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Is Sony Really Releasing a PSVR2?

kevinw729kevinw729 Posts: 5,243 Valuable Player
Here is an interesting article that kinda underlines my previous points about the unlikelihood of a PSVR2 with the launch of the PS5 later next year.
But also reveals that the reality of a PSVR2 is not dead - but is still not 100% confirmed:

https://www.expertreviews.co.uk/headsets/1409379/psvr-2-release-date-sony-playstation-vr

The reality is, that though Sony has invested heavily in their PSVR, and seen an amazing 6M+ deployment (real sales rather than contracts), there is still a feeling internally at SCE that failing to achieve the EyeToy 10M+ (which was seen as sub-par) that their VR excursion has not been as profitable as hoped. 

We will be learning in a matter of days if the speculation of a partnership with Microsoft and OculusVR is equally a real deal or hyperbole from the emotionally invested - and if again the console sector is taking a much more pragmatic view of VR association. 
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** Second New Book **
"The Out-of-Home Immersive Entertainment Frontier: Expanding Interactive Boundaries in Leisure Facilities"
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Comments

  • SkScotcheggSkScotchegg Posts: 1,328
    Project 2501
    edited August 2019
    Cool, I didn't know about any of this.

    Well, I just hope these companies treat VR differently to other products. Because common sense says VR needs more time to mature overall. But there must be thousands of companies and billions invested in VR now, VR is still the future for so many industries.

    I hope Sony see's this and realises the potential.

    They should do more surveys and ask people what they want. For example, have you ever asked anybody what they want from VR? Or even asked yourself?

    I asked myself this question and this is what I want:

    • VR Games (I want to play amazing AAA games such as Half Life, Assasins Creed, Metro Exodus, Doom Eternal etc)
    • VR Telephone calls (even if my family dont have VR it would be cool if they could see me in VR on their phone/ipad)
    • VR Holiday Tours (imagine someone having a camera attached to their head or body and going through a rain forrest and communicating with you live and you been able to ask questions like - What does that painting mean inside that pyramid?)
    • VR Live Sports (I want to be able to watch UFC and Boxing live in VR with amazing camera views close to the ring/Octagon)
    • VR Cinema (I want to buy tickets for latest films and watch them on release day at home in a VR cinema)

    I hope all these things come true but most of all VR live sports and cinema tickets are my no.1 most wanted.

    Do you guys think these things will happen?

    Oh and I hope Sony does release PSVR2 and I would buy it also with PS5 :)
    UK: England - Leeds - - RTX 2080 - Rift CV1 & Rift S - Make love, not war - See you in the Oasis!
  • RedRizlaRedRizla Posts: 7,173 Valuable Player
    There's only one thing holding VR back right now and it's resolution. Once eye tracking is introduced it will appeal to a lot more people because we will be able to have 1080p monitor resolutions.
  • kevinw729kevinw729 Posts: 5,243 Valuable Player
    That's funny @RedRizla - I see the things holding back consumer VR as:

    - Resolution
    - Tracking
    - Processor power
    - AAA content
    - Cooperative Play

    One of the reasons I think the Standalone battle ground is separated between 5G systems using existing cable-free high-end PC VR, and the hope that mobile VR can be boosted to achieve suitable performance. 

    In not being part of the 5G alliance, its understandable why Facebook would spend its time on Standalone, and negate PC high-end to Lenovo.

    In to the middle of this ground is the unknown of console - and that may explain why the PSVR2 patent mock-up looked more like a connected (5G) system with high-end PC elements (halo strap, special visor), than just a up-scaled PSVR.



    urdgfqqehbbb.png
    ** Second New Book **
    "The Out-of-Home Immersive Entertainment Frontier: Expanding Interactive Boundaries in Leisure Facilities"
    https://www.amazon.co.uk/Out-Home-Immersive-Entertainment-Frontier/dp/1472426959
  • RuneSR2RuneSR2 Posts: 5,614 Valuable Player
    edited August 2019
    RedRizla said:
    There's only one thing holding VR back right now and it's resolution. Once eye tracking is introduced it will appeal to a lot more people because we will be able to have 1080p monitor resolutions.
    Not trying to be funny, but cranking up SteamVR to ss 200% on the Index and reviving Kin, it really felt much like 1080p monitor res, at least much better than 720p. The amount of detail was simply incredible, and fps were solid 90. Not sure I need much more. And fov was really big, and no SDE. It's a massive upgrade from the CV1. Sound was really clear too.

    Unfortunately I probably need a 4 times faster gpu to do the same in Lone Echo, maybe less if I don't need msaa...
    Intel i7 7700K (4.5 GHz); MSI GeForce GTX 1080 8GB Gaming X (oc 2100 MHz gpu boost, 11 GHz mem speed); 16GB Corsair Vengeance LPX DDR4 3200 MHz; MSI Z270I Gaming Pro Carbon AC (VR-Ready) mainboard; Samsung 960 Evo M.2 SSD + Toshiba P300 HD; Windows 10 OS; Valve Index and Oculus Rift CV1 - the latter nearly always using super sampling 2.0. 

    "Ask not what VR can do for you – ask what you can do for VR"
  • Techy111Techy111 Posts: 6,736 Volunteer Moderator
    I have a CV1, I have now tried a friends Index and I had a Reverb....Reverb wins on screen res easily. As for PSVR Gen 2 ? It'll be here 6 months after PS5, you'll see.
    A PC with lots of gadgets inside and a thing to see in 3D that you put on your head.

  • RuneSR2RuneSR2 Posts: 5,614 Valuable Player
    edited August 2019
    Techy111 said:
    I have a CV1, I have now tried a friends Index and I had a Reverb....Reverb wins on screen res easily. As for PSVR Gen 2 ? It'll be here 6 months after PS5, you'll see.
    Nice, did you try 120 hz and the fov? But 120 hz may result in more blurry image quality due to reduced ss depending on your friend's gpu. You can't beat the Reverb res, for some Reverb + Knuckles + base stations may be the optimal VR solution right now, and for sims you probably won't need the controllers.

    I do agree that for persons who just want to experience trouble-free VR, CV1 is still the best choice. Especially if you've never experienced better res and have no idea what you're missing.
    Intel i7 7700K (4.5 GHz); MSI GeForce GTX 1080 8GB Gaming X (oc 2100 MHz gpu boost, 11 GHz mem speed); 16GB Corsair Vengeance LPX DDR4 3200 MHz; MSI Z270I Gaming Pro Carbon AC (VR-Ready) mainboard; Samsung 960 Evo M.2 SSD + Toshiba P300 HD; Windows 10 OS; Valve Index and Oculus Rift CV1 - the latter nearly always using super sampling 2.0. 

    "Ask not what VR can do for you – ask what you can do for VR"
  • RedRizlaRedRizla Posts: 7,173 Valuable Player
    edited August 2019
    @kevinw729 - Won't eye tracking solve the Processor power problem? I also think VR has to look better and not just be immersive before it appeals to a lot more people. I spent years playing 2D games and wishing the graphics would get better, but I'm finally happy with how they look in 2D games today.
    Once VR gets to monitor resolutions like 1080p, then I'm sure it will takeoff. It only takes one game to look good and to feel apart of to move VR forward. I'm sure some people will have purchased VR just for No Mans Sky, but lets be honest it doesn't look good compared to the 2D game. When it does look as good as the 2D game in VR, what will people have to complain about then?
    Also when Consoles first started out they didn't have a vast amount of games. That just comes with time since AAA games take years to make.
  • Techy111Techy111 Posts: 6,736 Volunteer Moderator
    edited August 2019
    I got 4 hours solid tinkering with it mate and was super impressed. He has an uber PC like mine and we was cranking things up and up and up LOL really was enjoying it and still had 12 hours on my reservation....BUT...the god rays reared up and I had a little sigh. Then I contemplated what I would use it for. I am a true simmer (work for Flyinside) and I just wanted that better res. So I left it at that and the wait continues for the Reverb. Sorry for off topic, PSVR Gen 2 late 2020

    Use your Index thread @RuneSR2 or the Reverb thread and I can answer there ;)
    A PC with lots of gadgets inside and a thing to see in 3D that you put on your head.

  • RuneSR2RuneSR2 Posts: 5,614 Valuable Player
    My mistake, hadn't noticed this wasn't the Reverb thread :blush: Now back to PS5VR  o:)
    Intel i7 7700K (4.5 GHz); MSI GeForce GTX 1080 8GB Gaming X (oc 2100 MHz gpu boost, 11 GHz mem speed); 16GB Corsair Vengeance LPX DDR4 3200 MHz; MSI Z270I Gaming Pro Carbon AC (VR-Ready) mainboard; Samsung 960 Evo M.2 SSD + Toshiba P300 HD; Windows 10 OS; Valve Index and Oculus Rift CV1 - the latter nearly always using super sampling 2.0. 

    "Ask not what VR can do for you – ask what you can do for VR"
  • kevinw729kevinw729 Posts: 5,243 Valuable Player
    RedRizla said:
    @kevinw729 - Won't eye tracking solve the Processor power problem? I also think VR has to look better and not just be immersive before it appeals to a lot more people. 
    .....

    As a consultant I have to do feasibility studies and been doing a lot of research in near-term eye tracking. After seeing what StarVR and HTC achieved with their respective prototypes - I am not sure that ET will achieve as much as a leap in the near term as hoped. It is something to watch, bit for the consumer sector its still out of their pay grade. The situation with VARJO is a case in point that this is still a nascent tech. 
    urdgfqqehbbb.png
    ** Second New Book **
    "The Out-of-Home Immersive Entertainment Frontier: Expanding Interactive Boundaries in Leisure Facilities"
    https://www.amazon.co.uk/Out-Home-Immersive-Entertainment-Frontier/dp/1472426959
  • snowdogsnowdog Posts: 7,654 Valuable Player
    What do I want for VR? I want VR Porn where the view changes when you move your head. Oculus had a demo thing at OC4 if I remember correctly and if looked amazing (but not with a porn clip obviously lol).

    Plus Resident Evil 7 VR on the PC.


    "This you have to understand. There's only one way to hurt a man who's lost everything. Give him back something broken."

    Thomas Covenant, Unbeliever
  • kevinw729kevinw729 Posts: 5,243 Valuable Player
    snowdog said:
    .....
    Plus Resident Evil 7 VR on the PC.

    Dreams can come true  B)
    urdgfqqehbbb.png
    ** Second New Book **
    "The Out-of-Home Immersive Entertainment Frontier: Expanding Interactive Boundaries in Leisure Facilities"
    https://www.amazon.co.uk/Out-Home-Immersive-Entertainment-Frontier/dp/1472426959
  • snowdogsnowdog Posts: 7,654 Valuable Player
    Well I'm not going to hold my breath cos Capcom. :(
    "This you have to understand. There's only one way to hurt a man who's lost everything. Give him back something broken."

    Thomas Covenant, Unbeliever
  • kevinw729kevinw729 Posts: 5,243 Valuable Player
    snowdog said:
    Well I'm not going to hold my breath cos Capcom. :(

    Understand your scepticism on the Capcom front.
    But there are a lot of rumors swirling that Sony may relent and allow PC deployment of their VR titles.

    urdgfqqehbbb.png
    ** Second New Book **
    "The Out-of-Home Immersive Entertainment Frontier: Expanding Interactive Boundaries in Leisure Facilities"
    https://www.amazon.co.uk/Out-Home-Immersive-Entertainment-Frontier/dp/1472426959
  • RuneSR2RuneSR2 Posts: 5,614 Valuable Player
    kevinw729 said:
    snowdog said:
    Well I'm not going to hold my breath cos Capcom. :(

    Understand your scepticism on the Capcom front.
    But there are a lot of rumors swirling that Sony may relent and allow PC deployment of their VR titles.


    As Zuckerberg once stated, you may need about 10 mill users to make VR games and apps profitable. Combining PCVR and PSVR would be one method to achieve this number of users and may be a win-win for all. In fact that method is already used in games like Moss, Beat Saber, Trover and more - but it would be great with wider and more official Sony support. 
    Intel i7 7700K (4.5 GHz); MSI GeForce GTX 1080 8GB Gaming X (oc 2100 MHz gpu boost, 11 GHz mem speed); 16GB Corsair Vengeance LPX DDR4 3200 MHz; MSI Z270I Gaming Pro Carbon AC (VR-Ready) mainboard; Samsung 960 Evo M.2 SSD + Toshiba P300 HD; Windows 10 OS; Valve Index and Oculus Rift CV1 - the latter nearly always using super sampling 2.0. 

    "Ask not what VR can do for you – ask what you can do for VR"
  • kevinw729kevinw729 Posts: 5,243 Valuable Player
    edited August 2019
    Yes @RuneSR2 - MarkZ has kind of alluded to the possibility of achieving greater penetration though partnership. Though this has not worked out for their Oculus Go aspirations in China, I agree that we will be primed for an announcement of collaboration.

    I think once the realisation over the hype of a MS partnership settles, then a partnership with Sony could fill the void and deflect questions. 
    urdgfqqehbbb.png
    ** Second New Book **
    "The Out-of-Home Immersive Entertainment Frontier: Expanding Interactive Boundaries in Leisure Facilities"
    https://www.amazon.co.uk/Out-Home-Immersive-Entertainment-Frontier/dp/1472426959
  • snowdogsnowdog Posts: 7,654 Valuable Player
    kevinw729 said:
    snowdog said:
    Well I'm not going to hold my breath cos Capcom. :(

    Understand your scepticism on the Capcom front.
    But there are a lot of rumors swirling that Sony may relent and allow PC deployment of their VR titles.


    It isn't Sony's decision. The exclusivity deal was for one year only going by reports.
    "This you have to understand. There's only one way to hurt a man who's lost everything. Give him back something broken."

    Thomas Covenant, Unbeliever
  • OmegaM4NOmegaM4N Posts: 810
    3Jane
    PSVR is a very nice system for what the hmd costs and i will be there for the PSVR2 because i love the system for recliner VR.....BUT!, saying that, the rumour that the next Xbox might be compatible with some MS brand version of the S would put a fly in that ointment because if i had to pick between a PSVR and a Xbox Branded S it would be the Xbox S anyday of the week because Forza Vr is a win right there for me, imgaine flying around a Forza vr track or open world as in Forza Horizons in your 1940s Buick or 1950s Cortina or a 1970 MkII escort, Forza games have so much scope to be just outstanding in VR.
  • kevinw729kevinw729 Posts: 5,243 Valuable Player
    Agree @OmegaM4N - but that is a major "But"!
    The opportunity for a MS branded version of the Rift-S that would connect to "Project Scarlett" would be huge, but is also a big reach. And we have been handed hyperbole by the fan-base that this is a thing. If this is not at OC6, then I am sorry but we will have to call it.

    urdgfqqehbbb.png
    ** Second New Book **
    "The Out-of-Home Immersive Entertainment Frontier: Expanding Interactive Boundaries in Leisure Facilities"
    https://www.amazon.co.uk/Out-Home-Immersive-Entertainment-Frontier/dp/1472426959
  • OmegaM4NOmegaM4N Posts: 810
    3Jane
    edited August 2019
    ^^I can wait, i just got around this week to actually playing Forza Horizon 2 on the XBX as it has been sitting there for 4 years alongside F6,F7, FH3 and 4. :o

    24 hours in a day are no longer enough, can't we apply for at least 36 hour days. lol
  • jayhawkjayhawk Posts: 825
    3Jane
    of course they are releasing a PSVR2 duh dude.
  • kevinw729kevinw729 Posts: 5,243 Valuable Player
    edited August 2019
    jayhawk said:
    of course they are releasing a PSVR2 duh dude.

    Is that the same "...course they are going to release VR on Xbox..." comment - dude?  B)
    urdgfqqehbbb.png
    ** Second New Book **
    "The Out-of-Home Immersive Entertainment Frontier: Expanding Interactive Boundaries in Leisure Facilities"
    https://www.amazon.co.uk/Out-Home-Immersive-Entertainment-Frontier/dp/1472426959
  • bigmike20vtbigmike20vt Posts: 4,204 Valuable Player
    kevinw729 said:
    Yes @RuneSR2 - MarkZ has kind of alluded to the possibility of achieving greater penetration though partnership. Though this has not worked out for their Oculus Go aspirations in China, I agree that we will be primed for an announcement of collaboration.

    I think once the realisation over the hype of a MS partnership settles, then a partnership with Sony could fill the void and deflect questions. 
    For the sake of discussion IF I could pick an oculus partner between MS and Sony I would make it in a millisecond.
    Sony consistently licence some of the finest titles and they already have a library of exclusive decent titles.
    MS OTOH have nothing VR wise other than some small demos, and besides MS already have a VR Headset and so I think 1 way or another if MS chose to release Windows MR exclusive titles one way or another rift users would get to play them... This is not the case with Sony and PSVR exclusives.
    PS everything I have read has resi as a PSVR 12 month exclusive . It not coming out for pc now is not on Sony . I have not bought a capcom title since they essentially left pcvr users out in the cold
    Fiat Coupe, gone. 350Z gone. Dirty nappies, no sleep & practical transport incoming. Thank goodness for VR :)
  • kevinw729kevinw729 Posts: 5,243 Valuable Player
    edited August 2019
    Interesting @bigmike20vt - I agree, back in 2012/3 when the OculusVR kickstarter started using modified Sony HMZ headsets as demonstrators (image), I had always hoped that the discussions could have blossomed to a co-prosperity sphere. But obviously all negotiations with third parties like with Valve crashed and burned after the acquisition.

    One of the hopes now that Sony re-evaluates the prospects of VR investment is that a agreement or cooperation could be founded. Its interesting to remember the number of early departures from OculusVR that went to Sony (though many of them have since moved on again). Maybe now the reality of this aspect of the businesses sales potentials is understood not to be at the previously hyped level that all HMD developers could just sit down and play nice with a shared (open) community as was originally suggested?


    *Image of a Sony HMZ-T2 prototype (first with see-through tracking camera - 2012)


    urdgfqqehbbb.png
    ** Second New Book **
    "The Out-of-Home Immersive Entertainment Frontier: Expanding Interactive Boundaries in Leisure Facilities"
    https://www.amazon.co.uk/Out-Home-Immersive-Entertainment-Frontier/dp/1472426959
  • jayhawkjayhawk Posts: 825
    3Jane
    edited August 2019
    kevinw729 said:
    jayhawk said:
    of course they are releasing a PSVR2 duh dude.

    Is that the same "...course they are going to release VR on Xbox..." comment - dude?  B)
    No, it's the 'of course Sony will release a PSVR2' dude, and an 'MS may or may not release VR (for the 1st time) on Xbox', so ya, apples and oranges there Kevy.
  • kevinw729kevinw729 Posts: 5,243 Valuable Player
    Well jayhawky, I think treating assumptions as a definate will end badly for you. I know you have seen the patent filing from Sony for possible next gen PSVR, but remember how many patent filing they make that never see the light of day. And all those people that doubled down that the PS5 will "defiantly be released with a new PSVR" have suddenly gone silent when Sony confirmed they will not, and will just be making original PSVR compatible to run on the new console. Best to hold back on the hypetrain till we definitely know dude.  B)
    urdgfqqehbbb.png
    ** Second New Book **
    "The Out-of-Home Immersive Entertainment Frontier: Expanding Interactive Boundaries in Leisure Facilities"
    https://www.amazon.co.uk/Out-Home-Immersive-Entertainment-Frontier/dp/1472426959
  • RuneSR2RuneSR2 Posts: 5,614 Valuable Player
    kevinw729 said:
    Well jayhawky, I think treating assumptions as a definate will end badly for you. I know you have seen the patent filing from Sony for possible next gen PSVR, but remember how many patent filing they make that never see the light of day. And all those people that doubled down that the PS5 will "defiantly be released with a new PSVR" have suddenly gone silent when Sony confirmed they will not, and will just be making original PSVR compatible to run on the new console. Best to hold back on the hypetrain till we definitely know dude.  B)
    Even though we have both Index and Reverb it may be important to remember that the CV1 easily demands more power than even the 2080 Ti can deliver. Even disabling msaa completely and maxing out every other in-game setting, a 2080 Ti can't perform solid 90 fps in Lone Echo using the CV1. So 1st gen hmds easily can chew up a lot of gpu power, especially using high levels of ss.
    Making a new console and new hmd could make many psvr users feel left behind. Maybe it's not a bad idea to start with a new console and support the original hmd. If the ps5 gpu is 4-5 times faster than ps4, Sony could allow for high level of ss to make current psvr truly shine even using the old hmd - like ms allowed for higher res and fps for XBox One X when playing old games. Interesting how or if Sony will use the ps5 power to increase VR image quality - and 120 Hz in most games is another interesting possibility.
    Intel i7 7700K (4.5 GHz); MSI GeForce GTX 1080 8GB Gaming X (oc 2100 MHz gpu boost, 11 GHz mem speed); 16GB Corsair Vengeance LPX DDR4 3200 MHz; MSI Z270I Gaming Pro Carbon AC (VR-Ready) mainboard; Samsung 960 Evo M.2 SSD + Toshiba P300 HD; Windows 10 OS; Valve Index and Oculus Rift CV1 - the latter nearly always using super sampling 2.0. 

    "Ask not what VR can do for you – ask what you can do for VR"
  • jayhawkjayhawk Posts: 825
    3Jane
    kevinw729 said:
    Well jayhawky, I think treating assumptions as a definate will end badly for you.
    Well kevy, I think treating assumptions like they will DEFINITELY end badly for me is f' hilarious like your whole post.
  • kevinw729kevinw729 Posts: 5,243 Valuable Player
    RuneSR2 said:
    .....
    Even though we have both Index and Reverb it may be important to remember that the CV1 easily demands more power than even the 2080 Ti can deliver. Even disabling msaa completely and maxing out every other in-game setting, a 2080 Ti can't perform solid 90 fps in Lone Echo using the CV1. So 1st gen hmds easily can chew up a lot of gpu power, especially using high levels of ss.
    Making a new console and new hmd could make many psvr users feel left behind. Maybe it's not a bad idea to start with a new console and support the original hmd. If the ps5 gpu is 4-5 times faster than ps4, Sony could allow for high level of ss to make current psvr truly shine even using the old hmd - like ms allowed for higher res and fps for XBox One X when playing old games. Interesting how or if Sony will use the ps5 power to increase VR image quality - and 120 Hz in most games is another interesting possibility.

    Totally agree that the "gutts" under the hood for high-quality VR may not be in the relms even for the ninth generation console systems. This would be a difficult propitiation for some to swallow - and while the dependent on the PC master race stereotype may hold true in some respects - the need for mainstream adoption to address the short-fall in VR takeup against promised expectations would seem to need console addition.

    I think that many in the VR community may have missed how important it is to still have the perception of Microsoft supporting a console VR future. The fallout if the rumors are false about the next Xbox support VR from the box could seriously impact many aspirations. A factor why there has been so much hype to keep this prospect alive.   


    urdgfqqehbbb.png
    ** Second New Book **
    "The Out-of-Home Immersive Entertainment Frontier: Expanding Interactive Boundaries in Leisure Facilities"
    https://www.amazon.co.uk/Out-Home-Immersive-Entertainment-Frontier/dp/1472426959
  • MowTinMowTin Posts: 1,916 Valuable Player
    RuneSR2 said:

    Not trying to be funny, but cranking up SteamVR to ss 200% on the Index and reviving Kin, it really felt much like 1080p monitor res, at least much better than 720p. The amount of detail was simply incredible, and fps were solid 90. Not sure I need much more. And fov was really big, and no SDE. It's a massive upgrade from the CV1. Sound was really clear too.

    Unfortunately I probably need a 4 times faster gpu to do the same in Lone Echo, maybe less if I don't need msaa...

    What you need is a 2080ti.   B)

    But I agree with you that resolution is no longer an issue. The cost of the hardware to push those pixels is the biggest issue right now. And a lack of games when compared to regular games is the other big issue.

    It will be interesting to see how well the Quest does during Christmas. And if sidequest works, I don't see why a Stadia VR wouldn't be the best solution. 
    i7 9700k 2080ti   CV1, Rift-S, Index
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