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Why Steam VR?

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  • snowdogsnowdog Posts: 7,160 Valuable Player
    I'm quite happy to buy some games on Steam but if I have a choice, even if it's more expensive, I'll always opt for the Oculus Store over Steam.

    Why? Because Valve have been doing FUCK ALL with the money I've been giving them all these years. Left 4 Dead is dead (lol) and has been for donkey's years, no Half Life 2 VR available on launch day, no Half Life 3. Whilst The Lab is an excellent introduction to VR it's just a collection of mini-games.

    Vive owners didn't give a fuck about the principle of the 'walled garden', they had the raging hump because you could have counted the top quality launch day titles on one hand. They had hardly any decent games to play compared to the riches that Rift owners had available.

    Yes, Valve are now bringing 3 games to Steam for VR but knowing Valve Time we probably won't see them released until 2029 lol

    It's too little too late as far as I'm concerned. Valve have been swimming around in Scrooge McDuck amounts of money since the very first Half Life game released in 98. In their early days they actually used this money to create more games, and great ones at that, but since Steam REALLY took off they've become a bunch of lazy bastards.

    Not enough quality games when the Vive and Rift launched, no investment into indie developers, no Half Life 2 VR, no Half Life 3. Valve can suck my fucking cock. Wankers.
    "This you have to understand. There's only one way to hurt a man who's lost everything. Give him back something broken."

    Thomas Covenant, Unbeliever
  • cleanupdisccleanupdisc Posts: 212
    Nexus 6
    Fallout 4 vr will be the only reason i download from the steam store haha
  • edmgedmg Posts: 1,154
    Wintermute
    edited August 2017
    Yes. The big problem I have with Steam is not that there are no good VR games there, but that they're very hard to find among the swamp of shovelware.

    The other problem is that SteamVR is a horrible mess on the Rift.
  • BeastyBaiterBeastyBaiter Posts: 793
    3Jane
    No one is going to argue against that edmg. Sifting through all 70 pages of trash (for VR exclusives, nevermind VR supported) to find 5-6 things that might actually be worth playing is more than a little tedious. But the stuff is there, if you are willing to put up with the search. It doesn't help that their tags don't work properly either. Searching for "first person shooter" is a great way to get a bunch of job simulator and solitaire VR type results while simultaneously removing every FPS ever made. :|
  • BadDanMEBadDanME Posts: 62
    Hiro Protagonist
    @CrashFu @edmg Nothing to disagree on that. And now that I know there is some kind of "history" with this debate, I can see your answer in another context. 

    I just wanted to say to the new and interested users (as if I were a veteran on this *lol* ), that Steam VR also has some gems to offer. They are just buried under a ton of garbage. 
  • madamluckmadamluck Posts: 141
    Art3mis
    When I was deciding what vr to get my husband told me that steam offers games and before I decided on buying a rift I gave steam a quick look through and was floored at the amount of games available. It wasn't until I actually got my rift and went looking for games to download that I found most to be of no interest to me. I spent days looking through them all ( after awhile of searching it got boring and had to take breaks ) I did find a few mixed in but in the end I only found maybe a handful of games that interested me. Now I rarely purchase from steam. I do prefer the OH for my game purchases but hate their refund policy. If I find a game that I know isn't an exclusive to OH I will check to see if it's on steam first for a lower price. that's pretty much how my spending on steam works now.
  • snowdogsnowdog Posts: 7,160 Valuable Player
    And Oculus have offered a trial period type thing for games on their Store for developers that want to take advantage of it. You can download a game for free and after a certain time you are given the choice of buying it or not. Saw that on Redit earlier, details here:

    https://www.reddit.com/r/oculus/comments/6t2mur/oculus_store_now_supports_free_trials_free_to/

    Defense Grid 2 is the first game to offer this feature.

    And we'll probably see the refund system that we in the UK have had for a while coming to other regions too I expect.
    "This you have to understand. There's only one way to hurt a man who's lost everything. Give him back something broken."

    Thomas Covenant, Unbeliever
  • ZenbaneZenbane Posts: 14,633 Valuable Player
    edited August 2017
    I can certainly admit that Steam does offer way more services to the consumer:
    1. Free trials
    2. Demo's
    3. Refunds
    4. Gifting software
    5. Gifting credits
    6. Community Workshop
    7. Discussion boards
    8. Direct messaging

    OH has a long way to go before it can boast of being end-user friendly when compared to Steam.

    Most of those features, though, just don't appeal to me on a personal level, for the following reasons:
    1. Oculus has given me over 10 complete games entirely free; so a free trial feels like overkill. Especially because I still haven't beaten all the games in my Library (I have a Completionist gaming mentality).
    2. I don't care for demo's, I rely on "Let's Play" videos and community reviews. It's all about time management. I can read a review or watch a gameplay video while working. Relying on a demo eats in to my gameplay time at home, which I prefer to reserve for completing titles I already own.
    3. I make purchases with a fair degree of confidence. Out of some 50 VR titles total, I have maybe 3 that I regret. All low cost, and I knew I was gambling going in to them. Refunds aren't an issue in my case.
    4. Gifting Software and Credits needs to be remedied. For those that were here a few months back when I held the Dead & Buried tournament, I gifted Steam Credits to the winner. This was my only option cause Oculus is being lazy. Fix this, nubs :p
    5. Community interaction in OH is needed, but I have a strong feeling that Oculus is waiting for Facebook Spaces to take over.

    At the end of the day it comes down to the quality of the VR software offerings. Facebook and Oculus had the edge with Oculus Studios, who gave us all VR experiences that felt highly professional and as close to AAA as possible for an emerging industry. Remember that AAA games typically take 3-5 years of development time, and we just now completed the first year of commercial VR (CV1) for both the Vive and Rift. PlayStation-VR hasn't hit a full year on its own yet.

    By Christmas 2018, both Steam and OH will likely share many AAA experiences. So the feelings of "rivalry" should begin to diminish by then.
    Are you a fan of the Myst games? Check out my Mod at http://www.mystrock.com/
    Catch me on Twitter: twitter.com/zenbane
  • kzintzikzintzi Posts: 1,068
    Wintermute
    when I see people complain about OH not having <insert Steam feature here>, I remember the multitude of people who constantly complained about the lack of <insert Steam feature here> when Steam was younger.. it took them years to make Steam what it is now, Oculus have had 18 months and who wants to just replicate what Valve did?? we'd end up with ReSteam or some other thing.

    Anecdotally any of the games I've bought in Steam and then moved to the OH version have worked better in OH than Steam - the SteamVR wrapper seems to do something weird.
    Though you are more than slightly incoherent, I agree with you Madam,
    a plum is a terrible thing to do to a nostril.
  • ZenbaneZenbane Posts: 14,633 Valuable Player
    kzintzi said:
    when I see people complain about OH not having <insert Steam feature here>, I remember the multitude of people who constantly complained about the lack of <insert Steam feature here> when Steam was younger.. it took them years to make Steam what it is now, Oculus have had 18 months and who wants to just replicate what Valve did?? we'd end up with ReSteam or some other thing.

    Anecdotally any of the games I've bought in Steam and then moved to the OH version have worked better in OH than Steam - the SteamVR wrapper seems to do something weird.
    I first noticed that Steam VR was clunky when I began trying to play Pillars of Eternity in the Steam VR theater last year. At first I was all gitty like a schoolgirl at the opportunity to play my standard Flat games in a VR space. But then performance issues would happen after awhile, along with random game crashes.

    The issues were subtle at first, and increased over time. Both in terms of ongoing gameplay (resource leaks) and after each major Steam update.

    I gave up 2D gaming in VR eventually. Sometimes I will load up BigScreens in OH to test things out. But I prefer Virtual Desktop which I currently own in Steam. I don't use it for gaming anymore though; just for demo'ing to family, friends, and colleagues the ability to have our Desktop floating around a VR environment.
    Are you a fan of the Myst games? Check out my Mod at http://www.mystrock.com/
    Catch me on Twitter: twitter.com/zenbane
  • snowdogsnowdog Posts: 7,160 Valuable Player
    Tbh Oculus did a fantastic job just getting the online infrastructure in place for Oculus Home on launch day. I've been quite impressed with what they've done so far in so little time.
    "This you have to understand. There's only one way to hurt a man who's lost everything. Give him back something broken."

    Thomas Covenant, Unbeliever
  • edmgedmg Posts: 1,154
    Wintermute
    Personally, I've rebought some Steam games I own on Oculus Home, just to avoid having to use Steam. That's less of an issue now I can launch them from Oculus Home anyway, but it still leaves the extra layer of SteamVR in the middle.
  • BadDanMEBadDanME Posts: 62
    Hiro Protagonist
    Seeing the progress even in those few months I´m "in" now, I have no doubt, that OH will become better and better in short time. It took Steam years to be, where they are now. All the others got the comfort to pick the stuff, people liked and leave out stuff people disliked over the years in steam. You can see this in Origin and Uplay. And same will happen in Oculus Home. 
  • nangunangu Posts: 54
    Hiro Protagonist
    xavier4or said:
    Newbie question here - I see several discussion wrt Steam VR games - but trying to figure out what are the advantages?  Are there unique VR games available via Steam that you can't get via Oculus store?

    I checked a few of the popular ones and they seemed to be listed both in Oculus store and Steam.

    Thanks!
    Why not? It's another choice. More choices are better IMO.

    You have Oculus exclusives on the Oculus Store, and you can grab very good games on Steam which are not in Oculus Store, so get them both. For games which are on both stores, you can buy them based on price/promotion, or on the store you like to use more.

    As a side note, if you are a flight/racing sim kind of player, the better titles are on Steam. If you like "AAA like" quality games, the Oculus sponsored ones are the best.
  • Fri13Fri13 Posts: 50
    Hiro Protagonist
    Just to drop my 2 cents here: The Steam is suffering from the VR titles saturation, that ain't great at all. They are like third grade technology testing demos for internal testing of the idea, never suppose to be released to public. 

    Yet there are many other great ones that ain't in the Oculus Store either. 

    The main problem I see is that when someone goes and filters Steam with VR titles, they see too big numbers for availability for that there is worth to even check out. It is like early Apple vs Google app store competition which one has thousands and tens of thousands of apps, like you really would be there to get all them to be used!
  • gr0bdagr0bda Posts: 273
    Nexus 6
    Baloney from fanboys.
    List of Free stuff that's worth checking out on Steam, unavailable on OH:
    Accounting
    Fantasynth
    The Lab
    War Robots VR
    MSI Electric City
    Mars 2030 (kind of. They just gave away 10.000 keys, so I got it for free)
    The Ranger: Lost Tribe
    Trials on Tatooine
    Lucky Night: Texas Hold'em VR
    The Red Stare
    The Wave VR (beta)
    Belko VR: An Escape Room Experiment
    Surgeon Simulator VR: Meet The Medic
    list goes on

    Paid content, unavailable on OH
    Serious Sam VR The First Encounter
    Serious Sam VR The Second Encounter
    2017
    A-Tech Cybernetic
    Aeon
    VR The Diner Duo
    Hot Dogs, Horseshoes & Hand Grenades 
    Sairento
    Left-Hand Path     
    Operation Warcade
    Audioshield
    Ghost Town Mine Ride & Shootin' Gallery
    GORN
    To the Top

    That's what I am aware of, off top of my head, who know how much more!
    So, yeah. Blah, blah, blah. "Proof is in the pudding"
  • snowdogsnowdog Posts: 7,160 Valuable Player
    Baloney..? It is an undeniable fact that the quality of the majority of VR games on Steam is worse than the quality of the majority of VR games in the Oculus Store. It isn't an exaggeration to say that more than 90% of the VR titles available on Steam are complete steaming turds.

    There are of course some fantastic VR games available on Steam, and some on there exclusively, but any developer with any sense that has a game that meets the Oculus Standards will at some point Submit their game to Oculus for a place there. It really isn't rocket surgery tbh.
    "This you have to understand. There's only one way to hurt a man who's lost everything. Give him back something broken."

    Thomas Covenant, Unbeliever
  • Aidens12Aidens12 Posts: 124
    Art3mis
    i will say however the silver lining of all the stuff being released on vr on steam on a daily basis at least gets me somewhat excited to check it consistently for any hidden gems. whereas with oculus store i kinda have the idea in my head that they're gonna release  may be one or two major titles a month. in that sense, my anticipation for upcoming titles between the two different outlets is sort of in a tandem that i can appreciate
  • snowdogsnowdog Posts: 7,160 Valuable Player
    A copy pasta from a post I made on Reddit:

    http://store.steampowered.com/app/501420/My_Own_Pet/

    Dear Oculus, I'm VERY disappointed with the quality of games available on the Oculus Store. The games available on Steam are MUCH better, anyone saying any different is seven kinds of insane. Take 'My Own Pet' as a prime example, you need to stop bringing us crappy, low quality games such as Robo Recall and Lone Echo and provide us with more gems like 'My Own Pet'. THAT is what quality is all about, whoever does your curating for the Oculus Store needs to be sacked ASAP.

    The Snowdog
    Ward 10
    The Loony Bin
    London
    England.

    PS You also REALLY need to stop producing these Touch controllers and 'borrow' the design of the Vive controllers because they're MILES better.


     :D 

    "This you have to understand. There's only one way to hurt a man who's lost everything. Give him back something broken."

    Thomas Covenant, Unbeliever
  • ZenbaneZenbane Posts: 14,633 Valuable Player
    edited August 2017
    snowdog said:
    A copy pasta from a post I made

    mmm... pasta


    Are you a fan of the Myst games? Check out my Mod at http://www.mystrock.com/
    Catch me on Twitter: twitter.com/zenbane
  • vannagirlvannagirl Posts: 2,005 Valuable Player
    Look, man. I only need to know one thing: where they are. 
  • HeVeNyHeVeNy Posts: 40
    Brain Burst
    CrashFu said:
    Well, unlike Oculus, Steam doesn't do any kind of curation / quality-testing / bother to see if a program even works before they allow it to be sold on Steam nowadays, so they have a lot of stuff that just isn't good enough to make it onto OH (or other game platforms).

    So if you're really eager to play some half-assed college-kid projects that were rushed to completion to rip-off better games, then sure, check out Steam VR.  But anything on there that's actually worth playing is either already on Oculus, or soon will be.
    Too bad that Climbey is not one of them though
  • wanoennogswanoennogs Posts: 166
    Art3mis
    xavier4or said:
    Newbie question here - I see several discussion wrt Steam VR games - but trying to figure out what are the advantages?  Are there unique VR games available via Steam that you can't get via Oculus store?

    I checked a few of the popular ones and they seemed to be listed both in Oculus store and Steam.

    Thanks!
    If you buy a game on steam you can play it with other headsets. If you bought a vive you can still play the game.

    If you buy it from Oculus you can only use the game with a rift. 

    It may be that when consumer version 2 of the VR headsets come out you may not buy one from Occulus.  If you do that your steam games will still work but your Occulus ones wil not. 
  • snowdogsnowdog Posts: 7,160 Valuable Player
    xavier4or said:
    Newbie question here - I see several discussion wrt Steam VR games - but trying to figure out what are the advantages?  Are there unique VR games available via Steam that you can't get via Oculus store?

    I checked a few of the popular ones and they seemed to be listed both in Oculus store and Steam.

    Thanks!
    If you buy a game on steam you can play it with other headsets. If you bought a vive you can still play the game.

    If you buy it from Oculus you can only use the game with a rift. 

    It may be that when consumer version 2 of the VR headsets come out you may not buy one from Occulus.  If you do that your steam games will still work but your Occulus ones wil not. 
    You've been able to play Oculus Store games with a Vive for quite some time now using Revive. :)

    Not that anyone with any sense would want to go anywhere near shovelware like Robo Recall and Lone Echo when there are top quality AAA games like My Own Pet available to buy on Steam. B)
    "This you have to understand. There's only one way to hurt a man who's lost everything. Give him back something broken."

    Thomas Covenant, Unbeliever
  • BeastyBaiterBeastyBaiter Posts: 793
    3Jane
    Come on now, you should at least compare to the best OH has, solitaire VR! It's what everyone shelled out $400+ to play! All those nonsense games like Robo Recall from OH and Dead Effect 2 VR on Steam are just fluff that never should have been released.

    On a more serious note, I'm very glad I bought Overkill VR on steam rather than here (was on sale, so cheaper). Holy crap is that game terrible. Don't even get me started on all the ways it sucks. It's the first game I ever bothered for a refund with. Hence why I'm glad I got it from steam.

    That right there is a pretty good reason for SteamVR I suppose in addition to greater variety of games (admittedly many of them terrible, but not all). Refund policy at steam is first rate. It took less than 24 hours. On OH, that particularly bad game is $7 more expensive and I don't think I could have gotten a refund.
  • snowdogsnowdog Posts: 7,160 Valuable Player
    You could have if you live in the UK and had played it for under 2 hours.

    As much as I hate living in this shithole of a country there are 2 things that are fantastic about living here. 1) Consumer protection and 2) The National Health Service.  :D
    "This you have to understand. There's only one way to hurt a man who's lost everything. Give him back something broken."

    Thomas Covenant, Unbeliever
  • BeastyBaiterBeastyBaiter Posts: 793
    3Jane
    I live in the USA, so we have neither :(.
  • snowdogsnowdog Posts: 7,160 Valuable Player
    I'd LOVE to live in the States but I'd certainly miss those two things about the UK.
    "This you have to understand. There's only one way to hurt a man who's lost everything. Give him back something broken."

    Thomas Covenant, Unbeliever
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