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The Index thread (please keep to subject)

Techy111
MVP
MVP
As per the title, please respect the users who post here and keep it on topic, any nonsense and......grrr
A PC with lots of gadgets inside and a thing to see in 3D that you put on your head.

2,973 REPLIES 2,973

RedRizla
Honored Visionary

Techy111 said:

What's the res like ? Good earphones ? I may order one !!!!



Just depends on the resolution of your mobile phone. Google cardboard is rather uncomfortable on your face though and I don't think VR Cover has anything planned for Google cardboard. 😛

Anonymous
Not applicable


Such a shame when you think of the Oculus that showed us the half dome. 



We'll see the Half Dome being the CV2 in 2022 for $599. A three year lifespan for their PC VR headsets and hardware filtering up and down between their different ranges of headsets.

I think Rubin saying (reading between the lines) that the CV2/Half Dome would have cost $2000 was a bit of hyperbole to make a point but I'm 100% certain that the original plan was to release the CV2 this year instead of the Rift S and it would have been $999 or so. I've said from when the Half Dome was first shown that we were unlikely to see the CV2 having the varifocal feature and I still think that's going to be the case. We'll see the CV2 being released in 2022 for $599 (because that's the sweet spot for enthusiasts) and then the Rift S in 2025 for $399. They will ALWAYS need an enthusiast PC VR headset because we're happy to pay more than $399 for new and improved tech...but $999 is too much of an ask from the vast majority of us unless we see value in that outlay. Valve will find out that once the Index has been out for a few months when their sales start to dry up.

$599 is the real sweet spot for a high end headset, we've seen that with sales of both the Rift and Vive when they went down to that price. The Index will be the same, but if they hadn't been a greedy bunch of greedy price gouging wankers and sold the thing for a couple of hundred dollars/pounds cheaper they wouldn't be able to make the things fast enough. I would have ordered one as soon as preorders started if they launched at £719.

One concern I have with the Index is Valve dropping the thing altogether when sales start to cool off. They don't have a great track record when it comes to hardware manufacturing and sales. I do have concerns about Valve not choosing retail partners the same way that both Oculus and HTC have done so it's going to have a disadvantage in terms of sales compared to other headsets just because of that. You can't nip out to Best Buy or Currys or Argos and pick one up, you're forced to go through Steam to buy the thing. You're going to have a good few sales of the thing for the first few months, the launch and the launch window, but after that things will slowly start to grind to a halt.

And if developers decide to support the new controllers for anything apart from waggling fingers (which I personally doubt, they'll just use the same in game use of the pointing fingers and thumbs up for anything single player) how long will they do this for if sales start to dry up?

Anonymous
Not applicable
There will be no Half Dome.
Unless and until such a time as Oculus deems PC-VR a viable market for them again. Nothing they are saying currently even hints at that.

The only reason we got a Rift S was all the public outcry especially after other PC-VR announcements from other companies, and them making an agreement with Lenovo to try and pacify the Oculus PC-VR enthusiasts. 
Which partnering with Lenovo may turn out to be not such a smart move.

Anyway back to topic as we were asked to keep to - I am looking forward to hearing reports from folks once they get their Indexes and how it performs and looks especially in flight sims.


Luciferous
Consultant
So @Techy11 where next, Index, Pimax, Vive Eye thingy or Varjo? Your options are diminishing in the higher end?

@snowdog Maybe by 2022 it would have reached a cross the board quality in most Headsets that is good enough not to notice discomfort, tracking, FOV, resolution, clarity, screen door, god rays etc. After all, I don't own a 4K monitor, things just need to get to an acceptable level that does not distract you from the games.

I am more confident Valve will support PC VR than Oculus will in the future. It is clear from all recent evidence (even how little Rubin dedicated to PC VR in that last article)  that PC VR is no longer their main focus.


kevinw729
Honored Visionary
Well I have seen on this forum the CV2 moved from 2019, 2020, 2021 and now 2022 for $599!

I look forward to seeing what the consumer HMD market of 2022 would look like - that would be a market that has had Index, Cosmos, Samsung, HP, Varjo, Pimax and others for over two-years! Some how the Half-Dome may not be as cutting edge at that point as you imagine - especially considering what would be waiting in the wings from lessons learned during that period. Also many of the dev team that originated the Half-Dome demonstrator have left  - so would this be a Lenovo partnered CV2 in 2022?

I try and deal with the cards we are dealt now! rather than wild guesses on hardware that may or may not be in a direction that the current executive team of the company feels is important to achieving their mass adoption goal. Sorry, but this is IMHO . 
https://vrawards.aixr.org/ "The Out-of-Home Immersive Entertainment Frontier: Expanding Interactive Boundaries in Leisure Facilities" https://www.amazon.co.uk/Out-Home-Immersive-Entertainment-Frontier/dp/1472426959

Anonymous
Not applicable

kevinw729 said:

Well I have seen on this forum the CV2 moved from 2019, 2020, 2021 and now 2022 for $599!

I look forward to seeing what the consumer HMD market of 2022 would look like - that would be a market that has had Index, Cosmos, Samsung, HP, Varjo, Pimax and others for over two-years! Some how the Half-Dome may not be as cutting edge at that point as you imagine - especially considering what would be waiting in the wings from lessons learned during that period. Also many of the dev team that originated the Half-Dome demonstrator have left  - so would this be a Lenovo partnered CV2 in 2022?

I try and deal with the cards we are dealt now! rather than wild guesses on hardware that may or may not be in a direction that the current executive team of the company feels is important to achieving their mass adoption goal. Sorry, but this is IMHO . 



We'll see the 4K headset that Abrash has mentioned for the last couple of years at the last two Oculus Connect keynotes. 4K displays, 140 degree FOV and all in the same form factor that that Rift and Rift S has. I don't think we'll see the varifocal feature though because it'll be too expensive for a $599 (CV2) and $399 (CV2 S) headset.

BOE have had headset sized 4K LCD displays available for the last 2 years so the technology is there right now, and they also do curved displays too which would fit in with the patent that Oculus had granted a few years ago as well.

kevinw729
Honored Visionary

snowdog said:
......
We'll see the 4K headset that Abrash has mentioned for the last couple of years at the last two Oculus Connect keynotes. 4K displays, 140 degree FOV and all in the same form factor that that Rift and Rift S has. I don't think we'll see the varifocal feature though because it'll be too expensive for a $599 (CV2) and $399 (CV2 S) headset.

BOE have had headset sized 4K LCD displays available for the last 2 years so the technology is there right now, and they also do curved displays too which would fit in with the patent that Oculus had granted a few years ago as well.



Agreed - you are not saying anything we have not discussed before, and I appreciate that. 

Fundamentally, the consumer sector is learning what we in Enterprise have been saying - the market for high-end PC based headsets with the latest bells and whistles is achievable but at high prices - in the interview, he says in the $2,000 range, I say higher. And though OculusVR is now realising they should focus on mobileVR to achieve their new goal - the rest of us that need to be "wow VR" rather than "just good enough", are looking at the next developments - such as Varjo and the others. That Valve wants to play in the high-end PC VR scene is great, and the Index looks sold as a Vive 2.0. If OculusVR will want to play some time down the road with a $599 CV2 system for 2022... I am so not sure. This may have to be a partnership thing for the company, from this point on. 

I envisage a Quest2 in 2020 < 2021 that will have many features that current high end will have but in a package that mainstream will come to recognise - leaving the innovation of high-end to Enterprise, as with the amazing VRgineers systems, and the new prototype from StarLight.  


https://vrawards.aixr.org/ "The Out-of-Home Immersive Entertainment Frontier: Expanding Interactive Boundaries in Leisure Facilities" https://www.amazon.co.uk/Out-Home-Immersive-Entertainment-Frontier/dp/1472426959

RuneSR2
Grand Champion
Half Dome was nice - no doubt Oculus could take the PCVR throne if they really wanted to - but I guess Index currently is the next best thing...

https://youtu.be/WoQHOx6XS-E

Oculus Rift CV1, Valve Index & PSVR2, Asus Strix OC RTX™ 3090, i9-10900K (5.3Ghz), 32GB 3200MHz, 16TB SSD
"Ask not what VR can do for you, but what you can do for VR"

RuneSR2
Grand Champion
What I want is this one, including the grenade launcher  <3, and I know Oculus can make it:

al42kelo5h1x.jpg
But they only want to sell me this one, sigh  :'(  

g1unmpsfctsg.jpg

Oculus Rift CV1, Valve Index & PSVR2, Asus Strix OC RTX™ 3090, i9-10900K (5.3Ghz), 32GB 3200MHz, 16TB SSD
"Ask not what VR can do for you, but what you can do for VR"

RuneSR2
Grand Champion
Although the evidence is circumstantial, maybe the plot just thickened... Hmmmm.... HLVR?

https://youtu.be/6oBUpW8CVb0

Oculus Rift CV1, Valve Index & PSVR2, Asus Strix OC RTX™ 3090, i9-10900K (5.3Ghz), 32GB 3200MHz, 16TB SSD
"Ask not what VR can do for you, but what you can do for VR"