Oculus GO Use when Plugged In? — Oculus
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Oculus GO Use when Plugged In?

Shadowmask72Shadowmask72 Posts: 3,413 Valuable Player
edited May 2018 in Oculus Go
I think a number of people are worried about Oculus' recommendation of not using the GO whilst "charging" . I am not sure if that extends to plugged in whilst the battery is fully charged, but let's assume it does. The 2.5 - 3 hours battery life comes as a bit of a downer if say a movie lasts 3 or more hours (and there are plenty of those in recent times). One of the GO's biggest selling points is viewing movie content, but seems to stumble with the battery limitation. Also for those on long haul flights/journeys, having to charge the device back up to full can take up to 3 hours which is a bit of a shame. Some people are likely to opt for an external portable USB charging unit to keep the device topped up or recharged when in the field.

Now I posed this question on Reddit which was kindly answered by Oculus tech communications officer Lisa Jaloza who reiterated not to use GO whilst "charging". No other reasons were provided.  But it's the reasons why that is important here. Are Oculus simply being overly cautious or is there a real danger of diminishing the life of the battery far quicker when using it this way.

There is quite a bit of anecdotal evidence as of now where people have used the GO whilst it's plugged in/charging with seemingly no ill side effects. However, we don't know if there is risk over the longer term to the battery life or potential hazard of something much worse. 

@cybereality Please can someone at Oculus answer this question in greater detail rather than saying a blanket response. I think this is quite important and if there is no real risk to users then surely they can be the judge of whether they want to use it whilst plugged in. 

That said, PL has just offered a tear-down showing the 2600mah battery inside making a good case for modification to a better battery.




System Specs: RTX 2080 ti , i9 9900K CPU, 16 GB DDR 4 RAM, Win 10 64 Bit OS.
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Comments

  • DPArcadeDPArcade Posts: 2
    NerveGear
    I would buy it today if there was a larger battery option; 2.5 hours for film\2 hours for gaming, from a 100% charge, negates it's use case for myself (looks great otherwise). I would be interested in a specific answer to your question also

  • DaftnDirectDaftnDirect Posts: 4,631 Valuable Player

    I'm assuming it's risk related. I'd personally not want to have a phone-sized charging lithium ion battery near my face. If a battery has even a small risk of over-heating (or worse), that's when it's going to happen. If that's the reason though, I'm not sure any company would want to put it into words.... no-matter how small he risk, it's just impossible to put into words and have it sound user friendly.


    Reasonable question though.

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  • LZoltowskiLZoltowski Posts: 6,721 Volunteer Moderator
    as @DaftnDirect points out, the unit is a lithium ion bomb strapped to your face and right in front of your eyes, charging lithium ion while also using it under stress can potentially cause it to fail if there is a manufacturing defect and KABOOM you end up like a monster of the week on Supernatural 

    I am sure something as low taxing as Netflix will be fine, one of my mates who has it already, plugged it in and ran Netflix on it for an hour while charging (by obscuring the sensor) and noticed no warmth or extra heat , but stressing it with a game might not be a good idea.

    Oculus is basically covering themselves to stop any litigation if the battery explodes into their eyes burning them out. It's a legal thing, so you know, use at your own risk.
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  • DaftnDirectDaftnDirect Posts: 4,631 Valuable Player
    edited May 2018

    Yeah I think that's right... how taxing the app is, is a factor on deciding whether to charge or not, it all adds up to the heat generated. Also whether the headset has been given a hard life, i.e. bashed about or dropped a few times is a factor when you multiply the small risk of damage to the charging circuit or something, by the number of headsets sold.


    I'm sure the Go has been given a pretty rigorous testing regime… but it's a different animal to a mobile phone.

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  • RedRizlaRedRizla Posts: 5,884 Valuable Player
    Well even with a mobile phone you are told not to use some while they are charging.  Don't Apple tell you not to do this with their iphones? 
  • DaftnDirectDaftnDirect Posts: 4,631 Valuable Player
    edited May 2018
    RedRizla said:
    Well even with a mobile phone you are told not to use some while they are charging.  Don't Apple tell you not to do this with their iphones? 


    Don't think I've ever read my phones instructions, having said that, my phone calls tend to be pretty short.

    Not so bothered if it lets go in my hand while I'm playing with it (still talking about the phone).

    Intel 5820K OC@4Ghz, Titan X (Maxwell), 16GB Corsair Vengeance DDR4, ASRock X99 Taichi, Samsung 500Gb 960 Evo M.2, Corsair H100i v2 Cooler, Inateck KTU3FR-4P USB 3 card, Windows 10 Pro v1809 (17763.348)
  • ken.moscoeken.moscoe Posts: 5
    NerveGear
    I have the same question.  Battery life is my only concern as Id like to watch sporting events.
  • Shadowmask72Shadowmask72 Posts: 3,413 Valuable Player
    Well the question is aimed at low stress applications as mentioned in my first post (watching movies rather than hardcore gaming). Thanks for the inputs guys but your responses are still speculation. I think if there was a more official response confirming what you are saying then I believe this will put some peoples minds at ease a little. However, perhaps there is no danger at all and the risk is reducing the effectiveness of the battery rather quickly which would also be bad.

    Maybe someone has to do the test and run a demanding app with it plugged in and left on for hours to see what happens (obviously in a lab environment and not strapped to ones face). Perhaps Oculus tech already did this hence the warning. It's just a little vague and I think if they would come out and just say, yeh guys you should be ok watching movies or streaming content, but anything else you are at risk then that would be suffice for a number of people.




    System Specs: RTX 2080 ti , i9 9900K CPU, 16 GB DDR 4 RAM, Win 10 64 Bit OS.
  • Shadowmask72Shadowmask72 Posts: 3,413 Valuable Player
    edited May 2018
    Some official but not official stuff coming in. The lovely Mister Carmack has kindly chimed in on the issue.

    https://twitter.com/ID_AA_Carmack/status/991639271361712128

    Quote J.Carmack
    It should give 3+ hours of media viewing, 2 hrs of gaming. It works fine with a charging cable attached, the included one is just pretty short.

    Ian Hamilton suggested the reason Oculus are saying to not use the device whilst charging is because the cable is too short and will restrict movement rather than a hardware issue.

     Imagine getting up in a hurry like (after being busted watching VR porn) and the cable gets yanked as you stand up. Not only would you be mega embarrassed at the horrified looks from whoever rumbled you, but you would also damage your GO.

    So that's a double whammy right there.  :cold_sweat:






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  • MAC_MAN86MAC_MAN86 Posts: 1,724
    3Jane
    You think these will be allowed on planes? I see real life problems with this. No explanation needed.
  • RedRizlaRedRizla Posts: 5,884 Valuable Player
    edited May 2018
    RedRizla said:
    Well even with a mobile phone you are told not to use some while they are charging.  Don't Apple tell you not to do this with their iphones? 


    Don't think I've ever read my phones instructions, having said that, my phone calls tend to be pretty short.

    Not so bothered if it lets go in my hand while I'm playing with it (still talking about the phone).


    I read about a few people killed through getting an electric shock while using their phones while charging. That's when I read about not using your mobile while it's charging. I'm not sure holding anything while it is charging is a good idea..
  • Ronin2306Ronin2306 Posts: 3
    NerveGear
    I notice that it takes longer to fully charge it than it takes to deplete it in use. Doesn't that mean that it will never fully charge while in use?
  • DeckyonDeckyon Posts: 7
    NerveGear
    I may have cheated last night in setting mine up.  I was impatient and didnt want to wait until it was fully charged, so I got a USB battery charger (one of my big ones, 26800 mah) and used it to charge the unit while I was using it.  I spent about an hour messing with the Go and getting apps installed and other settings situated, and it went from 56% to 92% in that hour.  I was paying attention to (feeling for) any heating issues of it being on and operating while plugged in; I didnt find anything.

    My goal was to use my batteries like this when I travel to keep it topped off and charged/recharge while on the go.  As for using on an aircraft?  What difference is there between this and a sleep mask other than it having a screen and battery?  We all use tablets and phones anyway?  Why would there be "real life problems" on aircraft?  I travel with my drone all the time.
  • Ronin2306Ronin2306 Posts: 3
    NerveGear
    It is a simple question - why should the Oculus Go not be used while on charge? I cannot understand why someone from Oculus does not take the trouble to answer this question. The only conclusion I can draw from this is that they do not care about their customers. People are always more likely to take notice of something if an explanation is given.
  • fcoulombefcoulombe Posts: 1
    NerveGear
    Ronin2306 said:
    It is a simple question - why should the Oculus Go not be used while on charge? I cannot understand why someone from Oculus does not take the trouble to answer this question. The only conclusion I can draw from this is that they do not care about their customers. People are always more likely to take notice of something if an explanation is given.
    or maybe they just dont want to be liable for saying "it's not THAT dangerous"

    it's easier (cheaper) to say don't do it.
  • edmgedmg Posts: 1,132
    Wintermute
    Ronin2306 said:
    It is a simple question - why should the Oculus Go not be used while on charge?
    Because the battery could explode and burn your face off?

    I'm guessing there's no specific reason, just a bunch of unlikely ways that people could hurt themselves which Oculus don't want to take responsibility for.
  • PickleschlitzPickleschlitz Posts: 104
    Art3mis
    edited May 2018
    What other device do you strap the battery pack OVER YOUR EYES? We've all heard the stories about people's phones catching on fire when they got hot. Imagine that right on top of your baby blues!
  • OcalazinOcalazin Posts: 1
    NerveGear
    What I don't get is why you can't charge from an external battery even when the Go is turned off. There is no difference an external battery is exactly the same amps and voltage as the supplied power supply. Should not be a problem. 
  • Ronin2306Ronin2306 Posts: 3
    NerveGear
    In my opinion if Oculus do not categorically state the reason why the device should not be used while charging, and someone has an accident, they will still be liable. People will always take more notice of such warnings if a reason is given
  • chuffedfoxchuffedfox Posts: 23
    Brain Burst
    Ronin2306 said:
    In my opinion if Oculus do not categorically state the reason why the device should not be used while charging, and someone has an accident, they will still be liable. People will always take more notice of such warnings if a reason is given
    As ever in this modern age, you're entitled to an opinion - but it doesn't make your opinion legitimate.

    If they say "don't do it", and you do it, they aren't liable.   It's a blanket warning applied to any device with a battery that you shouldn't use it when it is charging.

    If you want to take the risk, go for it - don't look for someone to blame if you find that there are side effects.
  • burning.airlinesburning.airlines Posts: 63
    Hiro Protagonist
    Where did Oculus tell us not to charge while using?  I didn't see that during setup or anything.
  • SuperattorneySuperattorney Posts: 6
    NerveGear
    Saying don't do it doesn't take Oculus off the hook. There's no such easy answer in litigation. It all depends on a variety of factors. That's just one factor. If there's a 100% chance the thing explodes when charging then you better believe they would be liable regardless of them saying don't do it. If they really wanted to lessen liability they would state the reason for example:

    Do not charge while using the headset, headset may explode. 

    That would lessen liability, but not eliminate it. Honestly, no company could release a product if it exploded so easily.

    My advice: don't take advice from non-lawyers or random persons on the internet. Yes, even me. Take the advice at your own risk. The above is not legal advice and not intended as such. Consult an attorney.
  • voxelmaniamvoxelmaniam Posts: 129
    Art3mis
    I think that it all boils down to the feature limitations that were required to allow Oculus to ship a device with this level of performance at an acceptable price point. I think there are a number of potential mods that would allow the device to operate safely on an external battery. Strap a 10 or 20 Ah power bank to the back head band and remove battery charging from the equation all together while improving the balance. Swap out the power bank at a reasonable discharge level and charge it at a safe distance; away from potential bodily harm.

    We are early days here and given what looks like a slam dunk win for Oculus you can bet the mods will be pouring in. 32_GB units have already sold for as little as $120 on ebay and that is surely fodder for hardware hackers to enhance the product, warranty be damned. I'm already watching iFixit for their detailed tear down report. PL's release will hopefully speed that up.

    Now if I can just figure out how to hack up an external camera. 8^)
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  • PixelfoxPixelfox Posts: 53
    Hiro Protagonist
    The worst-case scenario is an over-heated battery that somehow catches fire. The problem would be that on ignition, the Lithium-Ion battery would immediately flood the headset with toxic gasses, including some amount of Hydrogen Fluoride (HF), one of the deadlier poisons known, which could potentially do really bad things to your eyes before you can get the headset off.

    It would seem prudent to me to have put the battery in an enclosed compartment that vents to the outside rather than into the headset, and that seems like it would add little cost.

    Hopefully they use high quality batteries with near 0% risk of manufacturing defects, and people don't start sticking cheap LiPo high capacity replacement batteries in there or something similarly crazy.

    Honestly the risk is probably really really low (you're probably like 100x more likely to die hitting your head after tripping over something while wearing the GO).
  • ZenbaneZenbane Posts: 13,693 Valuable Player
    edited May 2018
    Saying don't do it doesn't take Oculus off the hook. There's no such easy answer in litigation. It all depends on a variety of factors. That's just one factor. If there's a 100% chance the thing explodes when charging then you better believe they would be liable regardless of them saying don't do it. If they really wanted to lessen liability they would state the reason for example:

    Do not charge while using the headset, headset may explode. 

    That would lessen liability, but not eliminate it. Honestly, no company could release a product if it exploded so easily.

    My advice: don't take advice from non-lawyers or random persons on the internet. Yes, even me. Take the advice at your own risk. The above is not legal advice and not intended as such. Consult an attorney.

    If you ignore the warning sign on Bleach, drink it, and get poisoned: You can't sue Clorox.

    Liability is determined by Negligence, which is judged according to regulatory standards and an organization's ability to illustrate due care and due diligence.

    As for the whole "no company could release a product if it exploded so easily," umm... are you not familiar with the automotive industry?

    http://abc13.com/automotive/ford-issues-recall-over-exploding-air-bags-in-rangers/2930159/
    http://money.cnn.com/2018/02/27/news/companies/takata-airbags-australia-recall/index.html

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  • UBSERDUBSERD Posts: 347
    Nexus 6
    I might be rolling the dice but I’ve been playing with my Go using a Aukey 30000 MHP battery. It has a fast charge usb and it never gets hot and the battery stays at 92% minimum even running games like Republik VR.  I played nonstop today for three hours and my eyes are hurting LOL.  Not because of any heat but because you shouldn’t be in VR for all that time anyway. Battery when done was still in the 90s in Go.

     Another plus is once the battery charges the device completely it shuts off ultimately saving the battery in your Go, especially if you charge overnight like me. I hate leaving it like that overcharging because it has no natural shutoff once the battery is full.

     I’m not recommending anybody else doing what I’m doing but it hasn’t caused any issues in a decent climate. I would not recommend going outside in the hot sun during the summer days and trying this because the heat will have nowhere to go then you may be in trouble. I am not condoning doing this, just adding my two cents to the topic.
  • edmgedmg Posts: 1,132
    Wintermute
    edited May 2018
    Zenbane said:
    As for the whole "no company could release a product if it exploded so easily," umm... are you not familiar with the automotive industry?

    http://abc13.com/automotive/ford-issues-recall-over-exploding-air-bags-in-rangers/2930159/
    http://money.cnn.com/2018/02/27/news/companies/takata-airbags-australia-recall/index.html

    To be fair, the airbags weren't expected to do that, and last I heard the company who made them was pretty much bankrupt as a result. The auto manufacturers wouldn't have shipped them if they knew the airbags could kill people so easily.

    It's not like they could put a 'don't sit near an airbag while driving' warning in the manual, because that would rather destroy the point of buying a car.

    And, yeah, I've used my Go while it was charging, but it's not something I'm going to do often, precisely because I do know what Lithium batteries are capable of.
  • ZenbaneZenbane Posts: 13,693 Valuable Player
    edmg said:
    To be fair, the airbags weren't expected to do that

    K

    Ford is recalling more than 570,000 vehicles in North America and Europe to fix separate problems that can cause engine fires and doors to fly open unexpectedly.

    https://www.theglobeandmail.com/report-on-business/ford-recalls-570000-vehicles-for-engine-fire-risk-door-latch-trouble/article34471584/



    That better? There's years of examples across several industries. These are the easy ones.
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  • burning.airlinesburning.airlines Posts: 63
    Hiro Protagonist
    I will ask again.  Where did Oculus say not to use the Go headset while charging?
  • chuffedfoxchuffedfox Posts: 23
    Brain Burst
    I will ask again.  Where did Oculus say not to use the Go headset while charging?
    Have you not read the first post?
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