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Luckey - Roomscale VR a joke! Keith Apicary Victormaxx Stunt VR HMD, Epyx911 (New SLAM tracking)

AtariVR
Protege
https://www.reddit.com/r/oculus/comments/6gg3r8/displaylink_to_show_xr_wigig_wireless_vr_system/diq5...;

Padawn - Room scale VR is not going to be a significant force in the short term or long term.  LOL!  What an ignorant clown!  Oh Padawan, you silly sandals sycophant.  (that brown nosing Lonsdale in your recent twitter, so funny)

So Epyx911 was just talking about augmented pixels. 
https://youtu.be/ztdDyR7XEUs?t=565

I saw that guy at augmented world expo.  He uses technology that apple acquired a company to incorporate, k3wl new slam tracking for full roomscale.  Don't you ever get tired tasting sandal palmer?  Putting your foot in your mouth constantly?  He said even Oculus had new hmd's going with SLAM.  Are you that far out of the loop now Palmer?  You didn't even know the roomscale slam tech going on at your own company?  What was it Kevin Williams said, you were pushed out of the drivers seat, to the back of the bus and then finally out the windows to die as roadkill on the pavement? 

Well the comments in epyx911 video talk about the coolest VR forcefeedback roomscale technology that Sega released, shit is RADICAL!  Shows how much fun you can have in ROOMSCALE VR! 🙂

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A0YzkTFmq1k
21 REPLIES 21

Mr_Creepy
Rising Star

Zoomie said:

The largest problem with room scale is that every house and available play-space is different.  In order to let players with wildly various spaces play, developers have had to implement teleport or stick based movement.  If you can teleport or stick-move there is no reason to have more than a small play area with enough room to turn with outstretched hands.  

For a true room scale game, you would need to stipulate a minimum size and force the player to walk everywhere.  The play area would have to map 1:1 with the virtual world.  No developer will do this because it shrinks the already small market to those with sufficient space, or means the game takes place in a closet when the player has a large potential play area.

The best case scenario is with clever titles like Hover Junkers, where your ship size could be your actual play area while the 'ship' moves around the world through conventional locomotion methods.  Sadly this is the exception and not the rule.


It's still roomscale even if there is free locomotion, I don't want to be confined to a small space in the game, I want to move around physically as much as can. If roomscale meant only roomscale that would be very limiting, you'd either have everything cramped, or too big for most players. So a roomscale experience needs artificial locomotion or teleport to not limit the experience or the userbase, but that doesn't take away from the roomscale element. Was roomscale ever defined as being limited to your real space? That would be news to me.

AtariVR
Protege

snowdog said:

 so the vast majority of developers (including my good self, 


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t8UFJ3obm-Q&t=15m27s

Here is a video you may wish to watch on legal contracts incase injunctions go through, don't leave your ass open.

Zoomie
Expert Trustee
I know what you're saying Mr.Creepy, but at the same time my own experience with natural locomotion typically results with me getting too close to a boundary.  The Tron walls of the Guardian system break immersion in a jarring fashion, and some games even pause the game to force you to recenter.  I bought a 3rd sensor because <Turn to face front sensors> in Robo Recall was driving me insane and broke immersion.

For a small virtual space like the Oculus Demo it's absolutely fine.  Everyone to whom I have shown that demo walked tentatively around the trailer, afraid they'd run into a real wall.  Still, I saw them relax and start to have fun.  That's fantastic for a small fixed location.

The difference is when you have a large open virtual world.  You can't get anywhere with real-world locomotion so you'll default to teleport or stick.  After a while you stop taking those steps entirely and use teleport for even one or two foot distances.  Watch how someone uses teleport in The Lab and you'll probably see exactly what I'm on about.  Even those one or two steps put you off center in your play area.  Either you have to constantly track where you are in real world, or you'll very quickly run into the edge of your area and lose immersion.
Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic. - Arthur C Clarke

Mr_Creepy
Rising Star

Zoomie said:

The difference is when you have a large open virtual world.  You can't get anywhere with real-world locomotion so you'll default to teleport or stick.  After a while you stop taking those steps entirely and use teleport for even one or two foot distances.  Watch how someone uses teleport in The Lab and you'll probably see exactly what I'm on about.  Even those one or two steps put you off center in your play area.  Either you have to constantly track where you are in real world, or you'll very quickly run into the edge of your area and lose immersion.


Your right, but where that space comes into play is when you are in a situation where your better off moving physically, this can be quickly taking cover, peeking around a corner, going prone, etc.

I don't have a lot of space, I have enough to move around and while I have to be aware of my real surroundings (this doesn't ruin immersion for me) I know that I have a certain space around me to maneuver. Once I know I'm in the middle, I know I can lunge forward a bit which opens up for some nice maneuvers in games where it makes sense. F.ex. when VFC comes out, I want to do spinning backfists (unfamilar term if your not an MMA fan, but I guess the concept is obvious) and that means I need space to do it without being too confined or nervous about hitting stuff, so that's where I really enjoy have space to move. Also in a fighting game moving physically around is more natural and makes sense. For a shooter I would mainly stay in the middle and use the space in the few instances where it's usefull.

When I play I mainly use artificial locomotion, but in certain situations my space is being put to full use. My point is that Roomscale is very nice in certain circumstances, despite not being a good way to traverse the game world.

Zoomie
Expert Trustee
I think the compromise is artificial locomotion for open world, with dynamic changes in height or orientation handled at a local level.

In other words you'll use teleport or stick to translate, but you can use body positioning and movement to allow the user to fine tune position or orientation of the avatar.  Best of both worlds?

If I tried a spinning back fist I'd need to buy a new TV.  And a new hand.  And a new Touch controller.
Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic. - Arthur C Clarke

Mr_Creepy
Rising Star
Yes, best of both worlds, as long as you don't limit movement it's roomscale and if there is also locomotion/teleport it doesn't limit the game, and allows anyone to play as long as you have space to stand and move arms. Add  artificial turning and now even 180 degree users can play.

That's really all roomscale is to me and to Steam games, the ability to move around freely. Then there are all the variables in different games, some games are going to need more space, some wont need any, but in general most games would do fine with being scalable from 180 standing all the way to roomscale. Many does allow all options or at least 360 standing and roomscale.

I sure do hope I'll never do a spinning backfist on the wall or anything else, something is going to break for sure.

zboson
Superstar
Tracking is one of Oculus's biggest failures. I was at a high performance computing show recently and I saw four Vive's at the expo being used for research and not a single Oculus. When I asked a few researchers why they used the Vive they said because of tracking and free movement.

Incidentally, I will be participating in a research proposal in VR again soon which will be using the Vive along with lots of other VR hardware which I don't won't to go into here. Fingers crossed that the proposal gets accepted and then I will be working with VR again later this year.

vannagirl
Consultant
Yes ive not had too many issues mine is more disconnect only

but i imagine if we do see a cv2 it will have updated tracking
Look, man. I only need to know one thing: where they are. 

Anonymous
Not applicable
I got my Rift in January, added Touch with the 2nd sensor in Feb and must say I have never had any tracking issues or disconnect issues. I guess I have been pretty darn lucky in that regard. I did add the Innatek card first though before installing the Rift. Run both my sensors and HMD through it, and it has been flawless for me. 

Of course after typing this, I am reaching to my desk and knocking on wood lol.

bigmike20vt
Visionary
How many of the people with tracking ans disconnect issues have extension cables? I know i do and all my problems go away when i do not use them. Sadly i have to use them for my play space
Fiat Coupe, gone. 350Z gone. Dirty nappies, no sleep & practical transport incoming. Thank goodness for VR 🙂