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Forbes writer says vr expensive gimic

2

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  • TwoHedWlfTwoHedWlf Posts: 2,234 Valuable Player
    Cyril said:
    Mobile phones started out as an expensive gimmick that you'd lug around in it's dedicated suitcase.
    And the end result is they took good phones and good computers and combined them to make a crap phone and a crap computer.
  • elbofforelboffor Posts: 2,572 Valuable Player
    Which the hell reads anything from forbes anyway?
    This is my forum signature.
    There are many others like it, but this is mine.
  • bigmike20vtbigmike20vt Posts: 4,106 Valuable Player
    edited October 2016
    inovator said:
    I dont know where these idiots come from. I once read a review about a movie that was SyFy. The critic gave it a horrible review and the reasons given for why the movie was so bad made me want to see the movie and that movie was fantastic and overall got great reviews. That critic was obviously a Sci-Fi hater and should not have been reviewing that genere.
    The forbes writer said vr was an expensive gimic and not a very good gimic (a stab in the heart) because many of the games could be enjoyed on a regular Tv. He personally said he got a headache after 20 or 30 minutes not nauseous. He gave some of the other usual criticism that we all have heard in the past.
    I think one of the major points missed buy these VR haters is not whether or not you can enjoy a game or any experience on TV but actually being inside of the game. There are people that play 2d video games who get headaches as well, so this guy is saying because it's bad for him it's bad for everybody. If vr was totally flawless this guy wouldnt like it. Hes intitled to his opinion but does everyone a disservice reviewing vr when he is a vr hater.
    Forbes.... says it all really.  hate their site, and generally disagree with their articles.
    Fiat Coupe, gone. 350Z gone. Dirty nappies, no sleep & practical transport incoming. Thank goodness for VR :)
  • bigmike20vtbigmike20vt Posts: 4,106 Valuable Player
    brantlew said:
    I am firmly undecided about the future of VR.  We could be in the 80's PC era where so much investment and experimentation was being poured in.  Or we could be in the 50's during the excitement of air and space travel.

    It will take another decade to figure out if this is another Internet or our generation's "flying car".  LOL
    lol.. I take it you did not say that in your interview at oculus.

    "Mr Brantlew what do you think about the future of VR?"  

    "Dunno, it may be ok but it may be a bit of a gimmick"....... Do i get the job?.. :D
    Fiat Coupe, gone. 350Z gone. Dirty nappies, no sleep & practical transport incoming. Thank goodness for VR :)
  • RonsonPLRonsonPL Posts: 1,115
    Trinity
    edited October 2016
    Oh man.. you guys.
    It's a fanboy's way of thinking.
    Someone doesn't like it? He's a hater!

    No. He's most likely not.
    There will be less and less of haters, if they base their opinion on the results of using it, instead of just theory like true VR haters do.

    VR is great for some, and crap for others. Deal with it.
    I've seen many people who have my respect, saying they don't believe VR will be a revolution which was so hyped in recent years. I disagree with some of what they say, with the opinion that it will vanish after few years just like motion controllers etc. But I surely agree with logic arguments.
    And from popular youtubers in my local YT part (Polish), I've seen guy called NRGeek saying he tried it and expect VR to fail. The thing is, he's as old as me, and he is a core gamer. He said the resolution is crap, he said the FOV should be bigger, and he said the game offer is way below what it should be to make a core gamer interested. Some racing site reviewed VR and said it's not a viable replacement for the monitor yet, because the display is so much blurried that they cannot see some breaking points on the track, and with that I can agree, I've played a few racing games on the Rift and it's true. It's not a big deal for casual driving through the track, but I can understand that some people treat racing competition very, very seriously and they won't leave their 1440p 144Hz monitors for VR if they cannot get the same lap times.

    There is also Jim, who I really like and respect, cause he proved more than once that he knows gaming and he can use logic to support his arguments. Please disregard the style of his show if you dislike it, he just looks and acts like it, he's not your "some stupid nerd from the youtube". Actually he's a professional gaming journalist who recently decided to work on his own, and left Destructoid.


    Let's face it. Not everything about VR is great and rosy.
    It will get better at some point in the future, resolution and FOV will increase soon(-ish), game offer will start to appeal to broad range of core gamers (it will take 3-6 years but will happen), console VR quality will increase (PSeye and 6-year old Move controllers aren't the best and it's limiting the gameplay mechanics), and at some point motion sickness will stop being a psychologica wall, when VR arcades become popular (big spaces to walk, treadmills, actuator-powered seats for flying etc.). VR is here to stay, it won't fail, but right now it can be both great and crap, depending on who you ask, let people have their opinion even if you think that opinion is wrong.
    Not an Oculus hater, but not a fan anymore.
    Still lots of respect for the team-Carmack, Abrash.
    Oculus is driven by big corporation principles now. That brings painful effects already, more to come in the future. This is not the Oculus I once cheered for.
  • inovatorinovator Posts: 2,174 Valuable Player
    Ronson when nintendo 8 bit system came out you can say it was crap and some people said that. But a good journalist will take other opinions into consideration. Like how other people take to it. 8 bit came a long way. Journalist said it was bad based on his feelings. Example he said he gets a headache after 20 to 30 minutes. With monitor he said no headache mostly. Meaning he gets headaches playing regular monitor games probably more than he admits. It funny but I get eye strain after an hour of regular gaming but absolutely none.during hours of vr. He has the right to express how it is with him but does a diservice to make the public believe that is the average experience. I have a friend that cant play monitor games because it gets him nauseous. If he wrote an article and said gaming makes u sick.... That would be misleading.
  • brantlewbrantlew Posts: 540 Oculus Staff
    edited October 2016
    brantlew said:
    I am firmly undecided about the future of VR.  We could be in the 80's PC era where so much investment and experimentation was being poured in.  Or we could be in the 50's during the excitement of air and space travel.

    It will take another decade to figure out if this is another Internet or our generation's "flying car".  LOL
    lol.. I take it you did not say that in your interview at oculus.

    "Mr Brantlew what do you think about the future of VR?"  

    "Dunno, it may be ok but it may be a bit of a gimmick"....... Do i get the job?.. :D
    Nah, who cares what I predict about the future of VR.  All that matters is that I am personally passionate about VR which means that I work hard at my job.  I just try to maintain perspective. 

    One last sobering thought about past predictions.  If you go back to the 60's and look at sci-fi, one popular cliche was the video phone.  2001 Space Odyssey, James Bond, etc.. - everybody in the high-tech "future" used video phones because - of course, why wouldn't they?  It's a perfectly reasonable extrapolation and it seems obviously superior than voice phones or telegrams.

    Surprise!  Everybody has a video phone today if they want it (Skype, Facetime, Google, etc.), but how many people actually use it.  Instead everybody texts !!  If you went back and told people in the 50's that nobody liked to use their video phones and instead chose to essentially use instant telegrams they would have thought you were crazy.  lol

    There's a lesson there about predictions - even seemingly obvious and reasonable ones. ;)

  • ZenbaneZenbane Posts: 14,759 Valuable Player
    RonsonPL said:
    Oh man.. you guys.
    It's a fanboy's way of thinking.
    Someone doesn't like it? He's a hater!

    Anyone with a firm understanding of the English language, a moderate degree of reading comprehension, and a functional brain... can easily see the hate that was presented by the article (which you did not read). Or maybe you're just a Forbes fanboy, and responding like one by trying to dismiss other peoples opinions just because they infringe upon your own faboism.


    RonsonPL said:
    let people have their opinion even if you think that opinion is wrong.

    Take your own advice. This thread is about people having their own opinion about a VR article. You are coming in here trying to condem people for having an opinion, and then ending your boring write-up by saying people should be allowed to have an opinion? lol - I knew that you weren't good at reading other peoples words, but I at least thought you could read your own. Way to go.
    Are you a fan of the Myst games? Check out my Mod at http://www.mystrock.com/
    Catch me on Twitter: twitter.com/zenbane
  • nosys70nosys70 Posts: 466
    Art3mis
    edited October 2016
    if you look at what VR is bringing for the lambda citizen, it is like 3D. Nothing.
    A bit of wow and that's all.
    Does it cook your pasta faster, does it make your gazoline cheaper, does it make you job more fun , Does it allow something new ?

    No. for instance it just grab a lot of  money and time from you.

    Unless you can embed it in your real life (that is why smartphones succeeded) , it is just another gimmick.
  • inovatorinovator Posts: 2,174 Valuable Player
    Nosy picker your an example of a vr hater. Why are u bothering with this forum
  • nosys70nosys70 Posts: 466
    Art3mis
    edited October 2016
    and with this remark  you appear as a fanboy, but i admit at least you got your place on that forum
    it is absolutely astonishing to see there is no place between fanboys and haters.
    Is it a church here ?

  • inovatorinovator Posts: 2,174 Valuable Player
    Do you own a vr headset u actively use?
  • PhaserlightPhaserlight Posts: 163
    Art3mis
    TwoHedWlf said:
    Cyril said:
    Mobile phones started out as an expensive gimmick that you'd lug around in it's dedicated suitcase.
    And the end result is they took good phones and good computers and combined them to make a crap phone and a crap computer.
    You see a crap computer, I see an emergent set of design challenges ripe with innovation.
  • CrashFuCrashFu Posts: 1,756 Valuable Player
    @nosys70 - I didn't think smart-phones were necessary until after I got one for myself.

    And after getting my Rift, I don't have much interest in down-grading back to using a flat, tiny traditional monitor for gaming or media-watching.  Not that non-VR games even interest me that much any more.

    VR isn't a gimmick (Not for the Oculus Rift, at least. :wink: ).  The Oculus Rift and Oculus Platform were designed to be the new medium of experiencing and interacting with games, media and utilities, and in the near future, the preferred medium for online social interaction as well.
    It's hard being the voice of reason when you're surrounded by unreasonable people.
  • nosys70nosys70 Posts: 466
    Art3mis
    edited October 2016
    smartphones are not necessary, and mostly they are useless.
    Probably 90% of the activity you get with your smartphone is making phone call and receiving message.
    all the rest (social networking, games, silly utility, watching cat's video on youtube, taking selfies) is probably as much improductive as VR.
    The big thing with the smartphone is it connects you to internet almost anywhere, anytime and link useless feature with others you cannot live without.
    The difference is you get the smartphone with you, almost all the time, you can download tons of apps for free
    and everyday, there is something new you can do with the smartphone (payment for exemple will hugely increase smartphone penetration)
    So much of the free time you get (on the toilet seat for example) can be filled by some activity with a smartphone.
    most of these activities are not new (reading news, gaming, chatting), you were already doing it before, you just do it now another way, faster, easier.

    VR (unless you see it as another apps running on smartphone) does not has any of these caracteristic.

    it is harldly mobile (too bulky)
    it does not allow/replace anything usefull in real life
    it cuts you from the world , not connecting to it.

    There si a long way to go before VR can find any place in the society.
    For instance it is just an nice game add-on, and sony well understood that.

  • inovatorinovator Posts: 2,174 Valuable Player
    Vr already has a place. That is enjoying games and experiences in a way rhat is second to none. Sony has already sold 100s of thousands of headsets. Industry experts say they will probably. Sell 1.3 million by years end.
  • PhaserlightPhaserlight Posts: 163
    Art3mis
    nosys70 said:
    smartphones are not necessary, and mostly they are useless.
    Probably 90% of the activity you get with your smartphone is making phone call and receiving message.
    That's you, not me...

    Smart phone capabilities have expanded far past making phone calls and texting.  Not only do I use my smart phone to explore virtual reality, I wouldn't be able to conduct business the way I do on a day-to-day basis without it.

    Social media is also far from "improductive"; it's almost expected that a serious business have a social media front these days: I use it to update business hours, specials, as a customer-facing communication channel, and to promote word-of-mouth advertising.

    On a personal level, social media is useful to the extent that it allows one to have more contact with distant relatives; I "feel" that I have a much larger social presence than I would otherwise.  Facebook's "Check In" feature recently came in handy as a way to let others know I was safe after Hurricane Matthew.  The "Live" feature is also very fascinating, as it allows one to view the world through another's smartphone (at their behest, obviously) at any given time.
  • ZenbaneZenbane Posts: 14,759 Valuable Player
    edited October 2016
    nosys70 said:
    smartphones are not necessary, and mostly they are useless.
    Probably 90% of the activity you get with your smartphone is making phone call and receiving message.

    lol - you still engage in phone conversations? Out of curiosity, how old are you?

    My smart phone is used way more than anything you described. Especially in regards to work. I use it as a hotspot so that I can VPN in to my workplace from anywhere, and I do this often since I move around a lot as a software developer. I also use Google Authenticator for two-factor authentication. Based on your post, you must still rely on standard PIN/Password for authentication, both easily compromised in this age.

    All you did was describe how you use smart phones, which in my opinion shows that you would be happy with an old flip phone.
    Are you a fan of the Myst games? Check out my Mod at http://www.mystrock.com/
    Catch me on Twitter: twitter.com/zenbane
  • bigmike20vtbigmike20vt Posts: 4,106 Valuable Player
    edited October 2016
    its a segue but i gotta admit, as far as phones go, my smart phone is CRAP as a phone!  my old nokia 3310 was way better... a battery which pushed 2 weeks and a way better signal.

    my phone is pretty much an email/texting device which i use for toilet gaming.... and the odd phone call. :)

    Dom Joly (a fairly meh! comedian) used to do a sketch taking the piss out of people with their phones... and bugger me if it has not come true with people using their 7 inch phablets to phone people.. maybe its my age but it really does seem nuts when i see someone talking on something that barely fits in your pocket.

    I know i need to set up 2 stage security... one day maybe.
    Fiat Coupe, gone. 350Z gone. Dirty nappies, no sleep & practical transport incoming. Thank goodness for VR :)
  • ZenbaneZenbane Posts: 14,759 Valuable Player
    Two-Stage security (aka multi-factor authentication) is an absolute must-have today. Our phone numbers are as unique as our Social Security Numbers in the new Information Age. Not only is WiFi data easily sniffed out, but Bluetooth is so much easier to hack (Bluejacking).

    As it stands today, everyone's privacy/security has been compromised. Moving forward, the best we can do is increase the requirements to prove that... we are who we say we are. Hence the Chips on all bank and credit cards, and the need for tools like Google Authenticator on smart phones.

    Are you a fan of the Myst games? Check out my Mod at http://www.mystrock.com/
    Catch me on Twitter: twitter.com/zenbane
  • agenttoffagenttoff Posts: 325
    Trinity
    edited October 2016
    nosys70 said:
    smartphones are not necessary, and mostly they are useless.
    Probably 90% of the activity you get with your smartphone is making phone call and receiving message.
    all the rest (social networking, games, silly utility, watching cat's video on youtube, taking selfies) is probably as much improductive as VR.
    The big thing with the smartphone is it connects you to internet almost anywhere, anytime and link useless feature with others you cannot live without.
    The difference is you get the smartphone with you, almost all the time, you can download tons of apps for free
    and everyday, there is something new you can do with the smartphone (payment for exemple will hugely increase smartphone penetration)
    So much of the free time you get (on the toilet seat for example) can be filled by some activity with a smartphone.
    most of these activities are not new (reading news, gaming, chatting), you were already doing it before, you just do it now another way, faster, easier.

    VR (unless you see it as another apps running on smartphone) does not has any of these caracteristic.

    it is harldly mobile (too bulky)
    it does not allow/replace anything usefull in real life
    it cuts you from the world , not connecting to it.

    There si a long way to go before VR can find any place in the society.
    For instance it is just an nice game add-on, and sony well understood that.

    Uh, what's this now?  Smartphones are incredibly useful.  I use mine constantly for navigation.  I'd have much more stress driving around Los Angeles and the Inland Empire without Google Maps.  Used to have to know all the places I was going to beforehand and print out directions.  And yes, people went on just fine with their lives before this, but with much more stress in such a busy urban area.   If I'm shopping I can quickly research products.  For example, my sister picks things up for me a lot of times, and if there's a choice between items she'll send me a pic and ask which I want, showing me the labels and such (esp useful for food products).  Just yesterday she went to buy me some medicine, said they didn't have what I wanted, and sent me a pic of the shelf of similar products asking which I'd be okay with.  
    I have health problems / in severe pain 24/7 and we were house hunting, and I couldn't go out to see them, so her and her friend live chatted with me walking around the whole place so I could see it.

    As for VR, who said it has to be necessary?  It's as necessary as a TV or radio.  I actually agree with a lot of the points in the article.  It is uncomfortable, it is hot, but it's also pretty damn sweet.  It's not where I'd like it to be just yet, but that doesn't mean it's a gimmick.  It has to start somewhere.  
  • CrashFuCrashFu Posts: 1,756 Valuable Player
    People still use their smart-phones as PHONES?  :astonished:

    Lol.  Yeah, no, smart-phones are great because they're portable wi-fi enabled computers, with texting and access to web browsers and media etc..  And even though mine cost like $20 and is as slow as a dial-up modem, I still often reflect on how amazing it is just to have that kind of utility available to me for so cheap.

    But a phone is severely limited in its hardware power.  It also has a screen that's only a few inches big. Also, the audio is going to suck.

    So yeah, you can watch or listen to media ANYWHERE with a smart-phone, but it's going to be the worst-quality experience possible. And you can play games on a smart-phone, but most of them are going to be like "free flash game on the internet" quality, especially if you don't have A REALLY EXPENSIVE phone.


    It's hard being the voice of reason when you're surrounded by unreasonable people.
  • GreymanGreyman Posts: 1,315
    Wintermute
    Smart phones are one of the best pieces of measuring equipment to assess the level of ignorance attained by their users.  

    For example, if said phone is being used whilst being served in a shop, leading to absolutely no attention whatsoever being paid to the person doing the serving, that would register pretty high.  

    For a full scale deflection however, a reading that would suggest absolute rank stupidity, that would be achieved by using it whilst driving a car and doing what must be the single most complicated pastime that most humans will ever experience.  

    I see a worrying number of peeps that register a maximum reading.  
  • ZenbaneZenbane Posts: 14,759 Valuable Player
    I use my phone while driving all the time. And proud of it!
    Are you a fan of the Myst games? Check out my Mod at http://www.mystrock.com/
    Catch me on Twitter: twitter.com/zenbane
  • danknugzdanknugz Posts: 1,988
    3Jane
    Badass
    A: Because it messes up the order in which people normally read text.
    Q: Why is top-posting such a bad thing?
    A: Top-posting.
    Q: What is the most annoying thing on forums?
  • GreymanGreyman Posts: 1,315
    Wintermute
    Zenbane said:
    I use my phone while driving all the time. And proud of it!
    If that's not hands-free, if you cause an accident and particularly if you cause a serious injury to yourself or someone else as a result, your pride, misplaced as it is, will disappear immediately.

    i know, from everyday observation, that there are lots of people that think they are skilled enough to drive safely and use a handset at the same time.  Well the evidence of the accidents, serious injuries and deaths would appear to indicate otherwise.

    Please think on, as there won't be an app to help you get over it, that's for sure.


  • bigmike20vtbigmike20vt Posts: 4,106 Valuable Player
    edited October 2016
    Zenbane said:
    I use my phone while driving all the time. And proud of it!
    if you get spotted doing it in the UK you should expect getting nicked! (unless you have hands free). the amount of accidents caused by doing this is quite scary and I would say your statement is almost on a par with me if i was to say "I drive pissed and am proud of it"!.  It was a good day when this was made illegal imo, sadly loads still do it.
    (hypocrisy warning - I break speed limits and would also get nicked if caught... but i am  NOT proud of it).

    driving whilst texting/talking on your phone needs to be stamped out imo.  At least when i edge over the speed limit my concentration IS 100% on the road.

    True story, 3 months ago i was standing with my 6 month old in his pram waiting at a pelican crossing, white van man chatting on the phone smacked the kerb, almost mounted it, inches from my push  chair.... fair to say had he stopped i would have been shoving his phone somewhere VERY uncomfortable for him.

    (sorry, rant over you hit a nerve!)
    Fiat Coupe, gone. 350Z gone. Dirty nappies, no sleep & practical transport incoming. Thank goodness for VR :)
  • WarblokeWarbloke Posts: 931
    3Jane
    edited October 2016

    I must admit, my phone gets used to play clash of clans more than I use it as an actual phone if Im honest :/

    and yeh, totally understand the 'ban the phones while driving views' of those who had near misses or have lost someone as a result.  I used to have a brother... until some old guy killed him with his car :(
    This wasn't mobile phone related, but was certainly a lack of concentration issue and he was only charged with 'driving without due care and attention'.  I guess anything that takes concentration away from the road isn't a good thing though. Anyway... this was many, MANY years ago.



    "You can't believe everything you read on the Internet " :- Abraham Lincoln 
  • Shadowmask72Shadowmask72 Posts: 3,972 Valuable Player
    Sounds like a sad cross you have to bear Warbloke the law is pretty awful. Recent research shows that even when using a hands-free phone in a car (I assume this is what Zenbane is refering to or I at least hope so) your reaction times are reduced quite considerably. As for older drivers it does strengthen the use of driver-less vehicles once they can perfect the tech.

    Anyhow, this thread man. The Forbes writer has an agenda and he is right on one part that it is expensive for mass adoption even the PSVR, but a gimmick. I don't believe it is as it's gone way beyond the "gimmick" stage already. 

    From a gamer perspective I  believe the consensus is once tried VR certainly enhances the play experience way more than a 2D screen or 3D screen ever could and is perhaps a preferred method of play with some games.


    System Specs: RTX 2080 ti , i9 9900K CPU, 16 GB DDR 4 RAM, Win 10 64 Bit OS.
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