New to the forums? Click here to read the "How To" Guide.

Developer? Click here to go to the Developer Forums.

Regrets of a midgame adopter

vicvicvic135vicvicvic135 Posts: 7
NerveGear
edited July 2017 in General
Last night, I was surprised to see that the Oculus+ touch dropped from 600 USD to 400 USD. I got the Oculus from Best Buy less than 4 weeks ago and felt pretty happy about being an early adopter. At this moment, I feel regretful that I didn't wait just a while longer. Best Buy has a 15 day return policy and the Oculus support group said that they were unable to help me since I purchased from another retailer.

I do wish our community expands but this situation is making it hard for me to make a case to recommend this product to my friends. With underdeveloped games, a technology with potential for improvement, and constant price drops, I feel as if it would be wise for anybody to wait a couple years before buying an Oculus (or similar VR hardware).

Does anybody feel the same?

Edit July 12: After some discussion on this thread, it seems like I should be classified as a "midgame" adopter.

Comments

  • SharpfishSharpfish Posts: 1,303
    Neo
    edited July 2017
    I have no lament at being an early adopter, at least of VIVE because I sold it within a short space of time and made some excellent profit on it. If you didn't sell rift in a short time while they were low stock, that means you loved it and used it a lot. Hence you got your money's worth.. just like with a CPU or GPU that get reduced/replaced by better stuff each year. 

    BTW I don't class you as an early adopter anyway, you bought it 4 weeks ago? Christ some of us have pumped thousands into VR for the past 4/5 years or more, and you already got your rift+touch for less than it was for many at launch.

    Don't let sour grapes get the better of you, if you don't recommend it to your friends it means your purchase at the higher price is even LESS worthy cos less players = less online fun and less software being made.

    I can only assume this spate of complaining about tech reducing in price is coming mainly from millennials who've never had a hard day in their life? 

    p.s if you 'wait a couple of years' nothing good will come of it because by that time gen 2 will come out and be just as pricey as the launch stuff, sure CV1 will be dirt cheap by then but nobody will want it? How about you stop crying and start playing? sheesh!

    edit - you have mixed messages going on in your post hence my additional words, OK yes in general I'd advise all but the  VR hungry to wait for GEN 2. Absolutely, because rift/vive/psvr are NOT quite there yet to cover all the bases. However you are NOT one of those because you have bought it already and your post sounds more like you are annoyed cos you could have gotten it cheaper if you'd waited 4 weeks (understandable but you must find self resolve and tell yourself you bought it at that price because you wanted it/thought it was worth it then). 

    Finally if you really do feel it's not worth it, or your time, etc do what I did with my vive and psvr (sell them on ebay fast!). DK2 I didn't care cos I knew I was getting into very early/janky tech and it was very cheap. Vive was expensive, esp compared to what you paid for rift if you bought in the past 4 weeks, and believe me you got a lot more for your cash with rift at 600 than vive at 800.
    EX DK2, EX VIVE, EX PSVR, Currently RIFT CV1 | VR developer
    Poster of the week who never got a T-Shirt ;( dayum they looked tasty!
  • SadGamerDadSadGamerDad Posts: 327
    Trinity

    I'm torn by your post, on one hand, I can see why you're salty since you just paid 200 more less than a month ago. You say you're an early adopter, so shouldn't you expect to pay the early adopter tax knowing that prices will drop (not if). I'm also torn that you won't recommend it when the price of $400 right now is a perfect time to get more people into VR to grow the community which is a good thing. To me I just perceive this as your way to feel like you're getting back at "Oculus/The Man" by choosing to do this.  My advice is to embrace the VR community and spread the word to others to get into a new Rift therefore that cheaper price will be there for others come 2018 if not sooner.


  • MoeCappMoeCapp Posts: 115
    Art3mis
    I started on DK2 and have been enjoying VR for years, but just in the last few months have felt that enough software was getting there to justify it for the non-enthusiast, and now with the Rift price drop I feel I could actually recommend it to somebody who didn't already know what they were getting into.

    But still, second generation hardware is probably going to be vastly improved for multiple reasons, and the longer one waits to get started, the more content will be ready. I don't think anyone need be in a huge hurry to jump on the VR train, unless they already know exactly why they want it right now.
  • vicvicvic135vicvicvic135 Posts: 7
    NerveGear
    Well of course I cant categorize myself as the same "early" adopters that purchased this years ago. I still consider this quite early as there aren't many non indie games on this and the technology is quite immature. I'm only a casual gamer so I've only put a few hours into the Oculus in the past month. In that case, I believe that it would be best for my friends and I to wait for gen 2, where we would pay a price similar to what it is now but have a better hardware.
    I'm also not understanding how you could sell this for more as soon as I got it. A used item would never go for as much as the new one especially since they won't get the bundled games.
  • ZenbaneZenbane Posts: 14,890 Valuable Player
    @vicvicvic135 - The Oculus Rift was released in May 2016, and you bought yours June 2017?

    I think we need to have a talk about what the word "early" means. 'Cause you were definitely latelatelate365
    Are you a fan of the Myst games? Check out my Mod at http://www.mystrock.com/
    Catch me on Twitter: twitter.com/zenbane
  • vicvicvic135vicvicvic135 Posts: 7
    NerveGear
    Zenbane said:
    @vicvicvic135 - The Oculus Rift was released in May 2016, and you bought yours June 2017?

    I think we need to have a talk about what the word "early" means. 'Cause you were definitely latelatelate365
    It's true, perhaps I shouldn't call myself "early" but I consider purchasing it now as relatively early. I think VR gaming technology is barely consumer ready with the lack of games and inconveniences of the hardware (such as wires and a clunky headset).
  • flexy123flexy123 Posts: 792
    3Jane
    edited July 2017
    >>
    hard for me to make a case to recommend this product to my friends.
    >>

    Let me read this again. Because my eyes seem to play jokes on me.
    You are saying you won't recommend the Rift...because of the price drop? This is why you don't want to recommend the Rift? Is this correct?

    It is clear to me that you didn't "dive" deep into VR yet, clear from you mentioning the alleged lack of games or "underdeveloped games". Except this isn't the case any more...and I have reason to believe you haven't even seen a fraction what is out today for VR (not just games) - or maybe you're just looking at the wrong spots, like in the Steam indy section or something. I don't think I need to write a list of "well developed" AAA-grade titles that are available now, there is plenty of this here in the forum or on reddit where people recommend games.

    While your points with "wires and a clunky headset" are "sort of" valid, so they're not entirely. It's like me saying PC gaming is **** because I can't take my monitor off the desk or something, or VR is **** because the cable is not long enough, or it's not wireless, or my space is limited and I might knock over my monitor...etc..etc...basically a number of more-or-less far-fetched reasons that you seem to use because you really *want* to dislike the Rift/VR for whatever reason. If this is the case, maybe it's really better you sell it since you can't or don't want to see the positive aspects but only the negatives.

    PS. there will ALWAYS be "potential for improvement". Even with a hypothetical VR headset 3 gens ahead there will be something else around the corner which will improve things. There will always be something better, newer. You shouldn't go "into VR" and then look only at "the potential" , even if doing it of course is totally legit. (I do this all the time too :) But there is not just "potential", there is things you can do *right now* as well. Say, for meeting people in VR I could go to AltSpace or Vrchat..I can do that NOW and have fun with the experience...regardless whether the experience in, say, 5 years or so will be much more improved.
  • ZenbaneZenbane Posts: 14,890 Valuable Player
    edited July 2017
    Zenbane said:
    @vicvicvic135 - The Oculus Rift was released in May 2016, and you bought yours June 2017?

    I think we need to have a talk about what the word "early" means. 'Cause you were definitely latelatelate365
    It's true, perhaps I shouldn't call myself "early" but I consider purchasing it now as relatively early. I think VR gaming technology is barely consumer ready with the lack of games and inconveniences of the hardware (such as wires and a clunky headset).
    The first car, the first airplane, the invention of electricity...

    Current Gen 1 HMD's are the birth of something new. Whatever you just said discounts that in favor of trying to topic-shift.

    I see zero lack of games and zero inconveniences. What have you tried in VR specifically? Better yet, what do you actually own? I have well over 30 VR Titles between Oculus Home and Steam. The only thing I seem to be lacking is time to enjoy it all.
    Are you a fan of the Myst games? Check out my Mod at http://www.mystrock.com/
    Catch me on Twitter: twitter.com/zenbane
  • vicvicvic135vicvicvic135 Posts: 7
    NerveGear
    I acknowledge the points you're all making. Everything will improve and get cheaper. But such rapid price drop means that it will get even cheaper in the near future or a better version will come out soon. I recall the Oculus Rift falling in price just a few months earlier as well. For example, I could buy a PS4 without expecting a huge price drop or the PS5 coming out in the next few months.
    I know there are a lot of games for the Oculus but they usually feels quite glitchy. Most of them are Indie games as well. As a follow up to my previous example, the PS4 has way more quality and triple A games available. 

    Perhaps you are all right though, I may be having some sour grapes just because I purchased the Oculus Rift a month ago only to see the price drop drastically immediately. In any case, I am still unsure whether such a platform was the right one for a casual gamer such as I.
  • ZenbaneZenbane Posts: 14,890 Valuable Player
    edited July 2017
    I know there are a lot of games for the Oculus but they usually feels quite glitchy.
    Such as...?? :p You still aren't giving examples of any first-hand experience you have.

    vicvicvic135 said:
    Most of them are Indie games as well.
    So what?

    I have nothing against Indie games, and I can list quite a few VR titles that are not glitchy (I've played many to completion). By contrast, there are literally thousands of games for standard PC and Console that have glitches and bugs.

    https://www.google.com/#q=famous+video+game+glitches

    Things will continue to improve, as you say. But I see nothing wrong with the current generation of VR HMD's. My experience over the past year has been fantastic; the fact that we will only get better over time is inspiring.
    Are you a fan of the Myst games? Check out my Mod at http://www.mystrock.com/
    Catch me on Twitter: twitter.com/zenbane
  • ZenbaneZenbane Posts: 14,890 Valuable Player
    edited July 2017

    Also,

     the PS4 has way more quality and triple A games available.
    The PS4 is the 4th generation in its class; and the Rift/Vive are 1st Gen. You aren't comparing apples to apples. This is also knowledge you have up front: CV1 vs PS4 (4 > 1)

    If you want more Triple A games then it is important to note that Triple A titles have an average development time of 3-5 years.

    So why would someone buy a First Year platform if they only want experiences that result from 3-5 years of effort? It doesn't really add up.

    Skyrim, Fallout 4, and Resident Evil 7 fall in the 3-5 year category. VR is being added after-the-fact. Then there's Doom 3 which is getting VR support... but development for that game began as far back as 2000; that's a 17 year development time span.

    Indie developers have done an amazing job to help give early adopters enjoyable experiences while we wait for the 3-5 year development time to pass. Games like Albino Lullaby were among my first VR experiences, and incredibly memorable. The lengthy free-fall was outstanding, and the developer was nice enough to send me a Save Game file so that I can load it up at that exact moment any time I choose.

    Being an early adopter has felt quite grand imo.
    Are you a fan of the Myst games? Check out my Mod at http://www.mystrock.com/
    Catch me on Twitter: twitter.com/zenbane
  • vicvicvic135vicvicvic135 Posts: 7
    NerveGear
    edited July 2017
    I agree with your points. I like indie games too but just not as the sole basis of my experience. My favorite game is Robo Recall but the campaign only lasted 1-2 hours. I wanted a game with swords so I tried Raw Data and Sairento. Raw data crashes and Sairento gameplay doesn't feel smooth. In each of these games, I'd get stuck every few missions. I know GTA V or Skyrim would have glitches too but not to the point where I'm having to restart the game every few missions.

    I understand that these developers don't have the bandwidth to make them comparable to something like Fallout 4 but that makes it a reason that a casual gamer would rather get a PS4. I understand that a larger game would take years to make and that just makes it another good reason to wait until they come out before buying an Oculus.

    And I know it's not fair to compare Oculus to PS4 because they are generations apart. But my point is that they both exist now and a casual gamer has more reason to lean towards the PS4 since it's cheaper and has way more games.

    I did feel a sense of pride in being an "early" or "mid-game" adopter (classify me however you want) at first but I'm just feeling disappointed that I purchased it when it was set up for immediate price drops and improvements as compared to an entertainment system I could have purchased cheaper. Perhaps our sentiments are different just because I'm more of a "mid-game" adopter or a casual gamer as compared to the population that I am speaking with here.
  • ZenbaneZenbane Posts: 14,890 Valuable Player
    edited July 2017
    @vicvicvic135 - I can definitely see the how a consumer/gamer would want to choose a more stable platform over a first gen VR Device. Especially if that person isn't that impressed with the immersion provided by this breakthrough VR technology.

    For me, the first time I flew my ship through space in Eve Valkyrie... I just knew that my life was changed lol. The immersion is everything to me.

    Yet I have also given Rift demo's to many family, friends, and co-workers over the past year. And I do notice that for every person who becomes "amazed," there is someone else who kinda shrugs and asks, "what is the practical application of this?"

    The VR experience is fairly unique to each individual. So I suppose I can't expect everyone to share my outlook or perspective since the Rift clearly had a more powerful impression on me as an immersive device.

    Although I also do not feel the need to "choose." I have multiple consoles and multiple PC's (including a Macbook and iPad). I have an Xbox, PlayStation, multiple Nintendo consoles, and sometimes I play mobile games. Point being: if someone wants to enjoy a quality Triple A title then they just have to get the hardware/software to do that. If they also want to enjoy VR, then get stuff to do that as well. I see no reason to sacrifice one over the other.

    Price drops are a different matter. Some people feel disheartened when it impacts them negatively. While I can see the point, all I can think of are the overall benefits. Especially in the case of an emerging technology that is birthing a whole new industry.

    Are you a fan of the Myst games? Check out my Mod at http://www.mystrock.com/
    Catch me on Twitter: twitter.com/zenbane
  • vicvicvic135vicvicvic135 Posts: 7
    NerveGear
    @Zenbane I am also personally amazed by the Oculus. The friends I have shown have been amazed as well. We're just now skeptical about whether it's worth the $400 (and recently $600) when it's destined for more rapid price drops/improvements and that there are more developed systems out there.
    Of course I don't think there's anything wrong to a price drop now, since I wish for the community to be expanded as well. However, from the standpoint of someone who purchased this just a few weeks ago, I really wish I waited at least a few weeks (if not years) because I would have saved $200. This thought should extend to those that are about to purchase if a bit of patience would result in huge savings/better hardware in the near future.

    However, that's just my opinion. I suppose that's just the viewpoint of a casual gamer.
  • Techy111Techy111 Posts: 6,735 Volunteer Moderator
    Absolutely right mate, so I want it now or shall I wait for the price to drop is a dilemma most of us face at times. Price drops and sales are a part of life. If it happens to me then i approach the company and say hey look? If I'm lucky and get a discount then bonus !!!! If not then I still have the bit of kit I wanted ;)
    A PC with lots of gadgets inside and a thing to see in 3D that you put on your head.

  • Shadowmask72Shadowmask72 Posts: 4,025 Valuable Player
    edited July 2017
    Having experienced what the OP has gone through myself with several items I can certainly sympathize with him and anyone else who purchased recently and then a sale occurs. It's not a nice feeling. However, one shouldn't lose sight of why you made the purchase in the first place and that you were comfortable paying the listed price at the time. 

    I purchased a Samsung TV earlier this year for just under £1000 (it was already in a sale), just over two weeks later the seller lowered the price even more by £100. So I called them to ask if they would kindly refund the difference on the off-chance they might play ball with the angle, it was already in a sale, and so another sale so soon was unexpected.  Sadly I was just outside of their 14 day policy and out of luck.  I moved on because my enjoyment of the TV has been off the scale. I  had no regrets buying it. A rebate would have been nice but ultimately I got what I paid for.  UK Samsung KS7000 49" in case anyone is interested.

    Interestingly, I purchased a Nintendo 3DS when it first released and then 3 months later Nintendo lowered the price. They felt obliged to reward early adopters and offered  a select number of free games as a kind gesture. So it's at the discretion of the company how they respond to customers who might  feel a little disappointed when a sale occurs after a purchase.  However, as a consumer we agree to pay the price for a product when we cough up the cash. Anything that happens after the sale isn't within our control so we have to suck it up or try and get a rebate on the difference.  Amazon and several other major retailers have opened a can of worms where customers are able to return items with no quibbles for a full refund which has meant people abusing this to send back items and then buy them again at  new SALE prices.  It's because of this that some customers now feel a little entitled. However, not all sellers have this policy and most are under no obligation to do anything if the item isn't faulty and if they do refund or offer credit, it's a good will gesture at best.

    TL:DR - Just get on and enjoy your Rift and don't look back.





    System Specs: RTX 2080 ti , i9 9900K CPU, 16 GB DDR 4 RAM, Win 10 64 Bit OS.
  • bigmike20vtbigmike20vt Posts: 4,136 Valuable Player
    edited July 2017
    unless OP is suggesting that nothing ever gets heavy discounts then, sometimes getting stung is a fact of life.
    win some, lose some!.
    (i DO sympathise, i would feel a bit dissapointed if it happened to me (point of fact it did with touch discounts).

    but as i said, win some, lose some.  i bought a moto G5 yesterday, £40 off due to amazon daily deal.

    but what are oculus to do?  if they announced 2 weeks ago, in 2 weeks time we are having a summer discount, then NO ONE would buy a hmd for 2 weeks, and even then, those who bought the day before would be salty because "why did they not announce it 3 weeks in advance).

    the only alternative is to NEVER have big sales and to have a set formula which means prices are set and only get reduced slowly by a few quid a week.

    which over all i think we would lose on - i have 100s of games bought in humble bundles etc for essentially pennies, i bought my 70 inch gaming telly for a £2000 discount! :open_mouth:

    imo take it on the chin, accept that next time you may be more lucky and enjoy your new hmd.  anyone who bought more recently, make use of distance selling regs or the amazon price promise

    (but however you spin it, not telling other users about this discount sounds like sour grapes to me and you are just hurting the VR industry, and potentially yourself in the long run)
    Fiat Coupe, gone. 350Z gone. Dirty nappies, no sleep & practical transport incoming. Thank goodness for VR :)
  • nalex66nalex66 Posts: 5,218 Volunteer Moderator
    edited July 2017
    @Zenbane I am also personally amazed by the Oculus. The friends I have shown have been amazed as well. We're just now skeptical about whether it's worth the $400 (and recently $600) when it's destined for more rapid price drops/improvements and that there are more developed systems out there.
    There is always the possibility of price drops in the future, with anything that you buy. The only question to ask yourself is: Do I want this at the price offered today? If you do, buy it. If it gets cheaper in the future (and it always will), you haven't lost anything, you got what you paid for at a price you agreed to.

    You can wait forever for things to get cheaper, but you'll end up only ever buying old stuff that has been made obsolete by new stuff coming out at higher prices.

    $400 is pretty damn cheap for what you're getting with the Rift+Touch bundle. It's not likely to get any cheaper (in 6 weeks it may go back up to $600), and I'd argue that there are NO "more developed systems" out there. Vive is playing catch-up on features that the Rift has, and costs over twice the price. If you want home VR, this is the best deal that has ever existed. At $600, it was the best deal that had ever existed, too.
    i7 5820K @ 4.25GHz | EVGA GTX 1080 SC | Gigabyte GA-X99-UD4 | Corsair DDR4 3000 32GB | Corsair HX 750W
    SSDs: Intel 660p M.2 2TB, Samsung 860 Evo 1TB, 850 Evo 1TB, 840 Evo 1TB | Startech 4 controller PCIe USB 3.0
  • andysonofbobandysonofbob Posts: 242
    Nexus 6
    edited July 2017
    I bought my CV1 and Touch controllers a couple of months ago.  On the salty level I am about 4 out of 10 about this.  That's because I am human.

    That said I am excited and have advertised the price drop on the forums I frequent because I want more VR gamers!  More VR units sold == better for me.

    My only concern is that if the price was to drop even further, you might get issues with perceived value for money!  i.e. "What's wrong with the CV1 if it is less than half the price of the Vive?"

    Would outsiders to VR's default opinion be that the Vive is the superiour product?
  • MorgrumMorgrum Posts: 1,672 Valuable Player
    Pretty sure most folks think with their pocketbook and I for one would never spend twice the cost on a system.
    WAAAGH!
  • bigmike20vtbigmike20vt Posts: 4,136 Valuable Player

    Would outsiders to VR's default opinion be that the Vive is the superiour product?
    some would but that is ok.  I LOVED that the fiat badge on my old car meant i could pick it up nice and cheap......

    it people want to be snobbish on a product and perceive it as inferior because it cost less let them. the proof in the pudding is in the eating. 

    and i say this for everything, i am not even going to get into a discussion about if the vive is better than the rift on a purely objective basis... hell it might even be true.... but is it 100% better in terms of todays costs?  i think that is a hard argument to win!.
    Fiat Coupe, gone. 350Z gone. Dirty nappies, no sleep & practical transport incoming. Thank goodness for VR :)
  • inovatorinovator Posts: 2,228 Valuable Player
    I paid 599 plus 200 with touch controls. I am not jelous of the price drops I'm happy as a pig rolling in mud. It's good for vr, the more people that help increase the base. I have waited all my life for vr and I'm happy with my rift. You have people that bought earlier kits and were happy with even lower specs because it's all about immersion. Play doom 3 vr and you will get a triple a game. It wasn't built for vr but it looks and works great with the touch controls. Vanishing realms on steam omg. Games zenbane mentioned are good. If you love vr you will get what I'm saying. If you don't love it you will say it's better in hd on a flat screen. People that say I can just as easily play that game on a flat screen don't get it. If vr went down the tubes (it won't) and I had bill Gates money I would hire a team to keep it going for me.
     
Sign In or Register to comment.