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Rumors Persist of MS / Rift-S Announcement at OC6

kevinw729kevinw729 Posts: 5,907 Valuable Player
in General
It was hinted at during E3 2019 but never materialised - now other sites seem to be running the story that the new Microsoft Xbone (Project Scarlett) will be able to support the Rift-S. 

 "The Redmond-based company revealed a sneak peek of its next-gen console codename ‘Project Scarlett’. This week a rumour has surfaced that the console will supposedly support the Oculus Rift S."

https://www.vrfocus.com/2019/06/latest-xbox-scarlett-rumour-is-itll-support-oculus-rift-s/

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  • Shadowmask72Shadowmask72 Posts: 4,407 Valuable Player
    edited June 2019
    Ahh the long-awaited Oculus/Microsoft partnership that has been brooding for how many years now?


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  • nalex66nalex66 Posts: 6,360 Volunteer Moderator
    I find it hard to believe. If MS was going to integrate VR into the next Xbox, why Rift rather than the multitude of cheaper WMR handsets that run on their own SDK?

    If they did dive into VR, they could give Kinect a whole new life as a supplement to WMR’s lousy tracking. 
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  • kevinw729kevinw729 Posts: 5,907 Valuable Player
    I agree @nalex66 - we have been hearing rumors that have failed to materalize since the parting-of-ways over the GamePads for the original CV1. Many have tried to claim that the two parties "had something big planned" and we saw how that panned out for the XBoneX!

    I wondered if this would create such a rift in the WindowsMR cabal that it would implode - and that kinda could explain the recent dropping of the majority of WinMR headsets off the MS store.  But obviously a Samsung or even HP WinMR supported headset would be a easier political sell than Oculus (and offers a Asian sales slant)?

    An important aspect of this rumor - is that it is "make or break" on a number of sources credibility. If OC6 passes, and no reveal of a MS announcement and a lot of peoples credibility will be burned from the VR community. Its a shakeup that has been needed as their is a large "emotionally invested" group feeding the grapevine that need to move on.


  • snowdogsnowdog Posts: 8,112 Valuable Player
    Why on earth would Microsoft do this when they already have WVR devices for the job?

    If they do have VR headset support for the NextBox it won't have anything to do with Oculus unless OpenXR is released.
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  • kojackkojack Posts: 7,199 Volunteer Moderator
    snowdog said:
    Why on earth would Microsoft do this when they already have WVR devices for the job?

    If they do have VR headset support for the NextBox it won't have anything to do with Oculus unless OpenXR is released.
    Well, the Rift-S is kind of a WMR headset on steroids without the WMR software, and Lenovo is a Microsoft WMR partner.
    Here's a crazy thought... the Go existed as both an Oculus headset in most of the world and a Xiaomi headset in china. Maybe there will be a Rift-S without the Oculus software that is branded as a Lenovo WMR headset, and that's what will run on the Scarlett.
    Probably not though.
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  • ShocksVRShocksVR Posts: 574
    Neo
    That would be the only thing that would make me buy a Xbox Scarlett. 
    I already own a PS4 and PSVR. With PS5 already confirmed to support the PSVR, that was going to be my next gen console.  But if Scarlett supports the Rift S then I'll probably go that way.

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  • snowdogsnowdog Posts: 8,112 Valuable Player
    I won't buy a Microsoft console or any other console these days out of principle. I refuse to pay for online play.

    The only time I got my money's worth out of a Live subscription was when I saw the Curiosity landing on Mars live but I'm pretty sure I could have watched it elsewhere for free if I had made some effort to find it somewhere else.
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  • OmegaM4NOmegaM4N Posts: 1,144
    Wintermute
    edited June 2019
    snowdog said:
    Why on earth would Microsoft do this when they already have WVR devices for the job?

    If they do have VR headset support for the NextBox it won't have anything to do with Oculus unless OpenXR is released.
    Possibly MS wants Oculus to deal with all the hardware, MS lets Oculus make the S work with the next xbox, MS now have VR on the machine at a vastly cheaper solution than developing their own, Oculus get access to the console market, plus there could be more in it than just that, the supposed collaboration might also incorporate the work MS were doing on their own VR before the put it on hiatus, but come September we will know, but i for one would love VR on the next xbox, i would then ditch the PS4 Pro and PSVR in a heartbeat if you give me Forza in vr. ;)



  • kevinw729kevinw729 Posts: 5,907 Valuable Player
    OmegaM4N said:
    ....
    Possibly MS wants Oculus to deal with all the hardware, MS lets Oculus make the S work with the next xbox, MS now have VR on the machine at a vastly cheaper solution than developing their own, Oculus get access to the console market, plus there could be more in it than just that, the supposed collaboration might also incorporate the work MS were doing on their own VR before the put it on hiatus, but come September we will know, but i for one would love VR on the next xbox, i would then ditch the PS4 Pro and PSVR in a heartbeat if you give me Forza in vr. ;)
    ....

    Someone on another forum pointed out that most the PC specialist that would do this kind of thing are no longer retained by Oculus - a fact that most of the dev for the Rift-S was farmed out to Lenovo - so the reality of that does not look probable, unless it is as was said a Lenovo project wholly based on their WinMR background?


  • OmegaM4NOmegaM4N Posts: 1,144
    Wintermute
    ^^It is a possibility as i think the S would be perfect for the consoles as it is a massive step up from the PSVR external camera and horrible ancient move controllers, so i am all for this being true, you hear me Oculus, i will grab a S for the xbox ina  heartbeat thank you very much. lol
  • ZenbaneZenbane Posts: 16,876 Valuable Player
    edited June 2019
    Yep, I've been saying it since 2016: MS and Oculus are still partners. Example of one of my posts about this from 2017:

    The Microsoft/Facebook Partnership plays "Peek-A-Boo" (BladeRunner)
    https://forums.oculusvr.com/community/discussion/59010/the-microsoft-facebook-partnership-plays-peek-a-boo-bladerunner/p1

    But I seem to remember that someone kept telling me I was wrong, and that the partnership was over. Can't remember who that was exactly... hmmm...

    Anyway, glad to see the partnership finally blossoming in 2019.

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  • kevinw729kevinw729 Posts: 5,907 Valuable Player
    edited June 2019
    snowdog said:
    Why on earth would Microsoft do this when they already have WVR devices for the job?
    ....

    Yes, that is a good question - and kind leads to the feeling that this is hype powered rumor.

    A number of posters have tried to claim after the Gampad CV1 situation that Microsoft were still deeply partnered with Oculus, the hypetrain was at full steam over a claim that the XBoneX would have Oculus support - which never materialised. But in reality most of those at Oculus that managed links with MS have actually left and ended up at MS working on the initial WinMR initiative, in many cases. We were invited to a recent WindowsMR Enterprise conference (covered in VRFocus) and the number of ex-Oculus team members there was surprising.

    Move forward to today, and it seems that we are at a important cross roads - will these rumors be proven at OC6 with an announcement - or do we question the credibility of these sources?
  • pyroth309pyroth309 Posts: 2,526 Valuable Player
    edited June 2019
    Just hypothetically speaking, Rift-S being able to work with an Xbox would make a lot of sense for Oculus. It would further explain why the Rift-S was made as a budget offering and uses the same Halo as the PSVR and also why they were so adamant to keep the same performance of Rift by dropping the refresh rate with the the higher res.

    It would also make some sense for Microsoft because Oculus already has a lot of VR games created that they could tap into for the console users and it would further be evidence of them abandoning WMR. 

    I'll believe it when I see it, but crazier things have happened. 
  • OmegaM4NOmegaM4N Posts: 1,144
    Wintermute
    edited June 2019
    ^^It gets even better than that, MS have began to merged Xbox and PC gaming together, so unike the PSVR which is tethered to the PS4 only, the Rift S could be used on two formats, Xbox Scarlett and PC, so we might get to the stage were we have crossplay and crossbuy for VR stuff between the PC and xbox scarlett, as we have right now between the PC and the xbox one, so come 2020 you might be enjoying Forza 8 VR via your CV1, that you bought on PC but which also gives you a xbox digital copy, which your better half uses with the Rift S to run you off the road while laughing manically........talk about a win right there. lol
  • pyroth309pyroth309 Posts: 2,526 Valuable Player
    edited June 2019
    OmegaM4N said:
    ^^It gets even better than that, MS have begain to merged Xbox and PC gaming together, so unike the PSVR which is tethered to the PS4 only, the Rift S could be used on two formats, Xbox Scarlett and PC, so we might get to the stage were we have crossplay and buy for VR stuff between the PC and xbox scarlett, as we have right now between the PC and the xbox one, so come 2020 you might be enjoy Forza 8 on your PC on your CV1, while your better half runs you off the road while on the xbox scarlett via a Rift S....talk about a win right there. lol
    Yea I have been steering all of my die hard console peasant friends to the Xbox so I can play with them for this reason. Have played several games with Xbox users. Forza horizon 4 being one of em. 
  • Hiro_Protag0nistHiro_Protag0nist Posts: 5,008 Valuable Player
    Will make a great Christmas present - Xbox One-2 / Rift-S bundle.  I'll bet the Rift-S will be priced around £200 in that bundle.  Maybe the PS5 and Xbox One-2 will bring VR to the masses?

    Or maybe it will be the PS6    ;)
  • kevinw729kevinw729 Posts: 5,907 Valuable Player
    We see MS looking at a late launch for the new console [Image] - so that means a lot of time from here till Q4 2020 for development of VR exclusives if Oculus and MS partner. But in the same argument, Samsung and HTC have comparable platforms aimed for the same window. While Rift-S has launched now, the other alternatives are waiting in the wings, and in Cosmos, HTC have also partnered with the chip manufacturers that will be supporting the new MS platform. I agree if a headset is bundled with a new console - unlike an after thought for the PS4 this could be momentous for the consumer VR scene, though again - how many publishers would commit to support, or just make a "VR-level" to currently planed games is another issue. 




  • ZenbaneZenbane Posts: 16,876 Valuable Player
    edited June 2019
    OmegaM4N said:
    ^^It gets even better than that, MS have began to merged Xbox and PC gaming together, so unike the PSVR which is tethered to the PS4 only, the Rift S could be used on two formats, Xbox Scarlett and PC, so we might get to the stage were we have crossplay and crossbuy for VR stuff between the PC and xbox scarlett, as we have right now between the PC and the xbox one, so come 2020 you might be enjoying Forza 8 VR via your CV1, that you bought on PC but which also gives you a xbox digital copy, which your better half uses with the Rift S to run you off the road while laughing manically........talk about a win right there. lol

    Sounds like Oculus needs to sort out the Rift-S issues asap then. With the current problems, moving it to a second platform could do more harm than good. This is great news overall, and this partnership was obvious from Day 1 in 2016. Not just because of the XBox controller that shipped with the Rift CV1, but also because of the live streaming capability that integrated Rift CV1 with the XBox. There were so many signs of this partnership from the beginning, and were only confirmed each passing year with smaller projects.

    However, the Rift-S needs to get a better reputation before it tries to move in to the XBox market.
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  • snowdogsnowdog Posts: 8,112 Valuable Player
    kevinw729 said:
    We see MS looking at a late launch for the new console [Image] - so that means a lot of time from here till Q4 2020 for development of VR exclusives if Oculus and MS partner. But in the same argument, Samsung and HTC have comparable platforms aimed for the same window. While Rift-S has launched now, the other alternatives are waiting in the wings, and in Cosmos, HTC have also partnered with the chip manufacturers that will be supporting the new MS platform. I agree if a headset is bundled with a new console - unlike an after thought for the PS4 this could be momentous for the consumer VR scene, though again - how many publishers would commit to support, or just make a "VR-level" to currently planed games is another issue. 





    If this did happen I would expect Microsoft to do what console platform holders ALWAYS do and moneyhat some exclusives, and as those exclusives will also be available on the PC they'll get a few million potential customers for their PC Microsoft Store without needing to do anything at all.

    If they did that though I'm expecting them to include WVR headsets for definite and possibly the Vive and Index headsets being catered for too.

    It's going to be interesting to see what sort of price in the bundle the Rift S works out as. I reckon they're making $100 profit on each Rift S unit sold right now so in a year's time they might be able to make the things for $250 or even as low as $200.
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  • snowdogsnowdog Posts: 8,112 Valuable Player
    Zenbane said:
    OmegaM4N said:
    ^^It gets even better than that, MS have began to merged Xbox and PC gaming together, so unike the PSVR which is tethered to the PS4 only, the Rift S could be used on two formats, Xbox Scarlett and PC, so we might get to the stage were we have crossplay and crossbuy for VR stuff between the PC and xbox scarlett, as we have right now between the PC and the xbox one, so come 2020 you might be enjoying Forza 8 VR via your CV1, that you bought on PC but which also gives you a xbox digital copy, which your better half uses with the Rift S to run you off the road while laughing manically........talk about a win right there. lol

    Sounds like Oculus needs to sort out the Rift-S issues asap then. With the current problems, moving it to a second platform could do more harm than good. This is great news overall, and this partnership was obvious from Day 1 in 2016. Not just because of the XBox controller that shipped with the Rift CV1, but also because of the live streaming capability that integrated Rift CV1 with the XBox. There were so many signs of this partnership from the beginning, and were only confirmed each passing year with smaller projects.

    However, the Rift-S needs to get a better reputation before it tries to move in to the XBox market.

    They should manage to get the white flashes and black screens sorted out pretty soon I think. They've already improved the tracking close to the headset with 1.39 PTC.

    And they'll have the advantage in the hardware for each NextBox being identical too. The console isn't coming out until next year so there'll be plenty of time to boost the Rift S reputation.
    "This you have to understand. There's only one way to hurt a man who's lost everything. Give him back something broken."

    Thomas Covenant, Unbeliever
  • ZenbaneZenbane Posts: 16,876 Valuable Player
    snowdog said:
    And they'll have the advantage in the hardware for each NextBox being identical too. The console isn't coming out until next year so there'll be plenty of time to boost the Rift S reputation.

    The console may come out next year, but if they announce it too soon then they'll end up having to do "damage control" later on. The Rift-S reputation, as it stands now, isn't very good. They need to fix that before announcing, not after.

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  • kevinw729kevinw729 Posts: 5,907 Valuable Player
    snowdog said:
    ....
    It's going to be interesting to see what sort of price in the bundle the Rift S works out as. I reckon they're making $100 profit on each Rift S unit sold right now so in a year's time they might be able to make the things for $250 or even as low as $200.

    I think that is a good guesstimate on the margin on the Rift-S - not including obviously the take on QA and support that Lenovo will be taking, and how the long-leg roll out percentages are figured. The software update roll-out will impact the costs obviously as well as the returns. But I think this is far more healthier than CV1. 

    I wonder if a price drop come March 2020 would be in order to say $259? Or if there would be a plan in place to build a Rift-S+ that has the IPD, tracking and Halo strap issues addressed, and proper audio?
  • OmegaM4NOmegaM4N Posts: 1,144
    Wintermute
    Zenbane said:
    OmegaM4N said:
    ^^It gets even better than that, MS have began to merged Xbox and PC gaming together, so unike the PSVR which is tethered to the PS4 only, the Rift S could be used on two formats, Xbox Scarlett and PC, so we might get to the stage were we have crossplay and crossbuy for VR stuff between the PC and xbox scarlett, as we have right now between the PC and the xbox one, so come 2020 you might be enjoying Forza 8 VR via your CV1, that you bought on PC but which also gives you a xbox digital copy, which your better half uses with the Rift S to run you off the road while laughing manically........talk about a win right there. lol

    Sounds like Oculus needs to sort out the Rift-S issues asap then. With the current problems, moving it to a second platform could do more harm than good. This is great news overall, and this partnership was obvious from Day 1 in 2016. Not just because of the XBox controller that shipped with the Rift CV1, but also because of the live streaming capability that integrated Rift CV1 with the XBox. There were so many signs of this partnership from the beginning, and were only confirmed each passing year with smaller projects.

    However, the Rift-S needs to get a better reputation before it tries to move in to the XBox market.
    Yeap, but i have no doubt by the time the next xbox appears the S software will have matured, just like the CV1, i know personally since i moved from the "flip a coin if it works", DK2, to the "will it crash or have tracking issues", cv1 in 2017, the CV1 software has really come on, as we all know it was hit and miss back then, but now it is really has come on leaps and bounds, really am enjoying my CV1 today, so i am sure the S will only follow suit.

    Now if you will excuse me i have some annoying trolls to take of in Skyrim VR, and they won't catch me off guard looking over a cliff edge this time trying to stealth attack another troll from above, clever girls. lol
  • kevinw729kevinw729 Posts: 5,907 Valuable Player
    Though the issues with the Rift-S seem a little more than the original God-Ray, Colour, QA and bricking issues with the original Rift - I agree that intensive work by the Oculus and Lenovo team will push this to the background. The speed in-which the tracking update was released speaks to the focus the hardware is now getting. 

    I like the idea circulating that the "Next-Box" (copyright snowdog) could support all the native WinMR systems - so Samsung, HP, Acer and Lenovo would be able to have their headsets run on the console. Its just that the story has been sold as rumor of it being an Oculus exclusive.
  • OmegaM4NOmegaM4N Posts: 1,144
    Wintermute
    ^^I don't see why not, WMR HDMs are already supported nativley on W10, so if the S could run on the Next-Box(copyright Snow-Dog), then i don't see what would stop MS adding the same native support to said NX OS, i certainly won't say no to said feature. :)
  • ZenbaneZenbane Posts: 16,876 Valuable Player

    Based on reports after the recent Rift-S patch, it looks like you both were right! As long as Oculus keeps this momentum up, the Rift-S and XBox integration news will go off splendidly. It will be nice to see a 3-year partnership go up a notch!
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  • Comic_Book_GuyComic_Book_Guy Posts: 1,212
    3Jane
    snowdog said:
    Why on earth would Microsoft do this when they already have WVR devices for the job?

    If they do have VR headset support for the NextBox it won't have anything to do with Oculus unless OpenXR is released.
    But WMR sucks?
  • NacaryusNacaryus Posts: 228
    Nexus 6
    it will definitely good for rift owners, means more polished games will be made 
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