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Enable CV1 sensors for Rift S tracking boost. (30-40% of my games not viable on Oculus hardware.)

KnightMason
Level 4
The Problem:
Every game that has gunplay, archery, or throwing mechanics, "advanced" grabbing mechanics, or otherwise use any form of movement outside of swinging a simple sword, are now a nearly unplayable experience do to the Rift S tracking. That is up to 30 to 40% of the content in the Oculus Store my library.
And many of those games are the most played content. (See example list below.)

I'm finding every FPS shooter, every archery game, every grenade throw, every backward stab with a sword, every dual wielding mage build holding back a horde of enemies both in front and behind me, to be a complete garbage experience now in the Rift S.
And there is no available solution since the CV1 is not available.
All of those developers are going to suffer for it. And the percentage the Oculus store gets will too.

The Solution:
Sell the CV1 sensors and have it work with the Rift S as a "boost" in tracking. You get to sell more hardware. You make more money from those of us who need it for games that require it.

You created the problem yet you don't make money off it.
We should not have to beg for a solution that you already have said can be done in other posts.
Also, maybe notify customers on the store page for those games that it best used with a sensor for the best experience. (As you already do for how intense an experience is and for the play area requirement.)

Examples:
The examples listed below are just a few games available in the Oculus store with no warning about it not working properly on ANY available Oculus hardware since the CV1 was taken down.
  1. Onward: Can't scope, can't hold two handed guns and aim, can't throw grenades properly.
  2. Zero Caliber: Can't scope guns or hold two handed rifles. Period.
  3. Echo Arena: Can't rotate hand behind you for movement, hold, and dodging mechanics.
  4. Lone Echo: Can't grab behind you for basic movement and hold positions.
  5. ANY game with archery & slingshot mechanics: Too many to list. You now have to draw your arrow with "hipfire" and hope for the best.
32 REPLIES 32

jayhawk
Level 9
How 'bout just fix it, especially for those who don't have CV1 sensors, nor should anyone be required to buy sensors for a full experience.

KnightMason
Level 4

jayhawk said:

How 'bout just fix it, especially for those who don't have CV1 sensors, nor should anyone be required to buy sensors for a full experience.


Well I posted a reply to you but they removed it apparently. Or it bugged.

Basically the firmware can only fix so much. Cameras can't see through hands or arms. And locking hands to a position, like to the face in archery for example, would still take away from fine control that applies to aiming.
When a single cheap sensor can fix it.
The DK2 used one sensor for tracking and it worked great.

Edit: I agree it's unfortunate. But the company is about making money. They will only fix it be more incentivised to fix it, if they can make money off the problem. We already have to buy or make our own audio solution to match that of the CV1. For $399 I'm not complaining about that.
I just want it to work for games I already paid for. Because everything else about the Rift S is fantastic. (Except the minor bugs they are working on now like controllers not turning off and flashes of static.)

GummyBerryJoos
Level 2
Totally agree. It's shameful that optional sensors wasn't a thing at launch. They knew the limitations of the tracking. I would have preferred honesty about those limitations and to be given an option to overcome those limitations

kojack
Volunteer Moderator
Volunteer Moderator


  1. Lone Echo: Can't grab behind you for basic movement and hold positions.


Turning on the headlight is very difficult, since you need to press a button on the side of your head, where the controllers can't track.


jayhawk said:

How 'bout just fix it, especially for those who don't have CV1 sensors, nor should anyone be required to buy sensors for a full experience.

It's a fundamental flaw of head mounted camera inside out tracking of hand controllers. The fix is to not do that and use something superior like the CV1 had (it might not be as convenient for some people, but it has far fewer problems).


One complication: there's no IR lights on the Rift-S, so CV1 sensors can't physically track it. The Touch controllers can probably be tracked (depends on things like IR frequency).
Author: Oculus Monitor,  Auto Oculus Touch,  Phantom Touch Remover,  X-Plane Fixer
Hardware: Threadripper 1950x, MSI Gaming Trio 2080TI, Asrock X399 Taich
Headsets: Wrap 1200VR, DK1, DK2, CV1, Rift-S, GearVR, Go, Quest, Quest 2, Reverb G2

parsecn
Level 5

Tracking fidelity is the #1 most important feature to me in the VR experience, where I never even considered Rift-S due to the reduction in (tracking) quality. I've followed the tracking debacle quite closely, from early testers and influencers, etc. who were effectively towing the line because they harbor the "big picture" want of VR being widely adopted and successful, with Oculus' new mantra of trade-offs.


The shift to inside out to satiate the lowest common denominator has bummed and soured me to Oculus, completely.


A user in the forum thread "Rift S - Please read before you buy - Tracking problems with realistic FPS sims & Archery" tweeted both Nate Mitchell and John Carmack asking for them to enable external tracking to support Rift-S/ resolve poor tracking etc.


Carmack replied, "Integrating external camera tracking for Rift S controllers would be a *LOT* of work, and it wouldn't function as well as you expect, because the ring orientation is biased towards the headset instead of the Touch orientation. Better to hope for inside out tracking improvements."


To me, it reads like external ain't gonna happen.

 


parsecn
Level 5

Tracking fidelity is the #1 most important feature to me in the VR experience, where I never even considered Rift-S due to the reduction in (tracking) quality. I've followed the tracking debacle quite closely, from early testers and influencers, etc. who were effectively towing the line because they harbor the "big picture" want of VR being widely adopted and successful, with Oculus' new mantra of trade-offs.


The shift to inside out to satiate the lowest common denominator has bummed and soured me to Oculus, completely.


A user in the thread https://forums.oculusvr.com/community/discussion/75817/rift-s-please-read-before-you-buy-tracking-pr...  tweeted both Nate Mitchell and John Carmack asking for them to enable external tracking to support Rift-S/ resolve poor tracking etc.


Carmack replied, "Integrating external camera tracking for Rift S controllers would be a *LOT* of work, and it wouldn't function as well as you expect, because the ring orientation is biased towards the headset instead of the Touch orientation. Better to hope for inside out tracking improvements."


To me, it reads like external ain't gonna happen.

 


MAC_MAN86
Level 9
I just think these VR developers are taking the wrong directions and not working at all together. There should be a brilliant product that does what we want and affordable but it hasn't appeared. Instead they dance around existing tech and miss bits off and create other limitations. Seriously Carmack mate, you got your design model wrong but are using a scheme in Business which is stretching out development so it takes longer. It's so obvious and why Lenovo have been handed it. 
A huge group of us are very worried about the future of PC VR in doing this. Sure enough there are GPU limitations coming very soon and AMD will soon blow away Intel again and crash the market of Nvidia card manufacturing. We really have not had new tech in VR. This should not be so hard to get right by now with a headset plus body tracking all without room sensors nor needing any visible light (use IR instead) and finally become WIRELESS!!! Wifi 6 is already here ffs 😮

donnyjoe
Level 4
Improvements for controller positional estimation in the Rift software should come, but developers could also do some work to mitigate these issues, and surely will. (Look at what they're doing in Iron Man VR on PSVR.) I get where you're coming from but a lot of these issues are being greatly exaggerated (especially your "30-40%" figure, I'm betting) and judging the merits of new hardware based on how it handles old titles that haven't even had a chance to get updated to adapt isn't really fair.

SkScotchegg
Level 11
Over the past month that this has been going on I just think more and more that they should have done two two things:

They should still sell CV1, why they stopped selling CV1 is beyond me, especially when they say Rift S is not an upgrade for CV1 owners.

And secondly they should patch the software to allow us to use Constellation tracking. - They first said "We could enable this later" and then I messed CEO of Oculus on Twitter and they basically said "It would be a lot of hard work to enable Constellation tracking in the software".

It really annoys me that they don't listen to us - and what kind of a response is that? Do any of us really care how much work it takes for them to patch Constellation tracking into Rift S software? It's their problem that they created.

Quite annoying.

And I agree with OP. We all spent all this money buying over 100 games in our VR library and then you buy Rift S and try to play all those games again and 90% of the games have problems with the tracking and most are just unplayable.

Like you can play Arizona Sunshine as long as you only use 1 handed weapons. You can play In Death as long as you don't mind not been able to shoot properly with a bow and can't aim correctly...this is just ridiculous.

Oculus better make this upto us with CV2!!

CV2 needs to have increased FOV, increased resolution, built in audio and Constellation tracking...And then all is forgiven! But until that moment - They will feel my Wrath! Or perhaps not...since they don't read the forums and don't seem to care what we say lol.  😛

EDIT: To OP I did make a thread about this situation weeks ago where we discussed all these issues:

https://forums.oculusvr.com/community/discussion/75817/rift-s-please-read-before-you-buy-tracking-pr...
UK: England - Leeds - - RTX 2080 - Rift CV1 & Rift S - Make love, not war - See you in the Oasis!