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Well If This Ends Up Happening I'm Jumping Ship!

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  • pyroth309pyroth309 Posts: 983
    3Jane
    edited February 6
    snowdog said:
    The problem is that more cameras won't solve problems that archery games will have. The problems that archery games have is caused by the controllers being too close to the headset. Even if you add an extra two cameras to the back of the headset you'll still have issues with the controllers being concluded if they're too close to your head.

    And it'll be the CV2 because it's the second Consumer Version of the Rift.
    I agree with that, but I will also say, Archery works pretty good with WMR when you are firing at a quick or relatively normal pace. It's only when you hold it past 2 seconds that it's a problem. I think it's something that could be improved upon for sure but I have played several archery games without issue by just waiting until I'm ready to fire before drawing. .  
  • snowdogsnowdog Posts: 6,093 Valuable Player
    The Vive Pro is also a CV2 and I've said that right from the start. It was the first headset of the second generation. ;)
    "This you have to understand. There's only one way to hurt a man who's lost everything. Give him back something broken."

    Thomas Covenant, Unbeliever
  • bigmike20vtbigmike20vt Posts: 3,703 Valuable Player
    edited February 6
    I aint gonna lie, i am a little concerned, esp after seeing the thing of beauty that was the half Dome.... however I am prepared to wait and see.
    Conceptually inside out tracking brings a lot of cool shizzle to the table. 

    I wonder how  much it would add to the cost to optionally add a few standard constellation points onto the new controllers and then if we choose to also add in a couple of standard outside in sensors as well (would probably only need a couple at 180 degrees to each other just to get to the parts other sensors cant reach.

    probably not gonna happen but just a thought.   Hell, I hope i am wrong but i cannot see how inside out tracking will work for stuff like sportsbar VR where highly accurate tracking is needed from very close to the body.

    But my toys are staying in my pram until we know more ;)

    I will say this though... what is the point of oculus going in on the VR link design if they are ditching constellation?  if it goes that route then presumably 1xusb 3.0 is all the headset will need. Hardly seems worth helping design a new proprietary socket for a GPU
    Fiat Coupe, gone. 350Z gone. Dirty nappies, no sleep & practical transport incoming. Thank goodness for VR :)
  • snowdogsnowdog Posts: 6,093 Valuable Player
    Well I've calmed down a little now lol 

    I guess we'll have to wait and see what the 360 tracking is like before I pass judgement.

    But if it doesn't have a better FOV than the current Rift I'm still going to look elsewhere I think, either a Pimax or a Valve headset. I'm hoping that @Shadowmask72's Pimax headset is going to be decent otherwise I'll probably have to do the unthinkable and give Valve some of my money. And that thought HORRIFIES me :o
    "This you have to understand. There's only one way to hurt a man who's lost everything. Give him back something broken."

    Thomas Covenant, Unbeliever
  • jayhawkjayhawk Posts: 670
    Neo
    I still use only 2 sensors, so dead on 360 degree accuracy is still an issue for me, but the occasional occlusion issue isn't a big deal to me. I bought a 3rd sensor and ended up sending it back because I weighed the differences. The extra cost and running more cable around wasn't worth getting rid of those few occlusion issues. I'm going to assume inside/out tracking will be the same situation. Good will outweigh the bad.
  • SkScotcheggSkScotchegg Posts: 853
    3Jane
    edited February 6
    jayhawk said:
    I still use only 2 sensors, so dead on 360 degree accuracy is still an issue for me, but the occasional occlusion issue isn't a big deal to me. I bought a 3rd sensor and ended up sending it back because I weighed the differences. The extra cost and running more cable around wasn't worth getting rid of those few occlusion issues. I'm going to assume inside/out tracking will be the same situation. Good will outweigh the bad.

    I agree, I used 2 sensors for first year and for most games it was fine as they only need 180° tracking for the most part. But I only got a 3rd sensors in my 2nd year to cover the floor so I could pick up guns in certain FPS games. My three sensors work great and I've had no issues but 2 sensors also works really good too.

    I'm not worried about inside/out tracking if that's what they decide to use as there's so many unknowns, like for example they could allow us to use our existing camera with it, which would make it even better. And it could have extra cameras on the back of the HMD. I'm no worried about it.

    I'm more curious then anything, I just want to find out what the next version of Rift looks like, if it's Rift CV1.5 I will still buy it with better optics and increased fov + touch 2.0. 

    And then if we have to wait another year or two for Rift CV2 thats fine as well. Maybe they need longer to make a better product, maybe that half dome we saw isn't ready yet. Either way I will buy whatever comes next, Rift S, 1.5 or CV2.

    I'm so excited for the announcement, I believe it will happen within next 2-6 months.
  • pyroth309pyroth309 Posts: 983
    3Jane
    I think the pros will outweigh the cons for the average user, especially if they can improve upon the WMR 2 second prediction window or use some kind of other trick to provide tracking outside of camera to keep things smooth. Quest should give us a good preview of their tech I would imagine. I know for me, I'm anxious to get rid of all the USB cables.  The Odyssey+ really made me appreciate the single cable as I can just grab it and go to a friends house to show them or just plug it into my laptop when I'm on the go and start playing. I also like that it can map and use 100% of my space as I have some problem areas in the corners with my 3 sensor setup that are too far to get good tracking from the cameras. So having those extra square feet is really nice.

    So yea, definitely not a dealbreaker for me to have inside out tracking if it's better than WMR. If it's the same or worse... well I'll likely be disappointed at this stage of the game. 
  • RedRizlaRedRizla Posts: 5,522 Valuable Player
    snowdog said:
    Well I've calmed down a little now lol 

    I guess we'll have to wait and see what the 360 tracking is like before I pass judgement.

    But if it doesn't have a better FOV than the current Rift I'm still going to look elsewhere I think, either a Pimax or a Valve headset. I'm hoping that @Shadowmask72's Pimax headset is going to be decent otherwise I'll probably have to do the unthinkable and give Valve some of my money. And that thought HORRIFIES me :o

    Just don't come back here saying how great Valve is if you do decide to jump ship :D
  • snowdogsnowdog Posts: 6,093 Valuable Player
    I will NEVER do that. They're still a bunch of cunts until they either learn how to count to three or bring Half Life 2 VR to the table  :D
    "This you have to understand. There's only one way to hurt a man who's lost everything. Give him back something broken."

    Thomas Covenant, Unbeliever
  • ohgrantohgrant Posts: 148
    Art3mis
     1.5 CV2, what's in a name? A rose by any other name...Just my opinion, but I do think there is probably a lower end Oculus consumer version coming out for the PC. Though the sales aren't quite there yet for WMR, I think they will become a much more aggressive competitor than HTC. Their store front is pre-installed with Windows. I think it may be crucial for Oculus's survival, as a market leader in VR hardware, to try to capture the lower to mid grade market. 
     Having one model for PC and now being in the middle as far as cost to me is not a good place to be in my opinion.
    I have confidence Oculus will be around as game developer for VR for a long time. 
     In any case, I'm willing to wait to see what they eventually come up with for their high end version, I may jump ship a few times before their next high end version and will more than likely be back. 

      
  • Hiro_Protag0nistHiro_Protag0nist Posts: 4,634 Valuable Player
    RedRizla said:
    snowdog said:
    Well I've calmed down a little now lol 

    I guess we'll have to wait and see what the 360 tracking is like before I pass judgement.

    But if it doesn't have a better FOV than the current Rift I'm still going to look elsewhere I think, either a Pimax or a Valve headset. I'm hoping that @Shadowmask72's Pimax headset is going to be decent otherwise I'll probably have to do the unthinkable and give Valve some of my money. And that thought HORRIFIES me :o

    Just don't come back here saying how great Valve is if you do decide to jump ship :D

    Vive pro with wireless is a very good headset.  Their inability to release anything better than their pathetic wands makes it meaningless to someone who has used the Touch controllers though.
  • snowdogsnowdog Posts: 6,093 Valuable Player
    RedRizla said:
    snowdog said:
    Well I've calmed down a little now lol 

    I guess we'll have to wait and see what the 360 tracking is like before I pass judgement.

    But if it doesn't have a better FOV than the current Rift I'm still going to look elsewhere I think, either a Pimax or a Valve headset. I'm hoping that @Shadowmask72's Pimax headset is going to be decent otherwise I'll probably have to do the unthinkable and give Valve some of my money. And that thought HORRIFIES me :o

    Just don't come back here saying how great Valve is if you do decide to jump ship :D

    Vive pro with wireless is a very good headset.  Their inability to release anything better than their pathetic wands makes it meaningless to someone who has used the Touch controllers though.

    It WOULD be a very good headset if they had a) been bothered to change the crappy lenses and b) you didn't need to take out a second mortgage to buy one.

    A headset that costs over a grand to buy SHOULDN'T need you to mod with GearVR lenses.

    It's a bit of a shite headset if you REALLY start to think about it.
    "This you have to understand. There's only one way to hurt a man who's lost everything. Give him back something broken."

    Thomas Covenant, Unbeliever
  • RedRizlaRedRizla Posts: 5,522 Valuable Player
    Vive pro with wireless is a very good headset.  

    Not for the price it's not, it should be twice as good for what Valve charge for it.
  • DaftnDirectDaftnDirect Posts: 4,484 Valuable Player
    edited February 6

    Yep, for enterprise use where's there's a business model for it, a Vive Pro is a great headset, maybe even the best.

    Our VR business models are likely to be based more on how much time we'd have to spend convincing our partners we really do need these things.... or how many tins of baked beans we'd have to survive on in order to pay for it.


    Edit: Just to avoid confusion, for 97.4% of VR users*, a Vive Pro is not the right choice.

    *Based on Steam survey January results for headset use.

    Intel 5820K [email protected], Titan X (Maxwell), 16GB Corsair Vengeance DDR4, ASRock X99 Taichi, Samsung 500Gb 960 Evo M.2, Corsair H100i v2 Cooler, Inateck KTU3FR-4P USB 3 card, Windows 10 Pro v1809 (17763.348)
  • snowdogsnowdog Posts: 6,093 Valuable Player
    Reminds me of the 90s. I was saving up for a new PC build so I started eating plenty of beans on toast to save a few quid. I was still working behind the bar and drinking 20-odd pints every day though lmfao :D :D :D

    Started doing sandwiches too. Cutting down on my kebabs, burgers and curries saved me a good few quid. :D
    "This you have to understand. There's only one way to hurt a man who's lost everything. Give him back something broken."

    Thomas Covenant, Unbeliever
  • DaftnDirectDaftnDirect Posts: 4,484 Valuable Player
    In other news, Oculus Go App on Google play store now has 1,000,000+ installs, I would hedge a bet there are 2.5 million of them out there. Not bad, not bad at all. I have a feeling Quest will do rather well.


    I don't know what the split is these days between apple & android but yeah, I'd say 2 mil is a safe bet. So yeah pretty good in what.... 10 or 11 months?

    I'm going to guess double that for Quest.

    Intel 5820K [email protected], Titan X (Maxwell), 16GB Corsair Vengeance DDR4, ASRock X99 Taichi, Samsung 500Gb 960 Evo M.2, Corsair H100i v2 Cooler, Inateck KTU3FR-4P USB 3 card, Windows 10 Pro v1809 (17763.348)
  • ZenbaneZenbane Posts: 13,292 Valuable Player
    edited February 6
    snowdog said:
    The Vive Pro is also a CV2 and I've said that right from the start. It was the first headset of the second generation.

    So I guess we need to have a conversation about the difference between:
    • First Release vs Version 1.0
    • Second Release vs Version 2.0
    Okay here we go:
    1. The word "release" is not spelled with the letter "V"
    2. The word "version" is spelled with the letter "V"
    3. The phrase "CV" translates to "Consumer Version"
    4. The phrase "CV" does not translate to "Consumer Release"
    5. The Letter V <> The Letter R
    6. A release happens using Whole Numbers. Release 1, Release 2, etc.
    7. Versioning happens with Fractions: Version 1.0, Version 1.1, Version 1.2, etc.

    As as software engineer I guess I've taken it for granted that most people understand the difference between a Release and a Version. Both Software and Hardware typically have a form of version control.

    Here is some documentation on that:

    They implement a major/minor point system at the very least. So the phrase "Version 2.3" would mean that there have been "2 major updates" and "3 minor updates."

    So the Vive 1.0 is released first, and Vive 1.5 is released second. It is literally impossible to increment a hardware or software version without actually releasing the new version. So... there's no way to release the Vive 1.5 without actually releasing 1.0 first and then 1.5 second. But the "first" and "second" order should in no way trick someone's mind in to thinking that the Versions are 1.0 and 2.0.

    Remember, CV stands for "Consumer Version." Also remember that Fractions are important in Math.
    :*

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  • kevinw729kevinw729 Posts: 4,248 Valuable Player
    ....I would hedge a bet there are 2.5 million of them [Oculus GO] out there.

    Find that very hard to consider - at best there could be 1.3m - but if there had been over 2m we would have seen news from the Chinese production operation of re-tooling and also I think that kind of news would have forced OVR management to "hint" at it to media and devs. Best we moderate expectations there  B)
    P6ftmuw.jpg
    ** New Book **
    "The Out-of-Home Immersive Entertainment Frontier: Expanding Interactive Boundaries in Leisure Facilities"
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  • snowdogsnowdog Posts: 6,093 Valuable Player
    kevinw729 said:
    ....I would hedge a bet there are 2.5 million of them [Oculus GO] out there.

    Find that very hard to consider - at best there could be 1.3m - but if there had been over 2m we would have seen news from the Chinese production operation of re-tooling and also I think that kind of news would have forced OVR management to "hint" at it to media and devs. Best we moderate expectations there  B)

    Are you seriously suggesting that there are only 300,000 iPhone users downloading the app? Makes more sense that an estimate of 2m at least is more accurate, unless you think that people are downloading the app for a bit of a laugh and not using the thing lol :D
    "This you have to understand. There's only one way to hurt a man who's lost everything. Give him back something broken."

    Thomas Covenant, Unbeliever
  • ZenbaneZenbane Posts: 13,292 Valuable Player
    snowdog said:
    Are you seriously suggesting that there are only 300,000 iPhone users downloading the app? Makes more sense that an estimate of 2m at least is more accurate, unless you think that people are downloading the app for a bit of a laugh and not using the thing lol :D

    .... and NOW he's back. There's the frost puppy that we all know and love. Missed ya, buddy. Where ya been? Watcha been doing over there in Naughty Pants Land?
    ;)
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  • kevinw729kevinw729 Posts: 4,248 Valuable Player
    snowdog said:
    ..... unless you think that people are downloading the app for a bit of a laugh and not using the thing lol :D

    Exactly, just like all those GearVR's  :D
    P6ftmuw.jpg
    ** New Book **
    "The Out-of-Home Immersive Entertainment Frontier: Expanding Interactive Boundaries in Leisure Facilities"
    https://www.amazon.co.uk/Out-Home-Immersive-Entertainment-Frontier/dp/1472426959
  • Techy111Techy111 Posts: 5,306 Volunteer Moderator
    Techy111 said:
    3 thirds true mate........3 thirds true ;)
    I have heard the next Rift will be called CV2b. Let's discuss whether it's 2b or not 2b. 
    Ahhhhh 2b or not 2b, that IS the question isn't it ? I'll give you a 100 to 1 odds :)
    A PC with lots of gadgets inside and a thing to see in 3D that you put on your head.
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    Flyinside Flight Simulator RELEASED.
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