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BREAKING - Quest 2 Video Revealled!

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  • kevinw729kevinw729 Posts: 5,907 Valuable Player
    Interesting article about the reality of the pricing of the new hardware:

  • OmegaM4NOmegaM4N Posts: 1,146
    Wintermute
    edited September 2020
    ^^^As my insane secondary school maths teacher was found of saying as he brought the belt down on whack number 4 of 6, "you get what you pay for". lol
  • dburnedburne Posts: 4,426 Valuable Player
    Yeah Quest 2 is not the product, consumers who purchase it are.
    Don

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  • ZenbaneZenbane Posts: 16,879 Valuable Player
    edited September 2020
    Not sure how it's any different than buying a computer or a car or a home or a pet dog/cat.

    The purchase price isn't the total cost of ownership. You still need to pay for the energy to run it (electricity, gasoline, food). There is cost with maintenance and upkeep. Insurance. Extended warranty. 

    The difference between "purchase price" vs "cost of ownership" has been mainstream for some time now.

    When I bought my new Alienware laptop this year, I spent an additional $500 on extended warranty and insurance to cover accidents, theft, damage, etc.

    This is all fairly standard stuff imo.

    I agree that consumers are a product, but that applies to all purchases on the market; not just the Quest. The best example is... a bank account. If someone has a bank account, then that person is a product for that bank (e.g. they use your money to make money).

    Employees are a product too for the company that employs them.
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  • inovatorinovator Posts: 2,911 Valuable Player
    Zenbane said:
    Not sure how it's any different than buying a computer or a car or a home or a pet dog/cat.

    The purchase price isn't the total cost of ownership. You still need to pay for the energy to run it (electricity, gasoline, food). There is cost with maintenance and upkeep. Insurance. Extended warranty. 

    The difference between "purchase price" vs "cost of ownership" has been mainstream for some time now.

    When I bought my new Alienware laptop this year, I spent an additional $500 on extended warranty and insurance to cover accidents, theft, damage, etc.

    This is all fairly standard stuff imo.

    I agree that consumers are a product, but that applies to all purchases on the market; not just the Quest. The best example is... a bank account. If someone has a bank account, then that person is a product for that bank (e.g. they use your money to make money).

    Employees are a product too for the company that employs them.
    You paid all that for a warranty omg your like me in that respect. I was told that's a bad idea. The company wins most of the time so my last two tvs were replaced only months before the 4 year warranties i bought were up. I guess I made a dumb decision. I like the peace of mind.
  • ZenbaneZenbane Posts: 16,879 Valuable Player
    inovator said:
    Zenbane said:
    Not sure how it's any different than buying a computer or a car or a home or a pet dog/cat.

    The purchase price isn't the total cost of ownership. You still need to pay for the energy to run it (electricity, gasoline, food). There is cost with maintenance and upkeep. Insurance. Extended warranty. 

    The difference between "purchase price" vs "cost of ownership" has been mainstream for some time now.

    When I bought my new Alienware laptop this year, I spent an additional $500 on extended warranty and insurance to cover accidents, theft, damage, etc.

    This is all fairly standard stuff imo.

    I agree that consumers are a product, but that applies to all purchases on the market; not just the Quest. The best example is... a bank account. If someone has a bank account, then that person is a product for that bank (e.g. they use your money to make money).

    Employees are a product too for the company that employs them.
    You paid all that for a warranty omg your like me in that respect. I was told that's a bad idea. The company wins most of the time so my last two tvs were replaced only months before the 4 year warranties i bought were up. I guess I made a dumb decision. I like the peace of mind.

    lol - yeah, well I have a 5 year old boy running rampant around the house (thanks Covid19), and accidents have increased in 2020. My warrant covers things as blatant as spilling juice or wine all over my laptop, so I figured it was worth it.

    I've had good experiences with Warranties myself; but it does depend on the company issuing it. Dell has a fairly fantastic reputation in this area. And I've won battles against organizations that tried to screw me over.

    Most regions (even here in the U.S.) have some sort of Government agency that maintains oversight over these things. All you need to do is go through the proper steps to report an organization for "fraud." Once that organization receives a letter of intent from the Government, they usually just agree to fix your problem. It's cheaper to satisfy the customer than to go through all that litigation. The only caveat is that you, the consumer, need to spend time taking the proper steps to force this type of action. Merely "threatening" to take action isn't enough.
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  • JohnnyDioxinJohnnyDioxin Posts: 2,722 Valuable Player
    nalex66 said:
    JD-UK said:
    Didn't take long this time:


    In one of the Quest 2 review videos I watched, it was said that VR Cover was being brought on as an official Oculus partner for their facial interface replacements. I hope they get these to market quickly—I hate the foam face rings, and I use the pu leather VR Cover on both my Rift and my Quest. I already went looking for the Quest 2 VR Cover, and put myself on the mailing list to get notified when it’s available. 
    I found that their cover for the Quest was a big improvement to the weight issue all on its own. Funny, though - I've always used their faceplates and -pads but the one they did for Index was less comfy (for me) than the original Valve one, so I bought the 'official' dual pack - which was also cheaper than VR Cover's one. Was surprised at that.

    I also bought their strap cushion for Quest, but I couldn't actually use it because it made the headstrap way too tight and pulled the headset into my flesh so much it was actually painful.

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  • nalex66nalex66 Posts: 6,363 Volunteer Moderator
    Yeah, my head is too big (front to back) to add any padding to the back strap too. I hope the Elite strap has enough extension to fit. 
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  • RuneSR2RuneSR2 Posts: 7,415 Valuable Player
    edited September 2020
    Through the lens shots are like a box of chocolates ….



    From Tyriel Wood, SteamVR res 100% was probably used, but only Tyriel knows (at least Index gets *much* sharper using res 200% than the blurry 100%)… Still no reason to cancel G2, black/white levels (contrast and brightness) look extremely bad on the Quest 2 in this shot. 

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  • LuciferousLuciferous Posts: 2,723 Valuable Player
    edited September 2020

    Index looks the best contrast between blacks and white but then again this is the G2 before they added the additional power and upped the brightness but did this make the blacks worse?

    Screen door, clarity and resolution of the G2 looks the best but again until we see the final version who knows. 

    If you are looking for an all rounder the Quest 2 may not be the best out of the three but that's pretty damned good considering the index kit is 1000 bucks and how much is packed into the unit.

    I guess a still is not best judgement of that for PCVR though with the current low hz and compression.
  • RuneSR2RuneSR2 Posts: 7,415 Valuable Player
    edited September 2020

    Index looks the best contrast between blacks and white but then again this is the G2 before they added the additional power and upped the brightness but did this make the blacks worse?

    Screen door, clarity and resolution of the G2 looks the best but again until we see the final version who knows. 

    If you are looking for an all rounder the Quest 2 may not be the best out of the three but that's pretty damned good considering the index kit is 1000 bucks and how much is packed into the unit.

    I guess a still is not best judgement of that for PCVR though with the current low hz and compression.
    Agreed and to be fair the SDE seems very good with Quest 2 - also shown here:



    Personally I have no problems with the SDE using Index, so Quest 2 users will probably love the close to lack of any SDE. We'll see when real user reviews arrive. Also $299 is close to free for what you can play and experience using PCVR. 

    Valve Index also has it's own power supply - it does not rely fully on the USB connection if at all. 

    These images are fresh from Tyriel - he's probably using his old G2 review sample. 
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  • kevinw729kevinw729 Posts: 5,907 Valuable Player
    Can never get excited by the "through the lens" camera shots. Have seen good ones and bad ones, and nothing replaces the actual reviewing of the system for ones self. I saw great Pimax images only for the reality of the visor inclusion to be ignored! 
  • JohnnyDioxinJohnnyDioxin Posts: 2,722 Valuable Player
    edited September 2020
    I just ordered mine on Amazon - still due on 13th, so plenty of supply. Thanks to my 82 year-old Mum for the gift! :)

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  • inovatorinovator Posts: 2,911 Valuable Player
    I just ordered mine on Amazon - still due on 13th, so plenty of supply. Thanks to my 82 year-old Mum for the gift! :)
    Nice gift. My mom is 86. She used to travel alot and doesn't want to anymore. I have been bringing over my quest 1 and she loves watching the vr 360 videos especially the travel ones.  Your mom may enjoy that. 
  • JohnnyDioxinJohnnyDioxin Posts: 2,722 Valuable Player
    I've got a bit of a job on, persuading her - but I am trying! I'm going to wait until I have the Quest 2 before I get her to actually put a VR headset on her head, as it will look so much better and be much more comfy with the elite strap. She can't come to my house any more (she lives in another town) so PCVR is not possible.
    She's a technophobe and always has been, won't even touch a smart phone and recently refused a modern non-smart mobile phone from me cos it was "too complicated". She's into nature etc so I'm going to try and get her to watch one of David Attenborough's 360° documentaries on it.

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  • RuneSR2RuneSR2 Posts: 7,415 Valuable Player
    edited October 2020
    Official launch titles look amazing, fully understandable if people are dying to play them  B) (Note these are indeed official Quest 2 launch titles)





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  • MradrMradr Posts: 4,179 Valuable Player
    edited October 2020
    kevinw729 said:
    Interesting article about the reality of the pricing of the new hardware:
    I would argue that they are not losing any money on this unit. Instead they're making 50$ and over time up to 85$ and still selling the headset for the other key value reasons. I already noted on the differences these changes from Quest 1 to Quest 2 would've cost and the disadvanved they cover and benefit it would provide to the cost. The simple fact they remove the "extras" and double down on the screen it self means I was 100% correct:)

    More or less this unit is "cheap" in terms of the bad of removing a bit too much for the sake of price alone for the base unit. We see that in terms of the "extra" now they are selling to the customers with other straps, storage, power, longer cables, and soon to be selling over the ear headphones. Starting to feel like HTC Vive "add ons" all over again:)

    Soon we will hear:
    "You have to get the battery strap it makes the world of difference on your game time"
    "Man, you have to go for the top storage options, these games just keep creeping up in storage usage"
    "The included cable is mainly for powering the devices, but getting a longer cable is totally worth it or getting that new wifi 6 router"
    "Yea, totally the included speakers are ok. Good in a pinch and need want to share the headset - but you NEED the headphone clips they sell - it makes a difference in how good everything sounds"

    In reality - the headset will cost you closer to 600$. Not only that - but be limited to their one option? No option for a computer that could provide more? Just seems like they're going to play the game real hard going forward:) coughapplegame101cough With that said - I dont think they will limit it to one only - I still hearing about a type of "pro" headset (no this isnt their business service) so I do hope it is true, but not holding my breath if everyone just lays down for this type of behavior. 
  • inovatorinovator Posts: 2,911 Valuable Player
    RuneSR2 said:
    Official launch titles look amazing, fully understandable if people are dying to play them  B) (Note these are indeed official Quest 2 launch titles)





    I guess it's amazing if your into those games. Personally I don't get it.
  • RuneSR2RuneSR2 Posts: 7,415 Valuable Player
    inovator said:
    RuneSR2 said:
    Official launch titles look amazing, fully understandable if people are dying to play them  B) (Note these are indeed official Quest 2 launch titles)





    I guess it's amazing if your into those games. Personally I don't get it.

    I suspect they try to catch more interest from females, not sure Arnold and Stallone would go for these games... 
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  • nalex66nalex66 Posts: 6,363 Volunteer Moderator
    edited October 2020
    Those are the launch titles for the Japanese release (Oculus is making a big push in Japan with Quest 2). They are clearly catering to the interests of Japanese gamers with these games--I'm not sure if they're being released in western markets.
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  • inovatorinovator Posts: 2,911 Valuable Player
    Mradr said:
    kevinw729 said:
    Interesting article about the reality of the pricing of the new hardware:
    I would argue that they are not losing any money on this unit. Instead they're making 50$ and over time up to 85$ and still selling the headset for the other key value reasons. I already noted on the differences these changes from Quest 1 to Quest 2 would've cost and the disadvanved they cover and benefit it would provide to the cost. The simple fact they remove the "extras" and double down on the screen it self means I was 100% correct:)

    More or less this unit is "cheap" in terms of the bad of removing a bit too much for the sake of price alone for the base unit. We see that in terms of the "extra" now they are selling to the customers with other straps, storage, power, longer cables, and soon to be selling over the ear headphones. Starting to feel like HTC Vive "add ons" all over again:)

    Soon we will hear:
    "You have to get the battery strap it makes the world of difference on your game time"
    "Man, you have to go for the top storage options, these games just keep creeping up in storage usage"
    "The included cable is mainly for powering the devices, but getting a longer cable is totally worth it or getting that new wifi 6 router"
    "Yea, totally the included speakers are ok. Good in a pinch and need want to share the headset - but you NEED the headphone clips they sell - it makes a difference in how good everything sounds"

    In reality - the headset will cost you closer to 600$. Not only that - but be limited to their one option? No option for a computer that could provide more? Just seems like they're going to play the game real hard going forward:) coughapplegame101cough With that said - I dont think they will limit it to one only - I still hearing about a type of "pro" headset (no this isnt their business service) so I do hope it is true, but not holding my breath if everyone just lays down for this type of behavior. 
    In reality if it costs you 600 dollars your getting a phenomenal deal. 1. A standalone 2. A pc headset, 3. A pc wireless that will get even better. Many  casual users will not need the mods. Besides hardware costs the research costs are huge. I believe it's being sold at a loss. If I'm understanding correctly you mentioned a possible pro in addition. Way back I said oculus will stick with only one unit if the quest is a huge success. I don't believe that will change.
  • DaftnDirectDaftnDirect Posts: 6,496 Volunteer Moderator
    inovator said:
    In reality if it costs you 600 dollars your getting a phenomenal deal. 1. A standalone 2. A pc headset, 3. A pc wireless that will get even better. Many  casual users will not need the mods. Besides hardware costs the research costs are huge. I believe it's being sold at a loss. If I'm understanding correctly you mentioned a possible pro in addition. Way back I said oculus will stick with only one unit if the quest is a huge success. I don't believe that will change.
    Yeah, R&D is a big deal. If anyone is just adding up the cost of components, they're going to be off by a big factor. Not to mention distribution and logistics, returns and warranty, support, driver and SDK development... advertising...
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  • inovatorinovator Posts: 2,911 Valuable Player
    inovator said:
    In reality if it costs you 600 dollars your getting a phenomenal deal. 1. A standalone 2. A pc headset, 3. A pc wireless that will get even better. Many  casual users will not need the mods. Besides hardware costs the research costs are huge. I believe it's being sold at a loss. If I'm understanding correctly you mentioned a possible pro in addition. Way back I said oculus will stick with only one unit if the quest is a huge success. I don't believe that will change.
    Yeah, R&D is a big deal. If anyone is just adding up the cost of components, they're going to be off by a big factor. Not to mention distribution and logistics, returns and warranty, support, driver and SDK development... advertising...
    Yup I left out alot of other costs.
  • MradrMradr Posts: 4,179 Valuable Player
    edited October 2020
    inovator said:
    inovator said:
    In reality if it costs you 600 dollars your getting a phenomenal deal. 1. A standalone 2. A pc headset, 3. A pc wireless that will get even better. Many  casual users will not need the mods. Besides hardware costs the research costs are huge. I believe it's being sold at a loss. If I'm understanding correctly you mentioned a possible pro in addition. Way back I said oculus will stick with only one unit if the quest is a huge success. I don't believe that will change.
    Yeah, R&D is a big deal. If anyone is just adding up the cost of components, they're going to be off by a big factor. Not to mention distribution and logistics, returns and warranty, support, driver and SDK development... advertising...
    Yup I left out alot of other costs.
    All that cost is cover by many factors - plus they are still making money off
    1) Sell your data
    2) Selling you
    3) Selling you software
    4) Devs selling software on their store
    5) Selling the headset
    6) Selling add ons
    7) Not really "repairing" your device - but a force rebuy
    Just to name a few extra source of income you are over looking.

    R/W is a risk factor - real cost - but a risk factor. Driver and SDK would be paid off by the store use. D/L would be pay off as a block sum - or force the user to take on this cost - either way at a bigger discount than normal shipping would would be pay off from the 250 price tag or over time by other services/plans. R/W and D/L are a one time cost as well usually. Business take lost here - nothing new if there is a problem with their product. Its a way to keep making sure that quality is high on ship products. This should only account for less than 5% of total sales. Anymore they need to look at their quality. They are still profiting the 50$ - but could still be use for other reasons of course to cover the off chance. Still - profit. As for the R/D sure - there is cost - that's the hidden cost - but its a cost they are dropping out by switching to the Quest like device. Its cheaper to work on one product idea than it would've been two or more witch is one of the reasons for dropping PC-Only-Headsets. R/D is done at small scale - as well before it goes into a full product. A lot of the R/D we seen didn't hit this unit either as the SoC was done by other company and the same with fast switch LCD. Really, the only cost was design here. There is a big difference here between the Quest 1 and Quest 2 and all around Quest 2 is cheaper by design good or bad.

    In reality if it costs you 600 dollars your getting a phenomenal deal. 1. A standalone 2. A pc headset, 3. A pc wireless that will get even better. - inovater

    Yes and no. I predicated this, but I figure they would've still broken it down a little with base and pro. In this case, they are doing it in a single unit - and just like before we saw with HTC Vive - its a bit of a fuck you to the customer when you have to keep buying extras on the side to get everything they could put together in the first place. Like R/D wise its not that hard to think and model a extra battery to the back of the headset. Something I even told Snowdog they could've done:P so where is my R/D research money?
  • DaftnDirectDaftnDirect Posts: 6,496 Volunteer Moderator
    edited October 2020
    I'm not overlooking anything... I thought we were talking about the cost of the headset?

    If you want to talk about the expenses and income of the company's VR division as a whole then you're guessing at what those are... just as I would be if I tried to do that.
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  • MradrMradr Posts: 4,179 Valuable Player
    edited October 2020
    I'm not overlooking anything... I thought we were talking about the cost of the headset?

    If you want to talk about the expenses and income of the company's VR division as a whole then you're guessing at what those are... just as I would be if I tried to do that.
    I was og talking about the article saying it wasn't cheap - but it by design is cheap ~ good or bad - it was design around saving cost, but if you look at having to buy the extras - it still comes out to around 600$ and while that is in my ball park ok, by Oculus terms - that is a over price with the whole need to keep under the 400$ talk they did. That in fact they are making a little money off the headset and that it was not in fact being solid at cost or lost. Where that money goes I really dont know ~ I mean as far as a break down, but there is a little money they are making as profit. I fear this will be a trend though having customer keep buying the extras instead of them just making the best headset they can. That's Apple 101 - sell you a unit you have to buy extra stuff for - dongle for this or that.
  • nalex66nalex66 Posts: 6,363 Volunteer Moderator
    Mradr said:
    ... its a bit of a fuck you to the customer when you have to keep buying extras on the side to get everything they could put together in the first place.
     I think you are fundamentally wrong here. They've made the base functional unit very affordable, and given the consumer the choice for all the extras. Some people may like the elastic strap for watching movies while lying down. Some people may not mind the cheap foam facial interface. Some people may have their own battery pack and headphones that they want to use.

    It would have been a bit of a fuck you to the customer to bundle all the extras into a higher priced headset and make everyone pay for those things, whether they want them or not.
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  • MradrMradr Posts: 4,179 Valuable Player
    edited October 2020
    nalex66 said:
    Mradr said:
    ... its a bit of a fuck you to the customer when you have to keep buying extras on the side to get everything they could put together in the first place.
     I think you are fundamentally wrong here. They've made the base functional unit very affordable, and given the consumer the choice for all the extras. Some people may like the elastic strap for watching movies while lying down. Some people may not mind the cheap foam facial interface. Some people may have their own battery pack and headphones that they want to use.

    It would have been a bit of a fuck you to the customer to bundle all the extras into a higher priced headset and make everyone pay for those things, whether they want them or not.
    Didn't you say something about HTC doing the same thing just a year ago:)? I mean that is how I take "likes" as to say to agree with the comment. 

    Also, not really. At the end of the day - you would've not known the difference. For example, if they had a better strap - you would've just thought that is the way it was. Same for the extra battery storage. I can prove this point because no one said anything about removing extras from their CV1, Quest 1, or Rift S to go back to a basic strap. Would've saved money esp for the Rift S by a long shot. Yet, everyone that got it was happy for the strap. You can go look up old post about people telling me that Rift S had a batter strap for PC use over the Quest:)

    While I agree those are good use cases - I could argue that they get dirty fast with no good way of cleaning them. So was the "cheap"ness worth if you are a person that likes to keep it clean as possible? I seen reports of the strap causing rubbing and ear pain after a long use because it doesnt give good enough support like the older straps. Its a value you have to weigh and a bag of trade offs you are going to pay for. 
  • DaftnDirectDaftnDirect Posts: 6,496 Volunteer Moderator
    I like using the Q1 A LOT for casual media viewing... Netflix, Prime, YouTube, iPlayer and NAS movie viewing in bed... or on the sofa, and the Elite strap would be uncomfortable for that I think.

    If the headset's a bit lighter than Q1 then it's probably a little bit more comfortable anyway and that would be good enough for my short(ish) untethered VR sessions.

    If it replaces my Rift-S as a PCVR headset then I'd have to decide if the Elite strap added to comfort for long sessions but its battery would be a bit of a wasted resource for me just being used for weight balance. And I'd have to keep changing between Elite and cloth strap depending on use. 

    Anyway, I guess I'm saying it's good the the strap is an option, not a bundled cost as I'll probably not get one until I decided I wanted it.
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