the HTC Vive blows the Oculus out the water as a long term investment.

    Comfort

        From my time with both headsets, the Vive feels more comfortable, and is better integrated with my existing PC ecosystem.

    Room-scale experience

        You really want a living room, emptied of clutter, to use room scale tech properly.
        Room scale VR is the future of gaming

    Seated Play

     The ability to see your keyboard and mouse via camera feed without taking my headset off, as well as the absense of Oculus weird nose gap, for me made the Vive a considerably better VR platform of choice for seated play.

    Comfort

     I wore it for pretty much eight hours straight with minimal discomfort. The headset itself was lightweight and comfortable enough to wear for long periods of time.

    Build quality

     The general build quality of the headset, alongside the motion controllers, feels incredibly solid. I feel like I could fall flat on my face or punch a wall without risking damaging the Vive.

    Conclusion and comparison to the rift

     While the Oculus is a very strong VR headset, the Vive feels like it's in a league of its own comparatively.


    =====



  • miremire Posts: 11
    edmg said:
    Of course, it also says Vive is much better than Rift because roomscale, then that they don't play roomscale games very much because of the hassle of setting it up to do so...
    Ha, I noticed that too. "I moved my gaming PC from my office to the living room" followed shortly after with "Vive games just fit better into my existing ecosystem" or something like that; then "I haven't really made room scale games a part of my routine because moving the computer sucks". The cognitive dissonance is strong with this one.
  • Mr.CreepyMr.Creepy Posts: 792
    Neo
    @V-Walker I check out /r/oculus Reddit all the time and i haven't seen anything about tracking problems on the other hand i remember Gizmodo writing an article about trying to break the tracking with fast movements and so on and failing to break it. Touch is not scheduled for a 2017 launch but a 2016 H2, i don't care about unconfirmed rumours. Also plenty of people have said they prefer Vive here in a reasonable manner and mostly everyone respect that some people have that opinion. I am sure plenty of reviews will state how close these two offers are and that very little divides them when taking into account that Rift can do roomscale when it gets Touch controllers. 
  • edmg said:
    Vive is a new gaming experience.  I can't understand why anyone who has the minimal space wouldn't go with the Vive.
    Probably because it's not a new gaming experience that we're very interested in. I may have a chance to play roomscale games for a few months after my Vive arrives, as it looks like I'll have to remove the bed from the computer room (aka spare bedroom) to fit the Omni in there, but I can't imagine I'll want to bother with such constrained movement once I have the Omni.

    As I said above, even the Destructoid review that talked about how great roomscale games are compared to Rift games was written by someone who apparently didn't think they were actually great enough to be worth moving their PC to somewhere they could play them.

    Does not compute, Will Robinson!
    But this is what confuses me.  Say you're not interested or not able to do room scale.  The Vive can still do standing (Brookhaven Experiment) and sitting cockpit games just the same.  Difference again is you get the motion controls day one, no fragmentation, and the camera overlay so you can still type and grab stuff in the real world without taking the headset off.  So why not just use the Vive as a sit down device?  The $200 goes toward the 2 motion controllers and the camera, the latter of which can't be added on to the Rift at a later date.  I dunno, I'm not here to push people toward Vive or Rift but after watching videos of both devices my review would have summed it up like this Destructoid review I'm just left scratching my head on why people wouldn't buy the Vive and the only thing I can think of is the price difference, but then I say to myself it can't be...what's $200 extra when you have a $2000 computer to run the thing.
  • V-WalkerV-Walker Posts: 108
    edited April 2016
    Mr.Creepy said:
    @V-Walker I check out /r/oculus Reddit all the time and i haven't seen anything about tracking problems
    Firstly there is already a lot that divides them other than just controls or roomscale (not to mention the scalability or robustness of that roomscale vs rift), there IS the front cam, there IS the comfort for glasses users, there IS the bluetooth comms and there IS the perfect tracking, there is also that slightly better FOV and less Glare. Even if it were just the hmds for sale I'd still go for Vive based on front cam, thicker/comfier face gasket that doesn't leave a horrible ring after 5 minutes, nicer FOV, audio output jack, usb port on HMD (for add ons), that it's plastic and robust/easily cleanable and not cloth and the bluetooth phone comms. And yes I'd pay $200 just for the improvements in the Vive HMD over rift alone, add in roomscale + motion controls? No contest.

    As for rift tracking faults:

    https://www.reddit.com/r/Vive/comments/4d9yic/oculus_rift_tracking_bugs_roundup/

    https://www.reddit.com/r/oculus/comments/4chy9k/my_vr_love_triangle_or_my_cv1_dk2_and_me_day_2_a/

    https://www.reddit.com/r/oculus/comments/4ccwsj/cv1_first_impressions/

    I guess you didn't look too hard! I wonder why.

    "I do notice either dropped frames, bad motion predictions, or slightly discontinuous tracking up to a couple times a minute, depending on what I'm doing. It manifests as my viewpoint jumping (a pretty small distance) instead of rotating or translating smoothly. It's a discontinuous motion. I have no idea which of the 3 it is. For reference I'm running on a GTX 980."

    and another user

    "Tracking seems if I get the camera more than about 4 feet away there's a little bit of 'swimming' if I'm sitting still. I need to experiment a bit more with camera placement and such. It still tracks my motion perfectly, but it doesn't hold me perfectly still as well. I am sure, once we can add a second camera, this will vanish, as the two cameras can average out their solutions."

    And another:

    If I look from left-hand "target" menu, to might right hand "systems" menu, the position tracking takes about 2-3 seconds to "settle" where the new position of my head is. During that time, it overshoots and corrects, bobbing back and forth in an oscillation that goes back and forth about 3 times, with smaller amplitude each time.

    And another:

    "I get some wobbliness. If I sit on my couch, 8 feet away the viewpoint will kind of wobble back and forth about an inch or so. You can barely notice if your moving around but if you sit perfectly still it stands out a lot. It noticed it most today when I played Adr1ft, it made me slightly queasy when trying to read computer screens in the game, so I got up and sat in my swivel chair that's closer to the camera and it was fine."

    And another:

    "Yeah. Sensor pointed at back of the head stutters or little jumps even with slow side to side movement, side of the head does it too but less, rotating from side to back or vice versa gives a pretty decent jump image. That all starts really being noticeable around 5 feet away from the sensor."


    @rat8cheese I agree, the vocal rift supporters can not seriously be using the $200 reason as reason against Vive when it comes with so much extra for that! Roomscale is almost a free bonus at that price point. You'd pay (I would pay) $200 more just to have proper VR controllers. I get very robust, in fact class leading roomscale tracking, controllers, HMD camera and phone-in-VR convenience for that $200 which is way better value than rift.

    Sadly it seems no matter how polite one is, or how reasoned and rational our information is presented, certain types of people can never let go of that emotional tie they have, be it to the brand they favour or to the product they've put hope and money into.

    As long as they are happy with their choice that is all that matters, seriously, but when they start nit-picking Vive reviews trying to negate them, or make claims about a completely unavailable device (touch) is when I start to question what is informed debate or just blind devotion to a cause.






  • ZoomieZoomie Posts: 1,777 Valuable Player

    @V-Walker.  I did not demand or set out rules for reviews.  I asked nicely if someone could give an apples to apples review so it would be more useful to me.  I'm getting tired of your constant ad-hominems.  I look forward to reviews from VizionVR etc. because they're getting both units and haven't shown an overwhelming bias so far.


    Zoomie said: "I have zero doubts we're about to be flooded with glowing reviews of the Vive.  I also think most of the reviewers will be lazy, and will compare the Rift to the Vive + Wands.  In that light, every single review will choose Vive over Rift because room scale VR makes for better reading and more hits on the site.  It's a brand new experience and HTC has gotten there first... 
    We already know interactive controls are enough to completely overshadow any other details between headsets, and unfortunately this is going to taint most of the big-site reviews."

    You claim I'm pro-Rift but no where in my post do I praise the Rift or bash the Vive.  Now read your own post and see who is displaying massive bias.  Pot kettle black.

    My overwhelming fear is that none of these reviews will give an accurate comparison.  They'll be too busy effusively praising room-scale, which is something we already know is awesome. 


    Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic.
    - Arthur C Clarke
  • Mr.CreepyMr.Creepy Posts: 792
    Neo
    edited April 2016
    @V-Walker Why are you disliking my comment? It shouldn't offend anyone, i haven't called anyone a fanboy or said that Rift is better than the Vive. I merely stated that i've not seen anything that validates your claims. Why are you so bothered by the so called "fanboys", why not just link to some reviews as that is what this thread is about. I disliked your comment because you turn this thread into a Vive vs Rift discussion instead of just focusing on Vive. Funny you mention that the dislike system "the dislike system is not a crutch for anyone's inability to handle objective and positive opinions and information on a competing product they haven't invested in" while you have disliked my comments where i simply state that i support Oculus and where i say i prefer the Touch controllers.
  • Hiro_Protag0nistHiro_Protag0nist Posts: 4,978 Valuable Player
    Just been looking for reviews of the Vive on youtube - can't find any - when was it released?  A couple of unboxing vids from the big tech sites but that's it.
  • Mr.CreepyMr.Creepy Posts: 792
    Neo
    edited April 2016
    @V-Walker Posted my previous response before i saw your post with links to reddit. But here we have the problem again, you litteraly insult me by implying that i am purposely leaving out negative information about the rift or ignoring it or what ever you mean with "I guess you didn't look too hard! I wonder why.". I have seen the tested review and Norm did not experience any problems at full cable lenght away from the camera. One of the other examples mentioned is obvisously a bug. Obvisously it shows that there has been some problems but they are not generally caused by the Rift not being able to track, it shows there are some bugs and maybe some interferance from windows etc. Many have not experienced those problems and so far it seems a minority has experienced these things.
  • edmgedmg Posts: 1,158
    Wintermute
    edited April 2016
    andyring said:
    Just been looking for reviews of the Vive on youtube - can't find any - when was it released?  A couple of unboxing vids from the big tech sites but that's it.
    I believe there's an embargo on consumer Vive reviews until tomorrow? Unless maybe some preorders have already arrived. So I'd expect to see a lot in the next few days.
  • bigmike20vtbigmike20vt Posts: 4,153 Valuable Player
    Indeed I totally get why people want like for like comparisons. Saying vive is better because motion controls and full room does not really help given rift is 230 quid cheaper and will get its own motion controls and extra camera to help with full room tracking.
    Oh and as for random dislikes mrcreepy just accept it it seems some people can't handle opposing views. Sad but true. People seem to use it as agree/disagree despite mods saying this is not what it is for.

    Despite pre ordering rift I am considering getting a vive I must admit. 
    PS as for tracking problems.... I can only speak for elite d but a couple of vive users have been commenting on the ED forums that vive has been struggling with seated experiences when the room was configured for full room. This nis a pita to be honest but constellation I expect will have the same issue. Can't see how you can do full room tracking with 2 forward facing cameras so unless touch comes with a 2 camera set up (like say kinect) then that is going to have to have different settings for full room or finger tracked motion control as well.
    Fiat Coupe, gone. 350Z gone. Dirty nappies, no sleep & practical transport incoming. Thank goodness for VR :)
  • nightauditor1981nightauditor1981 Posts: 302
    Nexus 6
    edited April 2016
    edmg said:
    Vive is a new gaming experience.  I can't understand why anyone who has the minimal space wouldn't go with the Vive.
    Probably because it's not a new gaming experience that we're very interested in. I may have a chance to play roomscale games for a few months after my Vive arrives, as it looks like I'll have to remove the bed from the computer room (aka spare bedroom) to fit the Omni in there, but I can't imagine I'll want to bother with such constrained movement once I have the Omni.

    As I said above, even the Destructoid review that talked about how great roomscale games are compared to Rift games was written by someone who apparently didn't think they were actually great enough to be worth moving their PC to somewhere they could play them.

    Does not compute, Will Robinson!
    But this is what confuses me.  Say you're not interested or not able to do room scale.  The Vive can still do standing (Brookhaven Experiment) and sitting cockpit games just the same.  Difference again is you get the motion controls day one, no fragmentation, and the camera overlay so you can still type and grab stuff in the real world without taking the headset off.  So why not just use the Vive as a sit down device?  The $200 goes toward the 2 motion controllers and the camera, the latter of which can't be added on to the Rift at a later date.  I dunno, I'm not here to push people toward Vive or Rift but after watching videos of both devices my review would have summed it up like this Destructoid review I'm just left scratching my head on why people wouldn't buy the Vive and the only thing I can think of is the price difference, but then I say to myself it can't be...what's $200 extra when you have a $2000 computer to run the thing.

    I think it will be time that the vive boys get their own forum. However for the time being it will be cool to see some reviews here.

    It´s already funny to see comments like "rift is JUST a new perspective, while the rift is a whole new thing blabla" though.

    The vive is the same product as the rift with a few advantadges and some disadvantadges. It´s not something completely different than the rift, I do think that some people will be disappointed.

    Suprisingly enough, we will find out that the vive has a slightly larger FOV and therefore a slightly worse SDE/image quality.

    We will find that the chapeone system is awesome and that the "wands" add heaps to immersion.

    We will find that the rift is slightly better when it comes to weight and ergonomics.

    In about 3 to 6 month, when the touch release, the vive will have no advantadges anymore. The only thing that really seperates the vive from the rift is the front facing camera. That is a cool gadget that could be very useful in future applications.

    It is not enough to beat optics and ergonomics though.

    All of this is subjective rambling though. Looking forward to some objective reviews in this thread!
  • TheDynamoTheDynamo Posts: 51
    And in a years time everyone will be peeved because both devices will have double the resolution, be cable free with a higher FOV and better hand controllers. Will buy then :wink: 

  • I think it will be time that the vive boys get their own forum. However for the time being it will be cool to see some reviews here.

    It´s already funny to see comments like "rift is JUST a new perspective, while the rift is a whole new thing blabla" though.

    The vive is the same product as the rift with a few advantadges and some disadvantadges. It´s not something completely different than the rift, I do think that some people will be disappointed.

    Suprisingly enough, we will find out that the vive has a slightly larger FOV and therefore a slightly worse SDE/image quality.

    We will find that the chapeone system is awesome and that the "wands" add heaps to immersion.

    We will find that the rift is slightly better when it comes to weight and ergonomics.

    In about 3 to 6 month, when the touch release, the vive will have no advantadges anymore. The only thing that really seperates the vive from the rift is the front facing camera. That is a cool gadget that could be very useful in future applications.

    It is not enough to beat optics and ergonomics though.

    All of this is subjective rambling though. Looking forward to some objective reviews in this thread!
    Points well taken.  Ergonomics I think will be subjective for each person's head shape/size.  When I said 'perspective' I should have elaborated.  When the 30 games revealed for Rift launch I found almost every game is what we already do now.  Edge of Nowhere (Tomb Raider), Luckey's Tale (Mario), Chronos (Fixed camera classic Res Evil), and some tower defense games where you're looking down in God mode.  I can't overstate how disappointed I was with this bc it was the same old stuff just a "different visual perspective" with the headset.  That's when I began looking at the Vive.  The tech demos Arizona Sunshine, Space Pirate Trainer, etc. while not fleshed out was more along of what I pictured when I thought of VR a few years back.  I think immersion and presence come down to more than graphics like many have said.  I don't care if both headsets have SDE, I tried DK2 last year and didn't care it had SDE bc I liked the technology of VR and feeling immersed.  So then it comes down to tracking and 1:1 motion controllers...those immerse you in the VR world more than SDE takes you out of the world in my opinion.

    And no more advantages when Touch releases?  Too early to say.  That camera aside from convenience has potential.  I'm no developer but I can already picture some mini-uses and augmented reality uses.  Too much unknown with the Touch:  Price?  Tracking vs lighthouse? Release date?  

    Out of curiosity, lets say touch releases for more than $200, would you be okay with that?  Then you have the "complete system" like the Vive but still with no camera.  Let's say it's $50 but room scale is inferior to Vive, would you be okay there?  Of course it could be $50 and superior to Vive given it's releasing later so could be more refined and tech costs could be lowered.  But again, just too many unknowns whereas the Vive you know what you're getting for your money day #1.  

    Yes, I can't wait until the reviews start coming.  Like I said I still have my day 1 pre-order of the Rift.  I don't mind trying out both then deciding for myself and selling the other given how much the these headsets will sell for on Ebay but right now it's looking more like the Vive is the keeper.
  • snappaheadsnappahead Posts: 2,302
    Trinity
    edited April 2016
    Ugh..can we not, people? Does it always have to turn into a lame thing? Can't we be happy for VR finally arriving and be happy for all the people getting consumer VR regardless of which system you get? It's so deflating that there's all this bickering at the same time that we're seeing the birth of a new medium and these two incredible pieces of technology are FINALLY getting into the hands of of the VR community. 
    \
    I remember when it was about VR and how excited we all were.
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  • nightauditor1981nightauditor1981 Posts: 302
    Nexus 6
    I think I would be ready to pay up to 250 dollars for the touch controllers. I would prefer them selling in the 100-150 bucks range, but if they would stick a 250 buck price sticker on it, I´d still buy it.


    Actually the whole motion controller thing is a pretty big factor in all of this for me. I really do prefer the touch design, and people who have tried it seem to like it too. I really do think that they are superior to the vive wands in a lot of ways.

    We´ll see what´s what when they release. In the end snappahead is completely right though. We all should be happy that we can even have this discussion :)
  • StelzerStelzer Posts: 119
    There I so much hate coming from Reddit //vive to //oculus I hoping this will calm down in a couple of months. 
  • snappaheadsnappahead Posts: 2,302
    Trinity
    This forum has some strange bugs. I accidentally put the cursor in the quote it seems to be stuck here for eternity.
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  • snappaheadsnappahead Posts: 2,302
    Trinity
    Atmos73 said:

    I remember when it was about VR and how excited we all were.
    But then Palmer sold out and people never forgave him for it.
    That's on them and I won't go into that, but I think the bigger problems started the moment an alternative was realized. Once HTC/Valve announced the Vive, many people decided that they had to pick a side. I don't understand that mentality and hope I never do. Pick a system and enjoy. Why is it more complicated than that?
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  • miremire Posts: 11
    Stelzer said:
    There I so much hate coming from Reddit //vive to //oculus I hoping this will calm down in a couple of months. 
    Me too. Just enjoy whichever you got, stop trying to make other people feel bad because they chose the other option.
  • AndyW1384AndyW1384 Posts: 307
    Trinity
    snappahead said:

    [snip]

    Once HTC/Valve announced the Vive, many people decided that they had to pick a side. I don't understand that mentality and hope I never do. Pick a system and enjoy. Why is it more complicated than that?
    I think part of it is based on a feeling that (a bit like Betamax and VHS, or Blu-ray and HD-DVD), whichever headset 'wins' will be the one getting support and content - and that's a reasonable assumption to make. There's no guarantee that you will ever be able to buy a VR headset, safe in the knowledge that practically all VR games will be playable on it.

    Headsets may eventually move towards a unified standard, but there'll always be the push to include some great new feature (a stereo front camera for proper AR blending, a haptic glove instead of a wand, or eye focus tracking), and for developers to write games/utilities/apps that make full use of a non-standard feature.

    If you buy a headset and it gets crowded out, you've invested your money and enthusiasm in a dead-end. If the headset you've bought becomes the basis for the de facto standard, then you can be assured that even if you upgrade it will be to a system that's largely familiar, just better.

    So people champion the system they favour, both because they want it to have long-term support and plenty of content, but also because they've invested their enthusiasm and perhaps just a teensy bit of their self-esteem in their ability to make sound decisions.

    I, of course, am no exception ;)
  • miremire Posts: 11
    edited April 2016

    Atmos73 said:

    I remember when it was about VR and how excited we all were.
    But then Palmer sold out and people never forgave him for it.
    Nah, the free Rift made up for that. It's at least a 300% return on my Kickstarter investment ($300 turned into $900 of hardware), and I can bump it to 500% for the near future if I decide to cash out and sell my headset on ebay.

    The realities of bringing this thing to marker were always going to entail some level of "selling out", unless they wanted to be completely dependent on Steam, which would be a terrible business strategy no matter how much you love Valve. Even if they'd taken on private investors instead of selling to a bigger company, they still would have ended up with a proprietary storefront.

    Now that the shipping problems have been addressed, people need to settle down and let this all play out.

  • SlimBoyFatSlimBoyFat Posts: 129
    Art3mis
    edited April 2016
    mire said:
    Stelzer said:
    There I so much hate coming from Reddit //vive to //oculus I hoping this will calm down in a couple of months. 
    Me too. Just enjoy whichever you got, stop trying to make other people feel bad because they chose the other option.
    +1 it all comes from people's own insecurities about their own choice if you ask me. Luckily I'm in a position to buy both (all three if you include PSVR) and hence I don't need to take sides just as I don't take part in the console war as I'm lucky enough (or stupid enough!) to be able to buy them all. It's the scourge of the modern age, the pathetic fanboy/hater culture that seems to fill the whole of the interwebs. Enjoy what you've got and don't worry too much about that what you haven't got.
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  • snappaheadsnappahead Posts: 2,302
    Trinity
    Atmos73 said:
    Atmos73 said:

    I remember when it was about VR and how excited we all were.
    But then Palmer sold out and people never forgave him for it.
    Pick a system and enjoy. Why is it more complicated than that?
    That's exactly what I did and I will enjoy it if it turns up tomorrow. It gets complicated when people don't read the spec sheet and think $599 for Rift is better than $799 for Vive when you get a lot more for your money with the Vive. Or Vive is only for room-scale and Rift is only for seated experiences. The list goes on. If we argue the points we get a better understanding of where the others coming from.

    But its mainly for the Banter. ;)

    Roll on tomorrow.
    That's their choice though. It shouldn't matter to you why people are choosing one over the other. If you're happy with your choice, does it really matter why other people made a different one? We should want both companies to succeed since having one "win" usually means that their competition is gone and that's how monopolies are born. Let's do our best to encourage and support every serious contender in this new market. Even if you're the type that needs to pick a side, it's too soon to pick winners and draw lines in the sand. 
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