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Oculus Rift & Vivid Dreams

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  • 3Jane3Jane Posts: 23
    Very interesting topic!

    I think VR will open up a whole new world of "highs" for people to get. Whether its flying around like superman or exploring a zen garden, transforming ones sense of space will produce a wide range of effects in users.

    Indeed forget about the Rift affecting your dreams, how about using the Rift to actively dream while awake? I've always imagined that truly immersive VR would affect people like a diet LSD. An active hallucination the user can control and interact with. Unlike LSD you can turn VR off, but just like LSD if the experience you had was intense enough it will likely leave a strong mark on your memory; perhaps infiltrating your dreams or even giving you flashbacks.

    While I don't believe in balls of light and other new age theories of "energy" I do know the brain is quite the mysterious and amazing device. VR presents us with the chance to alter our brain chemistry through experiences that aren't real. What types of experiences and senses will produce the most transformative states in VR users? Will a walk through a realistic forest produce measurable increases in dopamine and relaxation in users? Could an abstract experience ala the end of 2001 trigger psychedelic thoughts or states of mind? As VR improves will it eventually need to be regulated like other drugs and intense experiences? Will holo-deck style VR be too addictive?

    So many awesome questions to answer!
  • svensven Posts: 339
    Hiro Protagonist
    Notch has also been having dreams after playing with his Rift...
  • SaethanSaethan Posts: 36
    I've been lucid dreaming for a long time(not every night but pretty dang often) - they always start the same, I'm in the exact spot where I fell asleep, but from there I can go anywhere and do anything (though I have -lost control- while lucid dreaming and had to force myself to wake up - it can get scary sometimes).

    What I wonder is, what if you fall asleep with your Rift and headphones on?
  • ignoramusignoramus Posts: 11
    When I was 8 years old, my dad gave me an MSX computer and the video game “aliens”. I played the game for hours that day, amazed at the technology, totally immersed. I think it may have been my first prolonged video game session.

    Anyways, the dreams I had that night (and many nights following) were extremely vivid – dreams of being in the game. I can still recall them in detail for some reason, and every once in while I actually have a “flash back” dream where I am 8 years old and in that very game. Not bad dreams but very tense.

    I can’t wait to try the rift!
  • MikeArms24MikeArms24 Posts: 519
    Hiro Protagonist
    I've been having vivid dreams almost every night. Last night in my dream I looked in the mirror and saw a floating blue head of an unfinished, unanimated character controller. Scary as hell. Then I woke up and realized I was wearing the rift in my dream and it didnt seem as scary. Another thing that I'm sure has been affecting my dreams has been making rift games in unity. Besides trying to work out code, I think my mind is trying to dream up some whacked out experience to create for the rift.
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  • peteclarkelondonpeteclarkelondon Posts: 38
    Brain Burst
    WOW! I've been reading so much about the Rift and took delivery a week or so ago but just stumbled across this thread.

    This has got me very excited for a couple of reasons. I have had lucid dreams and OBEs for over 10 years on a reasonably regular basis, although sometimes there have been big gaps between them. I've researched the subject various times to try and increase the frequency. Therefore I know how incredible it can be, it really is the kind of thing that can change your way of thinking altogether. It feels to me like surfing (if I imagine what it might be like to surf lol), always chasing the perfect lucid dream wave, and when you can sustain one for a while it can be a really mind blowing experience. I also have noticed my dreams increase in the last few days so I believe there could well be something to this...just how much of a 'something' time may tell while we figure it out. But the idea of using it to increase the ability to lucid dream is fascinating and something I hadn't even considered.

    I've loaned the Rift out for a couple of days to my business partner (we've got more coming at some point then we won't need to share), but when I get it back I'm definitely going to experiment with this. Exciting times....interesting, very very interesting. I will feed back once I have had the chance to try some things out suggested here.
  • 360FOV360FOV Posts: 476
    Hiro Protagonist
    Hi All,

    Just thought I would drop a quick post and share some lucid dream activity I had lately which is related to the Oculus rift.

    In the past 4 days I have had lucid dreams on 3 of them. This is more than I normally experience and I'm pretty sure it is due to the rift and having VR on my mind more than normal.

    DAY 1 - I was in a dream and became aware that I was dreaming. Then I looked down at a table and noticed a Rift laying on it. I wondered to myself what the Rift would look like if I peeked inside it while in a dream so I put it to my face to find out. As it grew closer to my eyes the image I saw caused an intense wave of shock. My entire field of view was overtaken by the most intense screen door effect I have ever seen. There was nothing but white pixels surrounded by a black lines which were thicker than the pixels themselves. It caused such a scare in me that I woke up immediately. :o

    DAY 2 - I was in a dream walking toward a destination in a mindless normal dreaming state. After a couple minutes I realized that it was taking forever to get where ever I was heading to so I looked up to see where I was headed. I recognized that the place I was headed was the Epic Citadel Castle and it instantly made me realize I was dreaming and brought my full consciousness to the dream. I suddenly knew that since I was dreaming I didn't have to walk there and proceeded to fly Instead.

    After I finished exploring the castle I went through numerous other dreams without any of my full wakefulness fading at all. I kid you not, for 3 entire hours I was fully awake in the dreams.

    It was so real that it was like I was stuck in the dreams. Everything I perceived was so convincing that I don't think virtual reality could ever reach this level of immersion, at least not in our lifetimes. It finally ended when I entered a dream that was like a video game. I was somehow like a Pac-Man cartoony type character and the other lifeforms around me were also the same. At one point I pissed off a cartoon game shark and got bum-rushed by 20 different toons. Getting attacked instantly woke me up. It was simply an amazing experience.

    Day 3 - This time I woke up in my dream but it had nothing to do with VR or Rift. I ran around for about 30 minutes fully awake in the dream but somehow every-time I got near an attractive woman my hands mysteriously were attracted to her breast. LOL :oops: Yeah seems a little pervy but it happens that way sometimes while lucid dreaming! I will skip the intimate details how that dream ended, but lets just say that sometime physical responses in dreams result in physical responses in your body in real life - at least after you become skilled enough not to wake up to early. (ok, too much information)

    Anyhow, since my lucid dreaming is in hyper-drive, it certainly seems VR has great potential for enhancing dream awareness.

    If anyone is having a periods where there lucid dreaming dries up a little then I would suggest trying to avoid sex/masturbation entirely for a short while. I've noticed that there is a direct connection with how often I use my energy sexually and how it reduces wakefulness during sleep. Not saying you need to quit sex forever, simply do an experiment and see how it influences your dreams. I know it sounds like BS but give it a try. Of course if your in a relationship you will have to fake a back injury to give up sex for a month or so. Haha! :lol:
    “My ally is the Force. Life creates it, makes it grow. It’s energy surrounds us and binds us. Luminous beings are we…not this crude matter. You must feel the Force around you. Here, between you, me, the tree, the rock…everywhere!"
  • cyberealitycybereality Posts: 26,156 Oculus Staff
    3 hours for a lucid dream!!!??!! That's impressive. I considered myself pretty experienced with it, and I think I've only done like 5 or 10 minutes at a time. Really amazing stuff!
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  • 360FOV360FOV Posts: 476
    Hiro Protagonist
    Yeah my typical LD only last 10-30 minutes so when these long 3 hour ones happen it is mind blowing.

    You know how when people are in the Rift for longer than 5 minutes the immersion factor kicks in full gear - well same hear but multiplied exponentially. After a while you start looking at the other dream characters and start wondering if they are real. You have to stay very sober to keep remembering that it is all just a dream. But definitely more fun than a person should be allowed to have. HAHA
    “My ally is the Force. Life creates it, makes it grow. It’s energy surrounds us and binds us. Luminous beings are we…not this crude matter. You must feel the Force around you. Here, between you, me, the tree, the rock…everywhere!"
  • nihiliannihilian Posts: 122
    Who needs immersive VR when we could train ourselves to do ridiculously long and stable lucid dreams? 8-)
  • 360FOV360FOV Posts: 476
    Hiro Protagonist
    I guess I am greedy cause I want both :D
    “My ally is the Force. Life creates it, makes it grow. It’s energy surrounds us and binds us. Luminous beings are we…not this crude matter. You must feel the Force around you. Here, between you, me, the tree, the rock…everywhere!"
  • drachdrach Posts: 63
    Hi Rifters!

    I found this interesting discussion here after seeing the posting about dreams on r/oculus. So I am x-posting here what I wrote on reddit:

    "I received my Rift a week ago and it affected my dreaming since day one. I tried out blue marble and space walk and had dreams about being a bodyless entity floating above our planet afterwards. This morning when I woke up I had images flashing in a stroboscopic fashion before my mental eye. It was like those brainwashing sessions where you are shown different images in rapid succession. The images where some blue-green-yellowish shapes out of a rorschach test. It lasted for around 30 seconds until I could rub the sleep out of my eyes and reality regained the control of my vision.
    Apart from affecting my dreams it also has changed how I perceive my imagination. I have now much more peripheral vision with my "mental eye". Lets say I have a mental image in my mind, I could only maintain a vivid image of an area thats about the size of the foveal area. Now after using the rift I can see the "whole picture", it has literally "broadened" my horizont. Anyone else experiencing this?"


    P.S.: I almost never have lucid dreams and dont try to have them either (I would probably never leave my bed again if I achieved it).
  • 360FOV360FOV Posts: 476
    Hiro Protagonist
    @ drach,

    It's cool to see that others are being invaded in their dreams by the rift. I think we need to coin a new term for the Rift affecting our dreams. Maybe " Rift Night Sickness" but could be confused with motion sickness so not exactly the best choice to describe it.

    Last night I didn't have any lucid dreams but I swear to god that for half the night I was trying on Rifts and experiencing one demo after another that I have never heard of before. They just kept coming - the only one I recognized was when I looked in a Rift and I was watching a giant IMAX screen. It was almost torture. All I wanted to do was wake up and scream stop already so I could get some restful sleep. I guess we have to be careful of what demos we play or think about right before sleep.
    “My ally is the Force. Life creates it, makes it grow. It’s energy surrounds us and binds us. Luminous beings are we…not this crude matter. You must feel the Force around you. Here, between you, me, the tree, the rock…everywhere!"
  • LindblumLindblum Posts: 127
    Maybe someday I'll get to play on the OR until I fall asleep, and have dreams that I imagine my character would have. And now I suddenly wish I had played Psychonauts.
    I'm worried this tech will be too much for some people, and cause psychotic breaks, and the people who blame video games for violent tendencies would finally have a leg to stand on. Maybe these things are too powerful for young minds, and should have a minimum age restriction. Anyway, forum guidelines discourage political debate, but it will come up inevitably. Over time it's going to dig into people and have weeeiiirrrd effects on a lot of them, especially as the technology evolves.
  • 360FOV360FOV Posts: 476
    Hiro Protagonist
    I agree with you on the very young children issue. Whenever I see them using the Rift they appear confused as to what is real or not. It would be terrible if some youngster really thought they could fly because it seemed so real in the Rift and took a leap out of their bedroom window.

    I guess it's up to the parents to help them define the boundaries of reality, just like they already do by explaining movies are just make believe. But in this case even more important.

    As for crazy people,well if they can't tell the Rift isn't real then maybe they already too far gone already. :) So yes, people with mental illness should avoid any virtual reality.
    “My ally is the Force. Life creates it, makes it grow. It’s energy surrounds us and binds us. Luminous beings are we…not this crude matter. You must feel the Force around you. Here, between you, me, the tree, the rock…everywhere!"
  • VRealityVReality Posts: 3
    This thread is without a doubt one of the most interesting threads I've read on the internet, so many insightful responses. I have yet to order the rift, but have obsessively been researching and getting all the knowledge I can on this amazing piece of technology. I've also recently been interested in lucid dreaming, ever since I saw the movie 'Waking Life'(highly recommended), which got me into trying to lucid dream, but haven't successfully done it yet but I've gotten a lot of vivid dreams lately though.

    Well anyway that idea of making a game where you could train yourself to lucid dream is a fantastic idea and I found this video on youtube that I think might be a way of doing that
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s33Y5nI5Wbc

    Rift on everyone! :D
  • MrGeddingsMrGeddings Posts: 604
    i havent noticed my dreams getting any more vivid having used the Rift however.. i do end up oddly dreaming about the Rift in some way but in a more surreal way or something haha. but yeah ...
  • LindblumLindblum Posts: 127
    Has anyone else (when they were young) had dream-induced eneuresis? Where your dream places you in a situation that makes you feel like peeing? I wonder what will happen when people walk into virtual bathrooms or swimming pools while immersed in the Oculus... ;)
  • geekmastergeekmaster Posts: 2,866
    Nexus 6
    Lindblum wrote:
    Has anyone else (when they were young) had dream-induced eneuresis? Where your dream places you in a situation that makes you feel like peeing? I wonder what will happen when people walk into virtual bathrooms or swimming pools while immersed in the Oculus... ;)
    Be careful about using urinals you find in VR (especially the 1080p consumer version with positional head tracking). That warm feeling travelling down your leg might be anti-immersive (except for your toes).

    Or just keep one of these as an essential part of your VR kit:

    catheter_figD.jpg
    :lol:
  • DannySwishDannySwish Posts: 82
    Hiro Protagonist
    It doesn't surprise me in the least that the Rift would cause vivid or heavy dreaming. The whole point of sleep and dreaming is so your brain can analyze any new experiences you've gone through that day/recently. The OP gave the perfect example of how his mostly unchanging, routine day-to-day life wasn't anything new, and so the dreams weren't anything useful or intriguing enough to keep in memory. But suddenly, you're thrown into whole new worlds in the Rift. So many new, insane experiences to be had, and at night when you go to sleep, your brain is going to sift through all of that crazy, fresh input and that's when you get the vivid dreams.

    I haven't even gotten a Rift yet and I've been having dreams regarding its use already. It's something new.

    It'd also be an excellent idea to make some sort of game that assists with achieving lucid dreaming, as one of the team members mentioned.
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  • I've had my Rift since Friday, and fittingly, the main word I keep using to describe the experience to others is 'surreal'.

    I too have definitely noticed an increase in dream-recall and lucidity. Typically I recall very few of my dreams, and I've only had a small handful of truly lucid dreams in my 30 years. Last night involved a dream where my cat, an orange tabby, was as big as Falkor from The NeverEnding Story. I haven't had many that seemed to relate to a VR-experience specifically (aside from dreaming about the Rift itsself while it was stuck in Customs), but there has definitely been a noticeable change in dream activity.
  • GezGez Posts: 2
    NerveGear
    Oculus Rift+binaural beats would be crazy :shock:
  • PokeyPokey Posts: 148
    DannySwish wrote:
    The whole point of sleep and dreaming is so your brain can analyze any new experiences you've gone through that day/recently..

    I thought we still didn't know what the point of dreaming was. My brief research into this topic a couple years back yielded a bunch of "We don't know but here are some theories" articles.
  • mstdesignsmstdesigns Posts: 298
    You can have vivid dreams with almost anything you do for a long period of time. For example one time I was sketching for 14 hours straight, all i could see in my sleep was lines, pencil strokes and unfinished sketches. When I play a new great game and do nothing else that weekend I sometimes feel like i am still playing the game right before I sleep.
  • I just want to point out a few things and hope not to offend.

    Carlos Castaneda did many fraudulent and unscientific things during his career, essentially starting a cult that he was the center of. He helped to bring down the law on the Yaqui people due to the hippies who wanted the peyote and mind altering qualities of the peyote, (Thus making Peyote illegal on both sides of the border). Whether he did have any great revelations or not in reality is besides the point, he did some devastating damage to a people, to his followers, to his family as well as anthropology and the scientific method.

    As far as video games being some kind of magnifier for dreams and soul searching, well, I once interviewed a native American shaman for a research paper while studying for my M.A. in psychology on the subject of what native American spirituality can bring to Americans who are lost, and he laughed and said; Americans want a fast-food answer to spiritualism instead of the long hard work that you have to do to achieve any kind of enlightenment.

    Video games can be fun, I'm not sure they should be the fast food path to false enlightenment.

    Do I believe your dreams may be more vivid after the Oculus? Yes, I've experienced this playing Call of Duty, it's called sensory overload. Your brain may in fact be trying to incorporate everything you've "learned" during gaming, but that doesn't mean your brain will be working in a higher state necessarily, and it could actually intervene in what your brain should be doing when you sleep.

    I think the Oculus is cool, and I'm onboard trying to take my games to VR, BUT I think that the addictive nature of many will be triggered and they will find this altered state far more preferable to our reality. We see it already in many game addicts.

    The opposite is true for people really on the quest for enlightenment. It isn't about bombarding yourself but getting quiet within yourself.

    As for vivid dreams, anyone can vivid dream and EVERYONE dreams each night, it is impossible not to dream. You may not remember your dreams, but they are there. There are many books on vivid dreams and how to achieve the ability to dream with awareness, I began this quest when I was 16, some thirty years ago, and got there with a little practice, no internet, and just a library card, not a game engine.

    My point is that you might be dreaming more vividly after playing games for five hours straight, but that doesn't mean it's a good thing that is happening. The reason is that your unconscious should be integrating things from your life that are meaningful... "Should i ask her to marry me?", "Why did I lose my temper?" "How can i integrate that round-house kick?"

    Our brains processing the pitfalls of video games, where to turn left or right, may not be the greatest thing for our lives if it takes over our waking life, and dream life.

    Hey game on, that's great but as I've preached to my students a million times over, do it less than living your life. So if you play games and find yourself still attentive and awake in your real life that's great. If you find yourself increasingly distracted and spaced out, then you might consider a little less time in VR.
  • I already am a Lucid dreamer. Hopefully the OR will enhance that. My only problem with Lucid dreaming is that on the nights that my dreaming is really active i awake the next morning feeling like i did not sleep. As if i was up all night living this other life.
    Oh man if i had the time i could start building the world that appears in my Lucid dream world into the UDK and start rifting in it while awake.
  • 360FOV360FOV Posts: 476
    Hiro Protagonist
    daevfinn wrote:
    I just want to point out a few things and hope not to offend.

    Carlos Castaneda did many fraudulent and unscientific things during his career, essentially starting a cult that he was the center of. He helped to bring down the law on the Yaqui people due to the hippies who wanted the peyote and mind altering qualities of the peyote, (Thus making Peyote illegal on both sides of the border). Whether he did have any great revelations or not in reality is besides the point, he did some devastating damage to a people, to his followers, to his family as well as anthropology and the scientific method.

    No offense taken. Let me address a couple of your points to provide some clarity where you might have mistaken.

    You say:
    Carlos Castaneda did many fraudulent and unscientific things during his career, essentially starting a cult that he was the center of.

    He did not start a cult. :lol: When curious people came to him he always told them to go away. He said he didn't want followers of any sort. He wrote his first book as a thesis and wasn't looking for anyone but was simply reporting what he had experienced.

    He went to extremes to protect his identity to the point of turning down a million dollar offer from American Express simply because he didn't want the fame that came with it. When Time Magazine placed his photo on their cover they asked him for a photo and he provided them with one where he had his hand covering his face. They were irate when they later discovered that he had given them a fake photo. Afterwards he revealed the reason was that he didn't want to take the chance of being recognized because he didn't want followers. Any reports that he sought people to be in his cult are laughable. :lol:
    He helped to bring down the law on the Yaqui people due to the hippies who wanted the peyote and mind altering qualities of the peyote, (Thus making Peyote illegal on both sides of the border). Whether he did have any great revelations or not in reality is besides the point, he did some devastating damage to a people

    In his books he clearly states that Don Juan Matus is a Yaqui Indian but the knowledge he was teaching had nothing to do with the Yaquis. He also stated many times that the use of Peyote was only implemented because Carlos had a condition which made him incapable of learning and being bombarded with the Peyote and magic mushrooms was the only way to help him "stop the world".

    Furthermore, he explained that it would be suicidal for a lay person to haphazardly use the psychedelics without proper training and guidance. For the hippies to storm Mexico in search of a Yauqi guru because they read someones doctoral thesis was totally insane and unsolicited on his part. The hippie movement was well under way with the influence of Timothy leary, Ram Dass, and R. Gordon Wasson work with magic mushrooms long before Castaneda arrived on the scene. And I assure you that the war on drugs did not happen because of Carlos Castaneda. :lol:
    he did some devastating damage to the scientific method

    This is the only point that you got exactly correct. ;)

    In his books he mentions that the cognitive world of the shamans of ancient Mexico was so engulfing that he lost all focus on the scientific method. He was swallowed by the sorcerers world and failed to report it objectively but rather became a member and was left with no choice other than report what happened to him through his new world view. I don't see that as a bad thing. Do you really think that the scientific method is damaged? That would be impressive 1 guy wrote a book 40 years ago and the scientific method doesn't work like it used to! :lol:
    he did some devastating damage to his family

    How you arrived at this I won't even speculate. No one knows for sure who his family is even. He kept personal details confidential. To this day people don't know if his native country is Argentina or Chile so how you found out about the damage he did to his family is impressive.
    Whether he did have any great revelations or not in reality is besides the point

    I think this would make all the difference in the world! All the things you pointed out become totally irrelevant if indeed he did offer knowledge that could transform the way we live our lives and face our death. If the things he says is true then human beings are creatures totally unknown to ourselves and we hold such potential it would be a crime to dismiss what could be.
    “My ally is the Force. Life creates it, makes it grow. It’s energy surrounds us and binds us. Luminous beings are we…not this crude matter. You must feel the Force around you. Here, between you, me, the tree, the rock…everywhere!"
  • RaemusRaemus Posts: 17
    NerveGear
    Wow, I love this thread! - I am a writer and have an extremely vivid imagination its hard for me to distinguish reality and imagination at times, and I already have seriously vivid dreams that I can recall from places I have never been or seen in my life... This makes me even more excited to see how the Oculus Rift might adapt to what I already experience.

    Regarding some of the post earlier - the part where they mention the orb or light inside someone - this reminds me of an anime called Shakugan no Shana!

    Anyhow - I wrote this piece a little while ago and I believe it is perfect for this thread! -

    “Sometimes I wonder, is our history, our past real? Is this reality the true reality?
    After watching an anime titled ‘Sword Art Online’, which involves a virtual reality your mind can properly submerge into and feel everything, I began to question even more. Despite this world being tangible, what if we are trapped inside it? And our true reality lies in another or even multiple realities?
    Maybe we were meant to be able to travel between dimensions, and also when we sleep, what if that is us logging out and going back to our original existence? This could be justified by the weird dreams we sometimes experience where no valid explanation can be predicted as they contain scenes of a world we have never visited.
    There are so many possibilities of the above notion that it is almost impossible to distinguish the truth. Just because this world is tangible, I often feel there is more to our existence than being trapped in this society, and living a life that many of us feel we have no choice to lead.
    But what if we can escape this? What if we can unlock this barrier that holds us here? A force that maintains our captivity in this society and expand into something greater and fascinating, that we can only imagine in our dreams.”

    (Copyright R. Mawby)
  • natalievfxnatalievfx Posts: 36
    Brain Burst
    I have had some crazy dreams after spending a couple hours in the rift before I go to sleep at night:)
  • moltonmolton Posts: 388
    Hiro Protagonist
    So many people on the Oculus Rift forum talking about lucid dreaming and the works of Carlos Castaneda. This is so freaking cool. I think it's pretty obvious that the Oculus Rift will be a lot more important to humanity than simply a video game accessory.

    I'd like to point out that Carlos Castaneda had profound things to say, unfortunately people with profound things to say are often discredited and smeared in society for whatever dumbass reason. He had nothing to do with the cult other than the fact that they took the information in his books and did dumb shit with it.
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