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Well If This Ends Up Happening I'm Jumping Ship!

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  • AlextendedAlextended Posts: 49
    Brain Burst
    edited February 8
    Yeah that's another idea I've considered too but there's probably a reason no company has done it yet, though they could be researching it and maybe will be able to do it in the future, who knows.
  • MradrMradr Posts: 3,204 Valuable Player
    Yeah that's another idea I've considered too but there's probably a reason no company has done it yet, though they could be researching it and maybe will be able to do it in the future, who knows.
    Right now its new enough of an idea that is the reason why no one has done it yet. I mean Quest is such a big deal because it comes with 4 cameras instead of 2. More of a time issue than it is a can we do it or not issue.
  • kevinw729kevinw729 Posts: 4,248 Valuable Player
    DaftnDirect said:
    ....
    It doesn't have to be perfect but provided it's good, it'll tell us if the public is really as ready for VR as we think they are.

    Yes, I hear a lot of the faithful quoting that point. "It don't have to be perfect" - I was seeing this as a code phrase for,"its less powerful than we hoped for!" Speaking with those that are working on the system I hear lots of this, managing expectations (hopefully not too much!) For the VR community, I wonder if those that double down on day one will have a code that of the 50-release-titles, if they already own some that they don't have to buy again?

    Quest has to be about enticing those that previous management promised were waiting in the wings to buy into VR, rather than selling to the VR community!
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  • Hiro_Protag0nistHiro_Protag0nist Posts: 4,628 Valuable Player
    snowdog said:
    RedRizla said:
    snowdog said:
    Well I've calmed down a little now lol 

    I guess we'll have to wait and see what the 360 tracking is like before I pass judgement.

    But if it doesn't have a better FOV than the current Rift I'm still going to look elsewhere I think, either a Pimax or a Valve headset. I'm hoping that @Shadowmask72's Pimax headset is going to be decent otherwise I'll probably have to do the unthinkable and give Valve some of my money. And that thought HORRIFIES me :o

    Just don't come back here saying how great Valve is if you do decide to jump ship :D

    Vive pro with wireless is a very good headset.  Their inability to release anything better than their pathetic wands makes it meaningless to someone who has used the Touch controllers though.

    It WOULD be a very good headset if they had a) been bothered to change the crappy lenses and b) you didn't need to take out a second mortgage to buy one.

    A headset that costs over a grand to buy SHOULDN'T need you to mod with GearVR lenses.

    It's a bit of a shite headset if you REALLY start to think about it.

    Nope, it's just a very good headset.

    Price is irrelevant to how good a headset is, it is only a barrier to whether we can have it or not.  It's still a very good headset even if it is sitting on the shelf at the store.
  • bigmike20vtbigmike20vt Posts: 3,703 Valuable Player
    Given how old the Snapdragon 845 is now I can't help but wonder how much more it would have cost to use that. It is apparently a drop in replacement to the same circuit board design as the 835 (so I am told) has little more energy requirements and very slight more heat production ... So the only real difference between the 2 (according to a friend of mine in the business)  is performance as well as cost.
    IF we are talking an extra $75 on the price of the hmd I get it.... If it's an extra $25 for instance I really don't. 
    I am not saying it won't have good titles.... But for a technical pov it will be launching with hardware which is very old hat (2 years+ old)
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  • Hiro_Protag0nistHiro_Protag0nist Posts: 4,628 Valuable Player
    I'm incredibly confident the Quest will sell in droves.  Perfect price point, a load of software available and the form-factor (pretty much a Rift + Touch) is spot on, tried and tested.  It needs good coverage from the outset though.
  • ZenbaneZenbane Posts: 13,285 Valuable Player
    edited February 8

    Hiro_Protag0nist said:
    Price is irrelevant to how good a headset is, it is only a barrier to whether we can have it or not.  It's still a very good headset even if it is sitting on the shelf at the store.

    Agreed. Price has no bearing on quality whatsoever. Driving a racecar feels great whether you can afford it or not! snowdog needs to understand this already. He's a good bloke but omg he's been equating price with experience for too long now. Level up, buddy! lol

    I'm incredibly confident the Quest will sell in droves.  Perfect price point, a load of software available and the form-factor (pretty much a Rift + Touch) is spot on, tried and tested.  It needs good coverage from the outset though.

    No doubt Quest will do well. Even GO sold much better than expected.  I look forward to owning Quest, and of course I'll be purchasing the new version of Rift - regardless if it is a "CV2" or a complete shift in Product Design.

    I will say that when it comes to tracking, I do have some concern about having our hands behind our heads and back of the body. There are quite a few scenarios where having your hands for behind you can happen. And no, not just with carebear archery games lol

    First, in games like the Echo series (Lone/Arena/Combat) where you can be looking forward but your hand is holding on to something behind you as you wait to "push off." Also, boxing games like Creed! Hands are a flying and launching a punch where you fist is slightly behind your head is common place.

    Now, with Quest this may not be so much of an issue since it is Stand-Alone VR. However, the next version of the Rift should (hopefully) have at least one extra camera on the back of the headset to help account for all of this.

    In the end though, I have no doubt that Oculus will delivery - as they always have. And the naysayers who predicted their demise will just develop amnesia and move on to their next bad predictions.
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  • DaftnDirectDaftnDirect Posts: 4,484 Valuable Player
    edited February 8
    kevinw729 said:
    DaftnDirect said:
    ....
    It doesn't have to be perfect but provided it's good, it'll tell us if the public is really as ready for VR as we think they are.

    Yes, I hear a lot of the faithful quoting that point. "It don't have to be perfect" - I was seeing this as a code phrase for,"its less powerful than we hoped for!" Speaking with those that are working on the system I hear lots of this, managing expectations (hopefully not too much!) For the VR community, I wonder if those that double down on day one will have a code that of the 50-release-titles, if they already own some that they don't have to buy again?

    Quest has to be about enticing those that previous management promised were waiting in the wings to buy into VR, rather than selling to the VR community!
    I'm not sure what code phrases people use but I'll try to be clear with my interpretation...
    It doesn't have to be perfect, means it doesn't have to have 360 deg hand tracking, it doesn't have to have 5 hours battery life, it doesn't have to have more than, say, 110 deg FOV, it doesn't have to do mixed reality even though there were some indications that it was a possibility.

    I could probably list a lot more things that it doesn't have to be. But I'm definitely not saying anything about less power than we hoped. Different people have different hopes and even though we know what processing power it'll have, there will still be some people who expect too much.

    But it's a standalone with a limit on price. It is what it is. And I'm sure the vast majority of the public will judge it fairly.... and get a shed load of fun out of it.
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  • ZenbaneZenbane Posts: 13,285 Valuable Player
    edited February 8
    I'm not sure what code phrases people use but I'll try to be clear with my interpretation...
    It doesn't have to be perfect

    All versions of VR deal with "it doesn't have to be perfect" acceptance:
    1. HTC Vive Pro has better visuals on the market, but still uses bulky Wands (inferior hand controllers).
    2. WMR has better controllers than the Vive and cheaper entry level price for PCVR, but tracking is worse than Rift/Vive.
    3. Rift has the best controllers but God Rays and Screen Door are worse than WMR and Vive.
    4. Mobile VR is affordable, but lesser quality immersion and 360.
    5. Console VR has great exclusives (e.g. Resident Evil) but is inferior to 360 room-scale, and has inferior hand controllers (glowsticks).
    6. Location-based VR (e.g. arcades, theme parks) either have the bottom end of VR (Mobile VR headsets) or low-end experiences (cookie-cutter custom games) or deal with hardware/software issues (e.g. The Void has tracking problems, such as "bending" of assets and "accuracy"). The best versions of location-based VR is when they mimic Home-based PCVR (e.g. setting up Rifts/Vives to play Beat Saber). But this entails "not perfect" scenarios described above.

    As of 2019, there is no "perfect" VR experience to be had by anyone. Everyone makes a compromise, and everyone makes an excuse/sacrifice for their VR of choice.
    :)
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  • snowdogsnowdog Posts: 6,079 Valuable Player
    snowdog said:
    RedRizla said:
    snowdog said:
    Well I've calmed down a little now lol 

    I guess we'll have to wait and see what the 360 tracking is like before I pass judgement.

    But if it doesn't have a better FOV than the current Rift I'm still going to look elsewhere I think, either a Pimax or a Valve headset. I'm hoping that @Shadowmask72's Pimax headset is going to be decent otherwise I'll probably have to do the unthinkable and give Valve some of my money. And that thought HORRIFIES me :o

    Just don't come back here saying how great Valve is if you do decide to jump ship :D

    Vive pro with wireless is a very good headset.  Their inability to release anything better than their pathetic wands makes it meaningless to someone who has used the Touch controllers though.

    It WOULD be a very good headset if they had a) been bothered to change the crappy lenses and b) you didn't need to take out a second mortgage to buy one.

    A headset that costs over a grand to buy SHOULDN'T need you to mod with GearVR lenses.

    It's a bit of a shite headset if you REALLY start to think about it.

    Nope, it's just a very good headset.

    Price is irrelevant to how good a headset is, it is only a barrier to whether we can have it or not.  It's still a very good headset even if it is sitting on the shelf at the store.

    If it was a very good headset you wouldn't need to get a GearVR, take the lenses out of it, take the lenses out of your Vive Pro and bung the GearVR lenses in the bloody thing. It WOULD have been a very good headset if they hadn't cut costs by using the same crappy lenses that the Vive has.
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  • ZenbaneZenbane Posts: 13,285 Valuable Player
    edited February 8
    snowdog said:
    If it was a very good headset you wouldn't need to get a GearVR, take the lenses out of it, take the lenses out of your Vive Pro and bung the GearVR lenses in the bloody thing. It WOULD have been a very good headset if they hadn't cut costs by using the same crappy lenses that the Vive has.
    That doesn't make any sense. You don't "need" to Mod it. People just recommend it because it's possible and has some benefits. The Oculus GO is a "very good headset" yet it can be modded to use hand controllers and 6dof. You don't need to, but you can choose it. Whether you do or not, it is still a very good Mobile VR headset based on what is currently available on the MobileVR Market.

    There is no logical correlation with "very good" and "you don't need to Mod it." Do you have any luxury vehicle dealers where you live? Go check out a "very good" vehicle and then ask them what "custom modifications" are available. lol

    I mean wtf... SkyrimVR is very good but it is highly recommended that people Mod the hell out if, right?

    When you swamp out the lenses in the Vive Pro it goes from being a "very good headset" to "an even better headset."

    Lastly, there is such a thing as "patents" and "intellectual property" laws in the world, so it's not like Valve or HTC could have just copied GearVR's lenses! Think, bro!
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  • DaftnDirectDaftnDirect Posts: 4,484 Valuable Player
    edited February 8
    Zenbane said:

    All versions of VR deal with "it doesn't have to be perfect" acceptance:
    1. HTC Vive Pro has better visuals on the market, but still uses bulky Wands (inferior hand controllers).
    2. WMR has better controllers than the Vive and cheaper entry level price for PCVR, but tracking is worse than Rift/Vive.
    3. Rift has the best controllers but God Rays and Screen Door are worse than WMR and Vive.
    4. Mobile VR is affordable, but lesser quality immersion and 360.
    5. Console VR has great exclusives (e.g. Resident Evil) but is inferior to 360 room-scale, and has inferior hand controllers (glowsticks).
    6. Location-based VR (e.g. arcades, theme parks) either have the bottom end of VR (Mobile VR headsets) or low-end experiences (cookie-cutter custom games) or deal with hardware/software issues (e.g. The Void has tracking problems, such as "bending" of assets and "accuracy"). The best versions of location-based VR is when they mimic Home-based PCVR (e.g. setting up Rifts/Vives to play Beat Saber). But this entails "not perfect" scenarios described above.

    As of 2019, there is no "perfect" VR experience to be had by anyone. Everyone makes a compromise, and everyone makes an excuse/sacrifice for their VR of choice.
    :)
    Very true.

    All aspects of personal relationships too. The best relationships happen when we understand each others limits, enjoy each others talents and strengths and each others imperfections.

    Here endeth the lesson.


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  • ZenbaneZenbane Posts: 13,285 Valuable Player
    All aspects of personal relationships too. The best relationships happen when we understand each others limits, enjoy each others talents and strengths and each others imperfections.

    Well said, sir! That deserves a cat meme,



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  • Hiro_Protag0nistHiro_Protag0nist Posts: 4,628 Valuable Player
    Zenbane said:

    All versions of VR deal with "it doesn't have to be perfect" acceptance:
    1. HTC Vive Pro has better visuals on the market, but still uses bulky Wands (inferior hand controllers).
    2. WMR has better controllers than the Vive and cheaper entry level price for PCVR, but tracking is worse than Rift/Vive.
    3. Rift has the best controllers but God Rays and Screen Door are worse than WMR and Vive.
    4. Mobile VR is affordable, but lesser quality immersion and 360.
    5. Console VR has great exclusives (e.g. Resident Evil) but is inferior to 360 room-scale, and has inferior hand controllers (glowsticks).
    6. Location-based VR (e.g. arcades, theme parks) either have the bottom end of VR (Mobile VR headsets) or low-end experiences (cookie-cutter custom games) or deal with hardware/software issues (e.g. The Void has tracking problems, such as "bending" of assets and "accuracy"). The best versions of location-based VR is when they mimic Home-based PCVR (e.g. setting up Rifts/Vives to play Beat Saber). But this entails "not perfect" scenarios described above.

    As of 2019, there is no "perfect" VR experience to be had by anyone. Everyone makes a compromise, and everyone makes an excuse/sacrifice for their VR of choice.
    :)
    Very true.

    All aspects of personal relationships too. The best relationships happen when we understand each others limits, enjoy each others talents and strengths and each others imperfections.

    Here endeth the lesson.



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  • DaftnDirectDaftnDirect Posts: 4,484 Valuable Player
    that's cos I'm sober... you just haven't seen me like that before
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  • ZenbaneZenbane Posts: 13,285 Valuable Player
    btw,

    I haven't made my public review yet, but I did recently try the Vive Pro on a VR Arcade attraction. While the attraction was incredibly lackluster, the Vive Pro's visual improvements over the Rift were instantly noticeable. I still prefer my Rift CV1 (comfort and sleekness are better than the Vive Pro), but there's no denying the overall image quality improvement that the Vive Pro maintains.

    It is a very good headset without needing to Mod the lenses.
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  • RedRizlaRedRizla Posts: 5,518 Valuable Player
    edited February 8
    Does anyone know what the battery life is on the Oculus Quest yet? I get that Oculus Go is a 2 hour battery life because it's geared more towards media. But if Quest is going to be used for gaming, I'm hoping for about 3 hours from the battery. It's a shame it won't have a battery that you can swap out while one is charging.
  • ZenbaneZenbane Posts: 13,285 Valuable Player
    edited February 8
    RedRizla said:
    Does anyone know what the battery life is on the Oculus Quest yet? I get that Oculus Go is a 2 hour battery life because it geared more towards media. But if Quest is going to be used for gaming, I'm hoping for about 3 hours from the battery. It's a shame it won't have a battery that you can swap out while one is charging.

    As of January, the battery life is still a Mystery:

    With GO, Facebook-Oculus was "experimenting" and didn't expect it to sell so well (see Carmack's presentation at OC5). They were intentionally testing the waters in the industry, and a damn tidal wave slapped 'em across the face.

    With Quest though, they have no excuses. So they best get that battery life shenanigans in order! If someone wants to binge through all 3 Vader Immortal episodes in one sitting, then that best be possible.

    Granted, Quest is being demo'd for "sport game" events. So we can all confidently anticipate a long battery life to accommodate large arena sized VR sporting events. I would estimate at least 4-6 hours on the low end.

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  • Techy111Techy111 Posts: 5,302 Volunteer Moderator
    edited February 8
    Oculus has said it is in line with the (batt life) Go headset, meaning that it should be around 2 or 3 hours. Charging is via USB-C

    https://www.pocket-lint.com/ar-vr/reviews/oculus-rift/146720-oculus-quest-review

    Who knows LOL
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  • ZenbaneZenbane Posts: 13,285 Valuable Player
    edited February 8
    Techy111 said:
    Oculus has said it is in line with the (batt life) Go headset, meaning that it should be around 2 or 3 hours. Charging is via USB-C

    https://www.pocket-lint.com/ar-vr/reviews/oculus-rift/146720-oculus-quest-review

    Who knows LOL

    Oh man. 2-3 hours is pants!

    Screw this, I'm jumping ship!
    :p


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  • RedRizlaRedRizla Posts: 5,518 Valuable Player
    Techy111 said:
    Oculus has said it is in line with the (batt life) Go headset, meaning that it should be around 2 or 3 hours. Charging is via USB-C

    https://www.pocket-lint.com/ar-vr/reviews/oculus-rift/146720-oculus-quest-review

    Who knows LOL

    Hmm - I was hoping for more then 3 hours, but I damn hope it's no less then 3 hours. I would say anywhere between 4-6 hours would have been great.
  • ZenbaneZenbane Posts: 13,285 Valuable Player
    edited February 8
    MowTin said:
    Zenbane said:
    btw,

    I haven't made my public review yet, but I did recently try the Vive Pro on a VR Arcade attraction. While the attraction was incredibly lackluster, the Vive Pro's visual improvements over the Rift were instantly noticeable. I still prefer my Rift CV1 (comfort and sleekness are better than the Vive Pro), but there's no denying the overall image quality improvement that the Vive Pro maintains.

    It is a very good headset without needing to Mod the lenses.
    Wow, I'm surprised to hear you say that. You don't sound like an Oculus fanboy. ;)


    Well I still wouldn't buy it because the comfort level is arse compared to Rift, plus I aint gripping any bulky shafts. But when screens are improved, it's hard to deny!
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  • ZenbaneZenbane Posts: 13,285 Valuable Player
    edited February 8
    In the spirit of a thread that is all about treating rumors as facts...

    Oculus Quest Dev Settings Suggest Full Cross-Buy With Oculus Go



    Thankfully, the Oculus Platform SDK settings list Quest under the same app ID field as Go and Gear VR. The app ID uniquely identifies each Oculus Store listing, so having the same ID almost certainly means they have the same store page. This would mean full cross-buy, no developer approval needed.



    And if this happens, we can all be thankful since this means that Oculus Developers will NOT be jumping ship!
    :*
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  • LZoltowskiLZoltowski Posts: 6,705 Volunteer Moderator
    edited February 8
    Quest will launch on or after 06/19/2019 (edit GO FCC was embargoed until 06/19/2019, but came out in MAY, so I guess MAY?)

    FCC Request was filed 21/12/2019

    I don't see any other model's filed yet so the Rift-S could be a while off.


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  • ZenbaneZenbane Posts: 13,285 Valuable Player
    Quest will launch on or after 06/19/2019

    Oh great, now everyone gets to fight (again) over:
    1. Early in the Year
    2. Mid Year

    FML
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  • snowdogsnowdog Posts: 6,079 Valuable Player
    I thought it was supposed to be released in Spring? That's the Summer!
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  • LZoltowskiLZoltowski Posts: 6,705 Volunteer Moderator
    Zenbane said:
    Quest will launch on or after 06/19/2019

    Oh great, now everyone gets to fight (again) over:
    1. Early in the Year
    2. Mid Year

    FML
    That's only when the FCC confidentiality embargo is lifted, 

    GO was launched in May, it's FCC docs were lifted on 06/19/2018

    So Quest will probably Launch in MAY ... I guess?
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  • LZoltowskiLZoltowski Posts: 6,705 Volunteer Moderator
    I adjusted my post :)
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  • pyroth309pyroth309 Posts: 980
    3Jane
    edited February 8
    Zenbane said:
    btw,

    I haven't made my public review yet, but I did recently try the Vive Pro on a VR Arcade attraction. While the attraction was incredibly lackluster, the Vive Pro's visual improvements over the Rift were instantly noticeable. I still prefer my Rift CV1 (comfort and sleekness are better than the Vive Pro), but there's no denying the overall image quality improvement that the Vive Pro maintains.

    It is a very good headset without needing to Mod the lenses.
    The Vive Pro would have been an amazing offering if they had set the price point to something reasonable. 800 or so for the bundle would have been a good enough upgrade to make most fence sitters jump on it. But at 1400 for the bundle (Still lol) for the small upgrade it is over Rift....Just no lol.

    The Odyssey+ image is also better to me in games where it works well (especially in movies), but the Rift is just overall better when you factor in everything it gives you at that price point.

    I don't mind spending 1400 on a headset if I feel like what I'm getting is worth the premium. The Vive Pro always felt like a rip off to me which Is why I never sprung for it. But I know it's not meant to be a consumer headset..it just should have been. 
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