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The Index thread (please keep to subject)

Techy111
MVP
MVP
As per the title, please respect the users who post here and keep it on topic, any nonsense and......grrr
A PC with lots of gadgets inside and a thing to see in 3D that you put on your head.

2,973 REPLIES 2,973

RuneSR2
Grand Champion

TomCgcmfc said:


RuneSR2 said:

Comparison of Rift-S and Index by a dude who also owned a CV1: 

https://www.reddit.com/r/ValveIndex/comments/e9dgy4/rift_s_to_index_experience/


Unfortunately most headset comparisons do not specify PC specs.  I have come to the conclusion that if you have a high end gaming desktop PC then pretty well all VR headsets work ok.  While there are pros and cons, if you have a strong enough PC to run a Rift cv1 at 2.0 SS it does not get much better than this imho.


Good to hear I'm not alone appreciating ss 2.0 to such a degree - I can still remember Cyber making a bit fun of me for using ss 2.0 some years ago (but I can take it ;-). Maybe it does take some time to see the difference - and going from ss 1.5 to ss 2.0 might not always be that easy to see (also depending on your vision) - or from 1.7 to 2.0. But try to use ss 2.0 for a week or two, and now try to reduce to 1.5 or 1.7, and at least I can easily sense that something does not look "right". It has to do with the sharpness, also including text readability.  
Especially Stormland is a true work of art, somehow the devs chose colors and graphics that usually do an incredible job of hiding the CV1 SDE. I've written it before, but especially in Stormland when using CV1 ss 2.0 I really do feel that graphics and general image quality look better than Index res 100% (but of course you don't get the fov). 
That's why I don't think people should be sad or envious of Index users, if they have to use their old and dusty CV1 for Alyx, because if you can run Alyx using ss 2.0 (or close, 1.8 does work nicely too) you may get an experience that isn't worse than using far more expensive hmds. Also Alyx has been in development for many years, many textures and in-game locations may originally have been designed for oled hmds.
That said, Index res 150 - 200% is superior to CV1 ss 2.0, but I doubt I can run Alyx using Index res 200% - unless I get that 3080 Ti soon, lol.

Oculus Rift CV1, Valve Index & PSVR2, Asus Strix OC RTX™ 3090, i9-10900K (5.3Ghz), 32GB 3200MHz, 16TB SSD
"Ask not what VR can do for you, but what you can do for VR"

TomCgcmfc
MVP
MVP
Mate, I hate to admit it but I kinda used to be a non-believer of cv1 2.0 SS until I got a much better desktop gaming PC ~7 months ago (i9 9900k, gtx1080ti, 32Gb 3000 ram, 1tb ssd,...).  I was then able to run most games at 2.0 SS even without ASW.  Maybe when we both get a rtx3080ti we can give 3.0 SS a go, lol!
i9 13900K water cooled, RTX4090, Z790 MB w/wifi6e, 32Gb 6400 ram, 2x2TB SSD, 1000W PSU, Win 11, QPro, Q3, w/Link and Air Link, Vive Pro1 with Etsy lens mod and Index Controllers

RuneSR2
Grand Champion

TomCgcmfc said:

Mate, I hate to admit it but I kinda used to be a non-believer of cv1 2.0 SS until I got a much better desktop gaming PC ~7 months ago (i9 9900k, gtx1080ti, 32Gb 3000 ram, 1tb ssd,...).  I was then able to run most games at 2.0 SS even without ASW.  Maybe when we both get a rtx3080ti we can give 3.0 SS a go, lol!




I actually did spend some time going beyond ss 2.0 in Talos Principle, and you can see benefits and visual improvements going to ss 2.25 and even 2.5 - but the performance impact was severe on my system. I found a fence in the game and now I walked backwards until the grid became so distorted due to lack of res that I could no longer make out the original grid. But then I could increase ss to 2.25 and suddenly I could see the original grid again - quite amazing! (This also illustrates the increased 3D depth perception caused by increased ss - you can see longer and more clearly when increasing ss.) But we're now using tons of gpu power to get quite small improvements, so ss 2.25 or 2.50 probably only makes sense if you have an excess of gpu power - like getting that 3080 Ti. Going beyond ss 2.5 may reveal limited improvements due to the low native res of the CV1 and the SDE - but I have not tested ss 3.0 thoroughly, lol. 
Some dude wrote yesterday on Valve Index Reddit that res 500% with the Index looked beyond awesome - I think he could use that in Google Earth VR - it does make some sense, although I think the difference between 200% (or 300%) to 500% might be rather small, but I have not yet tried 500% in Google Earth VR. I do see a difference going from res 150% to 200% using the Index (res 200% is the same as ss 2.0, but now relative to the native Index res). 

Oculus Rift CV1, Valve Index & PSVR2, Asus Strix OC RTX™ 3090, i9-10900K (5.3Ghz), 32GB 3200MHz, 16TB SSD
"Ask not what VR can do for you, but what you can do for VR"

Luciferous
Consultant
Yes I got a better card not long ago and it feels like I have a new headset with SS 2.0. Stormlands looks particularly beautiful. 

RuneSR2
Grand Champion
Sounds strange if full locomotion isn't implemented yet, because teleport or locomotion will have profound implications for the gameplay - and a few months from release gameplay should be more or less finalized... We'll see...

https://youtu.be/yW6KOBhwf_0

Oculus Rift CV1, Valve Index & PSVR2, Asus Strix OC RTX™ 3090, i9-10900K (5.3Ghz), 32GB 3200MHz, 16TB SSD
"Ask not what VR can do for you, but what you can do for VR"

kevinw729
Honored Visionary
Thanks for sharing this @RuneSR2  - it really seems that a civil war has been waged inside Valve of late, the two sides (the old guard and the new thinkers) have been battling it out since the HLA announcement and the sudden pivot towards a open communication (narrative). The last redoubt for the old guard was teleportation - if Boneworks forces a rethink, then no telling how much blood letting will follow!

The "Valve Bubble" as so well described in the video is really down too three individuals within the operation - and while Valve has more money than Croesus, they are not totally unanswerable - and dropping the ball (like this 12th hour pull out) will have to be addressed. Maybe its time for some retirements?
https://vrawards.aixr.org/ "The Out-of-Home Immersive Entertainment Frontier: Expanding Interactive Boundaries in Leisure Facilities" https://www.amazon.co.uk/Out-Home-Immersive-Entertainment-Frontier/dp/1472426959

RuneSR2
Grand Champion

kevinw729 said:

Thanks for sharing this @RuneSR2  - it really seems that a civil war has been waged inside Valve of late, the two sides (the old guard and the new thinkers) have been battling it out since the HLA announcement and the sudden pivot towards a open narrative. The last redoubt for the old guard was teleportation - if Boneworks forces a rethink, then no telling how much blood letting will follow!



Agreed, HLA launching as teleport only would be a huge embarrassment that would indicate that Valve is completely out of touch with current VR control preferences.  And it would be an embarrassment showing HLA with teleport only this late in the game's development process. 2c. 

PS. The trailer did have a few scenes looking like full locomotion though - or cleverly hidden teleport controls 😉

https://youtu.be/O2W0N3uKXmo

Oculus Rift CV1, Valve Index & PSVR2, Asus Strix OC RTX™ 3090, i9-10900K (5.3Ghz), 32GB 3200MHz, 16TB SSD
"Ask not what VR can do for you, but what you can do for VR"

kevinw729
Honored Visionary
Agreed, the video comment about how long Valve has known the direction Boneworks was taking, and the stubbornness of some in the operation to still go down their path kinda shows not just an arrogance but also a dangerous disdain for the community. I think they are showing the worst kind of symptoms of bunker-mode. Though the changes in openness after the surprise of HLA reaction could spell the beginning of changes. As we have seen following recent departures at OculusVR. 
https://vrawards.aixr.org/ "The Out-of-Home Immersive Entertainment Frontier: Expanding Interactive Boundaries in Leisure Facilities" https://www.amazon.co.uk/Out-Home-Immersive-Entertainment-Frontier/dp/1472426959

Shadowmask72
Honored Visionary

RuneSR2 said:

PS. The trailer did have a few scenes looking like full locomotion though - or cleverly hidden teleport controls 😉

https://youtu.be/O2W0N3uKXmo



Are you sure? It all looks rather static and scripted to me.


System Specs: MSI NVIDIA RTX 4090 , i5 13700K CPU, 32GB DDR 4 RAM, Win 11 64 Bit OS.

SkScotchegg
Expert Trustee
I'll try Stormland with 2.0 ss tonight. Also Rune, Boneworks is the first game I've ever played where I actually feel like I need/want more FOV!!!

I envy you with your Index!

Have you tried Boneworks with CV1 and then Index? Is the FOV really great with Index?

I really hope in the future we get a lot bigger FOV on all VR HMD's. After 3 years the FOV on CV1 and Rift S simply won't do.
UK: England - Leeds - - RTX 2080 - Rift CV1 & Rift S - Make love, not war - See you in the Oasis!