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Oh! The irony!

Kalec84Kalec84 Posts: 568
Trinity
I'm just seeing a lot of ppl talking about the Touch, and many of them (us) saying, touch is what we need, touch is indespensable, the rift is nothing without the touch... and i think the same.
But since i love to self-criticise...
Who remember when we were saying: "Roome tracking is just a gimmic", "hand controllers are useles since games are better with controller"
Etc... etc... etc...
I laugh if i think back to that... jenuinly  :D i mean i think is normal to look for reasons to not "want" what you can't have (yet) right?
And since i was one of those who said those thing, i just want to see... who else dares to admit he was wrong? :)

Comments

  • edmgedmg Posts: 1,156
    Wintermute
    edited October 2016
    Kalec84 said:
    Who remember when we were saying: "Roome tracking is just a gimmic", "hand controllers are useles since games are better with controller"
    Roomscale is a gimmick. And who said all games are better with Xbox controllers?

    I have a Rift and a Vive. I haven't touched the Vive in weeks, because there's so little content worth turning it on for. Doesn't mean I don't want motion controllers for the Rift for the things they are better for.
  • Comic_Book_GuyComic_Book_Guy Posts: 1,195
    3Jane
    "we"? Who is this "we"? I think most of us wanted the better headset and were willing to miss motion controls for a few months for it. Whoever said motion controls or "room scale" is just a gimmick is hopelessly dense.
  • kzintzikzintzi Posts: 1,068
    Wintermute
    as someone who didn't say that touch wasn't needed I can feel the warm glow of superiority in my ranting :tongue:


    I am glad it's finally out - showed my brother (finally) the other day and he did the whole "OMG this is awesome, I keep wanting to reach out and touch stuff" thing.. told him touch was coming in a couple of months and he's told his wife he wants one now :smile:

    Though you are more than slightly incoherent, I agree with you Madam,
    a plum is a terrible thing to do to a nostril.
  • ZandilZandil Posts: 975
    3Jane
    Can't remember anyone saying a game pad is better than hand tracked controllers ? 

    Just that not every game requires Touch some will benefit more form a game pad and others from Touch, just as some games in VR are better with a Stick or wheel over Touch or a game pad.
  • ZenbaneZenbane Posts: 14,735 Valuable Player
    edited October 2016
    Kalec84 said:
    I'm just seeing a lot of ppl talking about the Touch, and many of them (us) saying, touch is what we need, touch is indespensable, the rift is nothing without the touch... and i think the same.
    But since i love to self-criticise...
    Who remember when we were saying: "Roome tracking is just a gimmic", "hand controllers are useles since games are better with controller"
    Etc... etc... etc...
    I laugh if i think back to that... jenuinly  :D i mean i think is normal to look for reasons to not "want" what you can't have (yet) right?
    And since i was one of those who said those thing, i just want to see... who else dares to admit he was wrong? :)

    Can you quote at least half of what you're getting all excited about? I have seen people excited about Touch; I haven't seen anyone pull a flip-flop viewpoint on the gimmick that is room-scale. I think you're happy dance thread is highly premature.
    Are you a fan of the Myst games? Check out my Mod at http://www.mystrock.com/
    Catch me on Twitter: twitter.com/zenbane
  • brantlewbrantlew Posts: 540 Oculus Staff
    Ha.  I can remember some people criticizing Oculus's development of positional tracking on the DK2 saying that it in-effect was a gimmicky feature and the only thing that we really needed was an improved resolution on the DK1.
  • ZandilZandil Posts: 975
    3Jane
    brantlew said:
    Ha.  I can remember some people criticizing Oculus's development of positional tracking on the DK2 saying that it in-effect was a gimmicky feature and the only thing that we really needed was an improved resolution on the DK1.
    Glad you didn't listen to them. 
  • OpticKingOpticKing Posts: 1,185
    Wintermute
    As daddoofly said, most of us probably were content to get the better HMD and wait for the better motion input controllers than settle for the vive. I'm sure the sim only people could care less and might have said that, but give them a chance at sword fighting a skeleton and they may change their tune.
  • kzintzikzintzi Posts: 1,068
    Wintermute
    OpticKing said:
    As daddoofly said, most of us probably were content to get the better HMD and wait for the better motion input controllers than settle for the vive. I'm sure the sim only people could care less and might have said that, but give them a chance at sword fighting a skeleton and they may change their tune.
    yeah.. I was a sim person, and definitely said that I wasn't bothered by waiting. but am very stoked it's coming.. just got my order in. v excited
    Though you are more than slightly incoherent, I agree with you Madam,
    a plum is a terrible thing to do to a nostril.
  • Comic_Book_GuyComic_Book_Guy Posts: 1,195
    3Jane
    Ya check out Wilsons Heart, Start Trek, Killing Floor, Superhot...the list goes on too. Can't wait!
  • ZenbaneZenbane Posts: 14,735 Valuable Player
    Perhaps what the OP is referring to is back when those epic HMD wars took place on this forum, people like myself made the following argument:

    We do not need room-scale nor hand-controllers in order to experience full VR immersion.

    In contrast, the endless sea of pro-Vive trolls argued that without room-scale and hand-controllers, there is no true sense of VR immersion.

    Now that Touch is coming out, and more discussion about Rift room-scale is taking place, I am certainly excited. However, my excitement is not an indication of irony nor contradiction, because at no point do I believe that all this time I have been lacking in true VR immersion. I do not believe that hand-controllers and room-scale will finally help me achieve that immersion.

    I believe full immersion has been achieved by the Rift (in a way that is superior to the Vive); and the only thing adding hand-controllers with room-scale will achieve (for me) is an extra layer of VR interaction.

    Interaction = the body
    Immersion = the mind

    That was the original debate, @Kalec84 but nice try buddy! :D
    Are you a fan of the Myst games? Check out my Mod at http://www.mystrock.com/
    Catch me on Twitter: twitter.com/zenbane
  • OpticKingOpticKing Posts: 1,185
    Wintermute
    edited October 2016
    Yeah, I think maybe my earlier post implied I thought the controllers were needed for "true vr" I've been having a great time playing literally dozens of games which are great fun. On top of the rifts own games, I've had a blast going back and replaying many MANY old favorites with the psp/gamecube/wii/n64 emulators. I actually wish 2eyeguy would do the same in ps2/ps1 emulators, it's awesome being in the fan universe you had as a young'n, so KH: BirthBySleep/FF: Crisis Core/LoZ: Twilight Princess/Metroid: Prime 1-2/Super Mario Galaxy 1-2/ and many more are imo 4 star vr games. The gamepad has done great as a input device so far, but I'm definitely looking forward to the unspoken/bridge crew/robo recall/superhot/many others with the touch.
  • Kalec84Kalec84 Posts: 568
    Trinity
    Zenbane said:
    Perhaps what the OP is referring to is back when those epic HMD wars took place on this forum, people like myself made the following argument:

    We do not need room-scale nor hand-controllers in order to experience full VR immersion.

    etc...

    Interaction = the body
    Immersion = the mind

    That was the original debate, @Kalec84 but nice try buddy! :D
    Well, i don't intend the "irony" as a way to laugh "at" people, but i just find funny that my opinion (and of others i think) on hand controller and room scale has changed as the option to have it has became aviable for me too.
    It's more of an "auto-critic" than anithing else :)
  • ZenbaneZenbane Posts: 14,735 Valuable Player
    edited October 2016
    Well except for the part that the opinions on hand controllers and room scale haven't really changed, but sure, it's a hoot! lol
    Are you a fan of the Myst games? Check out my Mod at http://www.mystrock.com/
    Catch me on Twitter: twitter.com/zenbane
  • ZenbaneZenbane Posts: 14,735 Valuable Player
    OpticKing said:
    Yeah, I think maybe my earlier post implied I thought the controllers were needed for "true vr"
    VR itself will only get more true/realistic/immersive/interactive over time. The only instances where nuance becomes so acclaimed is... when forum wars happen and people need to distinguish between what the brain is doing vs the body lol

    Thus: "true VR" vs "true VR immersion"

    The OP is referring to the initial release period of the Rift, when this place was full of Vivers mocking the notion that an HMD would be released without hand controllers and room scale. I covered that in my previous post, but the main point is that even back then, when Rifters were defending their choice of HMD... we all knew that Touch would someday be released. There was never any condemnation of hand controllers nor room-scale as a whole. Just the notion that either are needed to achieve true immersion.

    Are you a fan of the Myst games? Check out my Mod at http://www.mystrock.com/
    Catch me on Twitter: twitter.com/zenbane
  • CrashFuCrashFu Posts: 1,756 Valuable Player
    I'm excited for Touch, and I think that motion controls in general have a lot of potential in terms of utility, in that they can essentially be thought of as 3D Computer Mice.

    Regarding Motion-control based games, specifically, my opinion hasn't changed at all. I still think basing games or apps around motion controls is more of a novelty than a "must-have", and in a lot of cases it may even hurt my immersion because when I reach out to grab something and don't feel a physical object there, it's just going to remind me that the world I'm trying and failing to touch isn't real.

    Oh, I'm fully confident that I will be enjoying the heck out of the Touch line-up, and I'm interested to see what future developers will do with this input method.  But I'm a realist, and I can tell the difference between Novelty and Substance.  Eventually Novelty wears thin, and any new game relying on the same Novelty is going to have a harder time impressing jaded people... but if the underlying game is really solid, has some good substance to it, then people will enjoy using whatever input method it's built around.
    It's hard being the voice of reason when you're surrounded by unreasonable people.
  • leo1954auleo1954au Posts: 375
    Nexus 6
    Would have been nice if you had the option of buying extra censors along with the touch
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