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First Images of New Oculus Headset

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  • MradrMradr Posts: 3,975 Valuable Player
    edited July 27
    So this is one example I see on the daily - or at least ask about... while I think this person might be young... its a good example of customers who got GO thinking it was more like Quest and Rift S... when it was design for another reason. When they make this the next go replacement (upgrade to) its going to really bring up the standers of what people know at least what they're getting vs something that is part of the line up. Killing GO was the right move to stop more of this confusion going forward and make it clear that their line up across the board can use VR for many reasons - a function over price device.

    https://forums.oculusvr.com/community/profile/discussions/WesElliot

    While this is one example, I know many of my family almost fall for the trap as well because they see the lower price and they don't understand what VR really needs to make it work like at "Mradr's" house. Even my own nephews were hype to see the GO a few months back because they thought it work like the Quest I got them.... but cheaper... its scary how easy it is for a customer to fall into the wrong area.

    So while they could've kept selling the GO - I think it would've just been really confusing what apps were going to be supported, what you really need for VR, why is there this lower price headset and these other headsets that cost more.... it would've been over whelming to the average customer that we few forget about in terms of how much VR knowledge we know. 

    Dropping the GO when they did - and prep for the next headset while working with your devs to port  their software over to Quest store was the smart move. This is one big reason why I dont see how this Quest is the "upgrade" version for current Quest users. Not even as a side upgrade and clearly design for replacing what GO was offering - a cheap headset that the masses can get their hands on at a price they might be able to afford. That offers the same features as the rest of the line up. While the true "upgrade" for Quest 1 users will be either in 2021 or 2022 along with the Rift S 2. Witch will more likely offer a way bigger jump in the SoC performance and storage options.
  • ZenbaneZenbane Posts: 15,742 Valuable Player
    edited July 27
    Mradr said:
    Killing GO was the right move to stop more of this confusion going forward

    You do make a good argument, and I do agree that the whole 3DoF could be confusing for people who experienced VR with 6DoF and didn't realize what they would be getting when they bought GO. They could always just get a refund if they are disappointed of course, but I suppose that's irrelevant.

    I agree with your entire post above. The only thing I find odd is that you say you think killing GO was good to help avoid confusion... yet you keep calling the next HMD: Quest-2-GO.
    :*

    At the end of the day, the fact is - as Carmack said - GO was a good product that helped pave the way for Quest. That's just the history of this tech.
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  • bigmike20vtbigmike20vt Posts: 4,267 Valuable Player
    kevinw729 said:
    Interest summation of the situation. I will counter that with this view of the possibilities:

    1. Quest-Lite = a $299 platform with a Snapdragon 845 and reduced construction as a replacement to the cheap entry level VR

    2. Rift 2 = a $499 platform as a replacement to the Rift-S and competitor to the Reverb G2, using Quest components, but also using Half Dome2 elements

    3. Quest 2 = a $499 version of the Quest with enhanced elements, the Half Dome2 optics package, and a enhanced Link cable that can be connected to a console (XboxSX) [built exclusively to compete against the new PSVR2]

    Those are the current options for the next 24-months, as I see them.





    IF oculus did all 3 of those I would be a happyn chappie indeed (preferably announce them BEFORE I take delivery of my G2)
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  • DaftnDirectDaftnDirect Posts: 5,970 Volunteer Moderator
    I tend to agree with nalex, I just can't see Oculus maintaining two versions of the Quest at any given time (other than memory options). There will be one standalone and one dedicated PCVR headset at any given time imo, until the point that proper hybrids are a thing, then maybe have a higher end and a mainstream version.

    Considering the supply issue that we've been having, which started before, but made much worse by Coronavirus, I just can't see anyone at Oculus thinking that increasing headset models would be a good idea. I can imagine streamlining production being a buzz phrase over there right now.
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  • LuciferousLuciferous Posts: 2,452 Valuable Player
    I think the colour scheme seems to fit well with Horizons. Lot of white and pink.


  • kevinw729kevinw729 Posts: 5,362 Valuable Player
    Interesting - thanks for sharing this news.
    Fascinating that the news sites are having a play off regarding which leaks are which.
    I really wonder about the OP images - if as I suggested they were created based in the information and possible images the renderer had but changed enough not to be liable for legal action?

    Anyway only a few more weeks before the truth is out.
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  • MradrMradr Posts: 3,975 Valuable Player
    edited July 28
    Considering the supply issue that we've been having, which started before, but made much worse by Coronavirus, I just can't see anyone at Oculus thinking that increasing headset models would be a good idea. I can imagine streamlining production being a buzz phrase over there right now.
    How so? I mean - if you are "short on supply" of a product part - then that causes the whole unit to be delay. Thus, wouldn't a tiny spread help? For example, SoCs are usually made in batches and same with screens. If you get short supply on one of them - you are kind of stuck, yet, if you had two different products you could continue to sell the other until the batches come in for the others as they use different parts. 

    Then there is the flip side of things - you still have to have workers building them of course. Yet, that is a simple fix of hiring more workers.

    Then there is also the price differences - are they going to just stick with the lower price point then? You can't keep yoyoing the price up and down if you are not going to sell two different products either. IF you do - or think you could - then what about the people that want the lower price unit? Or the people that want the higher price unit when they switch during that cycle? Wouldn't make sense.

    Your best bet - is you keep it to base a model - then upgrade that base model instead - this way you reuse the same parts over and over again yet you change out the parts that have higher risk of delay like the SoC and the screens.
  • dburnedburne Posts: 3,758 Valuable Player
    Mradr said:
    Considering the supply issue that we've been having, which started before, but made much worse by Coronavirus, I just can't see anyone at Oculus thinking that increasing headset models would be a good idea. I can imagine streamlining production being a buzz phrase over there right now.
    How so? I mean - if you are "short on supply" of a product part - then that causes the whole unit to be delay. Thus, wouldn't a tiny spread help? For example, SoCs are usually made in batches and same with screens. If you get short supply on one of them - you are kind of stuck, yet, if you had two different products you could continue to sell the other until the batches come in for the others as they use different parts. 

    Then there is the flip side of things - you still have to have workers building them of course. Yet, that is a simple fix of hiring more workers.

    Then there is also the price differences - are they going to just stick with the lower price point then? You can't keep yoyoing the price up and down if you are not going to sell two different products either. IF you do - or think you could - then what about the people that want the lower price unit? Or the people that want the higher price unit when they switch during that cycle? Wouldn't make sense.

    Your best bet - is you keep it to base a model - then upgrade that base model instead - this way you reuse the same parts over and over again yet you change out the parts that have higher risk of delay like the SoC and the screens.
    What is SoC you are referring to?
    Don

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  • MradrMradr Posts: 3,975 Valuable Player
    edited July 28
    dburne said:
    Mradr said:
    What is SoC you are referring to?
    Just in general - for example in the SD: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Qualcomm_Snapdragon_systems-on-chip

    You could make a headset in the 845 and another in the 865 or any other chip that will be out in 2021. While you still sell the older chips because it will be cheaper and they will want to sell any stock they have left of it. The 900s will be out this year as well. You also have the Samsung line up etc The way I see it there are all sorts of options out there and to limit your self down to one product to cover all that for 2 years will be crazy lol
  • dburnedburne Posts: 3,758 Valuable Player
    Mradr said:
    dburne said:
    Mradr said:
    What is SoC you are referring to?
    Just in general - for example in the SD: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Qualcomm_Snapdragon_systems-on-chip

    You could make a headset in the 845 and another in the 865 or any other chip that will be out in 2021. While you still sell the older chips because it will be cheaper and they will want to sell any stock they have left of it.
    Ah ok - "Systems on a chip".
    Thanks,
    Don

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  • nalex66nalex66 Posts: 5,634 Volunteer Moderator
    Well, I've been hoping that we would get some more leaks this week, but nothing so far. In the meantime, here's another UploadVR article that nicely summarizes everything we've heard and seen so far about the new Quest.
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  • dburnedburne Posts: 3,758 Valuable Player
    nalex66 said:
    Well, I've been hoping that we would get some more leaks this week, but nothing so far. In the meantime, here's another UploadVR article that nicely summarizes everything we've heard and seen so far about the new Quest.
    I find the below excerpt to be an interesting take away from the article:

    "Facebook didn’t add Hand Tracking to Rift S, and the headset also didn’t get Guardian updates like color selection and startup object warnings. The Rift S changelog hasn’t shown major improvements since Oculus Link launched, with Quest clearly getting Facebook’s attention.

    It’s conceivable the company plans to replace Quest and Rift S with this Oculus Quest 2, which could see it pitched as a “hybrid” headset. "

    Don

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  • nalex66nalex66 Posts: 5,634 Volunteer Moderator
    edited July 29
    Yeah... of course that's just speculation on the part of the writer. Certainly a possibility though; consider if the screens and lenses were significantly better, comfort was improved, the new SoC enabled higher-bandwidth Link and/or built-in high quality wireless streaming, and the price was $350. Would they sell many Rift S headsets against it?

    To be clear, I don't expect that to be the case. A little further down the road, I think that's where it's going, but I'm not convinced that we're at that point quite yet.
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  • ZenbaneZenbane Posts: 15,742 Valuable Player
    edited July 29

    I can see the concern about Quest getting stuff that's not on Rift (yet), but a few things to consider:
    • Quest can be played 100% untethered without a PC, so the Guardian system is exceedingly more important than that of Rift-S, since Rift-S can only be played while tethered and limited to the length of the cable.
    • Oculus already publicly stated that Quest will get hand-tracking first before Rift-S, so this isn't exactly news. By the time Oculus releases hand-tracking for Rift, they will also need to launch Rift software that implements hand-tracking. This takes times, and there's no reason to believe that it won't eventually arrive. There isn't a slew of amazing hand-tracking experiences for Quest users in its current state. 100% of the experiences are demo's that barely rival the worst of Steam's independent dev software.
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  • DaftnDirectDaftnDirect Posts: 5,970 Volunteer Moderator
    edited July 29
    Mradr said:
    Considering the supply issue that we've been having, which started before, but made much worse by Coronavirus, I just can't see anyone at Oculus thinking that increasing headset models would be a good idea. I can imagine streamlining production being a buzz phrase over there right now.
    How so? I mean - if you are "short on supply" of a product part - then that causes the whole unit to be delay. Thus, wouldn't a tiny spread help? For example, SoCs are usually made in batches and same with screens. If you get short supply on one of them - you are kind of stuck, yet, if you had two different products you could continue to sell the other until the batches come in for the others as they use different parts. 

    Then there is the flip side of things - you still have to have workers building them of course. Yet, that is a simple fix of hiring more workers.

    Then there is also the price differences - are they going to just stick with the lower price point then? You can't keep yoyoing the price up and down if you are not going to sell two different products either. IF you do - or think you could - then what about the people that want the lower price unit? Or the people that want the higher price unit when they switch during that cycle? Wouldn't make sense.

    Your best bet - is you keep it to base a model - then upgrade that base model instead - this way you reuse the same parts over and over again yet you change out the parts that have higher risk of delay like the SoC and the screens.
    Maybe I'm thinking too simplistically, but the way I see it, it all comes down to people as you mention.

    People in design, testing, in the factories, in the depots, the transport industry right down to the local delivery firms. Not to mention the availability of replacement parts and accessories. If there's a way to make two different headsets economically, with a lot of components that are bespoke to each, supplied by different companies, then maybe that helps mitigate production shortcomings but I'm not sure that's the only restriction in the overall chain.

    Choosing to take that approach for the purposes of getting more headset available could be problematic I think. It assumes there's a big enough market for both to make non-commonality of design financially feasible. I think goods manufacturers generally try to use as many common components as they possibly can to minimise costs. I really don't know what margins are involved with these headsets but I've always assumed it's pretty tight.

    I also think Oculus are struggling on the support front right now, there's such a wide range of PC configurations and so many new users now that even if a very small percentage of users have a problem, it translates to lots of tickets and I just get the feeling they're a little below where they'd like to be, staffing-wise (just guessing). I think a large user base influences the desire to streamline models rather than diversify.

    Well, I'm no expert. I'm used to specifying electrical equipment for clients during normal times, not manufacturing the stuff like VR headsets, during the current situation. :) 
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  • MradrMradr Posts: 3,975 Valuable Player
    edited July 30
    I also think Oculus are struggling on the support front right now, there's such a wide range of PC configurations and so many new users now that even if a very small percentage of users have a problem, it translates to lots of tickets and I just get the feeling they're a little below where they'd like to be, staffing-wise (just guessing). I think a large user base influences the desire to streamline models rather than diversify.

    Releasing another headset is not going to fix that either way. While Quest does have its own problems - it still does allow PC connection thus you still going to have tickets over that. If your goal is to lower ticket numbers - this isn't the way LOL. If your goal is to stream line the ticket problems down so that they are all the same - then you remove all products that are different to the base headset. So that way - if 100 people have a problem then you can focus on that vs 100 people have different problems.

    I mean if that is their goal - then you can say bye bye to the PC headset then... and all future headsets would aim for Quest-2-> steam line as they all would have the same problems if there is a problem and they all would have be steam line production as the only things you are changing is the SoC and screen most likely.

    Maybe I am off - but in your world - there is no PC-Only-Headset... Granted - I also see it coming to that point at some point as well as Link gets better. So when you say 2 headsets - you don't mean one PC and one Mobile - you mean 2 Quest headsets then.


    If you just mean - remove the complicity of what Quest 1 had - then of course. That's basically what I been saying and the whole idea around what Quest-2-GO was even about.
  • DaftnDirectDaftnDirect Posts: 5,970 Volunteer Moderator
    I'm not really suggesting anything as a fix for support but having 2 Quest headsets in addition to the Rift, if those 2 Quests are component diverse in order to mitigate production pinch points would probably add to the problem and not necessarily solve any of the non-production related pinch points or profit margins.

    So yeah, a Rift and a Quest for now... then maybe 2 quite different (performing/featured) Quests, when they're at the point that they're good enough to do PCVR that they can replace Rifts completely.... maybe Oculus think the next Quest is good enough but until we see it, I'm going to say it won't be, if I'm wrong, and it is... then I think they'll let Rift come to an end and develop two diverse Quests. But of course all this is just my opinion and I'm regularly wrong.

    Not sure if any company currently has more than 2 headsets on the go, unless we count Pimax who seem to have 4 with another up for pre-orders, but they seem to be all variations of the same headset and the asking price for the higher end models allows them to target small numbers of buyers whilst relying on other companies to build mainstream VR so their customers have games to play.
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  • kevinw729kevinw729 Posts: 5,362 Valuable Player
    .....
    Not sure if any company currently has more than 2 headsets on the go, unless we count Pimax who seem to have 4 with another up for pre-orders, but they seem to be all variations of the same headset and the asking price for the higher end models allows them to target small numbers of buyers whilst relying on other companies to build mainstream VR so their customers have games to play.

    HTC - VIVE Pro, Cosmos, Focus
    HP - Reverb G1, G2, Standalone
    Sampson - Odyssey, Odyssey 2, Standalone
    Varjo - XR-1, VR-2, VR-2 Pro
    Acer - OjO, AH101, AH121
    Pimax etc.........

    Sorry there are a few with more than two headsets on the go!
    And I feel they may be targeting a muchh more diverse group.
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  • snowdogsnowdog Posts: 7,736 Valuable Player
    Primarx will probably have a dozen of the things available soon. They'll end up being like Pokemon, you've gotta catch 'em all 😲😂😂😂
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  • kevinw729kevinw729 Posts: 5,362 Valuable Player
    Yeah, even Pimax Asia ignores some of the variants and only focuses on the two key systems. They are about to announce a new system (or would have if things had not gone to pot). There is a concern that Pimax may have burnt through a lot of their seed funding so may fall from prominence in the coming months unless they can get more support. 
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    ** Second New Book **
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    https://www.amazon.co.uk/Out-Home-Immersive-Entertainment-Frontier/dp/1472426959
  • MradrMradr Posts: 3,975 Valuable Player
    edited August 1
    kevinw729 said:
    Yeah, even Pimax Asia ignores some of the variants and only focuses on the two key systems. They are about to announce a new system (or would have if things had not gone to pot). There is a concern that Pimax may have burnt through a lot of their seed funding so may fall from prominence in the coming months unless they can get more support. 
    Heard that too.. but they really need to stop making more - and refocus on what is their main product. They did the ops and release too many variants way too soon. If this was over a few years I dont think it would've been a problem. I think next time they should "work" on a few internal ones (witch is what all these variants are) and just pick the best one of them at x time of the year to release with. I know they was trying to please everyone - but if you did that - you are going to hurt your self in the long run. No more than 2-3 choices with either a per cycle or every other year cycle. 
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