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CV 2

wanoennogs
Level 5
Will we ever see a RIFT CV2?
67 REPLIES 67

TomCgcmfc
Level 15
Kev, most Go users like myself could care less about enterprise.  For now the Go works great and it's well supported imho.
i9 9900k, rtx3090, 32 Gb ram, 1tb ssd, 4tb hdd. xi hero wifi mb, 750w psu, Q2 w/Air Link, Vive Pro

LoneEcho
Level 5

RedRizla said:




Good luck with waiting for that to happen. Oculus want to cater for the majority and the majority don't have a Geforce 1080Ti & 2080ti graphics card for higher resolutions. 


I don't know where you dug up those specifications, but you are wrong. You need something like that for Valve Index, and even that for some very demanding games. Mid range PC is more than good enough for Rift S. By the time next gen rift comes out, mid range GPU's will be more or less on pair with RTX 2080 Ti level of performance.




RedRizla
Level 15

DuxCro said:


I don't know where you dug up those specifications, but you are wrong. You need something like that for Valve Index, and even that for some very demanding games. Mid range PC is more than good enough for Rift S. By the time next gen rift comes out, mid range GPU's will be more or less on pair with RTX 2080 Ti level of performance.







I haven't dug it up from anywhere, it's well known that higher resolutions require a better graphics cards to get higher resolutions and higher FPS. You say you will need those specifications for the Valve index, but the Vavle index only has a slightly better resolution than the Rift S. Unless you are tallking about the Valve index running at more than 90fps, then there's a few guys on here running the Vavle index on a Geforce 1080 with good results. If you want 2k per eye you are going to need a Geforce 1080ti or a Geforce 2080ti graphics card, I know this because I own a Geforce 2080ti and my graphics cards only just manages to run some games at 2k per eye.

Congratulations
Level 5
Wait and see, anything could happen just takes time could be this year or a few years away only Facebook really know.

Anonymous
Not applicable

TomCgcmfc said:

Kev, most Go users like myself could care less about enterprise.  For now the Go works great and it's well supported imho.


Its not about what you care about though. Enterprise is still part of your customer base and you can't ignore that LOL. If you want to play that game then - from the same view point - who cares about a few customers that adds nothing to the over all community? GO can't add to the numbers game that Quest and S can add to devs looking to hit as many users as possible for their software. GO offers little to next generation software devs and its smaller and smaller sells numbers show that! Quest adds to the PC number of users now and Quest benefits from PC number of supported games. PC benefits from having more users and thus should see a increase in games. GO gets nothing from Quest do to limits of both software and hardware. GO gets nothing from PC as well. <-- if that is consider well supported... then nvm... just love your purchase and move on... it however adds nothing to the rest of the conversation.

Mark my words - GO will turn into a little brother of Quest. Quest-2-GO will be a strip down version of current Quest with less cameras and maybe only one controller - it will support hand tracking at least - or you will have to buy the controllers on their own (maybe a combo deal if you buy both). Over all it'll start at the same cost of GO1 while providing a lot more features and function while adding numbers that devs and share holders would rather see.


Quest-2-GO - how would they keep cost down if Quest cost 400 atm?
1) Quest - 1 is the base behind how Quest-2-GO will work - thus it'll be a numbers changes vs having to make a new product thus R/D will be cheaper.
2) Quest-2-GO will use one screen vs two screens that Quest 1 uses now. Easy 75-100$ off
3) It'll come with less cameras - around 2 cameras in the front. Easy 25$ off
4) They can skip out on the controllers and use hand tracking that Quest 1 is getting. Easy 50$ off
5) They can offer controllers as an add on if you still want them. Easy gain of another 50$
6) Link will be supported meaning it will bring numbers of users to both Quest 1 and future Quest-2-"" thus more devs and share holders will be happier knowing there is a player base to sell to or create wonderful larger games for and support like for MMO. < harder to say, but they can use this to off set cost/do more % off if they wish
7) Quest-2-GO can come with a smaller starting storage limit and battery size/storage Easy 25-50$
= All these small changes can eat out 200$ just fine - and they would still make a little money per unit and GO idea will fade and Quest line up will take over as their new reset of line up. Even if the users/customers have to pay another 50$ for some controllers  -at 200-250 its still a hella of a deal to get into VR for and still opens the door for small trade shows. Easy to follow upgrade path with buying controllers and optional PC hook up. Over all - this headset would have a future and people will see that. And if you want more - such as tracking or storage - then the next follow ups are there for you in terms of Quest-2-GO, Quest-2-Home, and Quest-2-PC. Its totally perfect xD


DuxCro said:

Well Quest standalone is laughable compared even to a lower end PC. Mobile chip from 2017. And if you want something wired to PC, then Rift S provides superior experience.  In console terms, quest standalone  is like XBOX 360 and Rift S is like XBOX One X if you have mid range PC. I think with the next headset we'll see something standalone, but with a better option of connecting headset to PC. This link cable doesn't have the bandwidth of a proper display port cable on Rift S.


Game wise - sure - but you have to understand that the feature of still being able to be some place else to play a few games is WAY more powerful than to have to be always hook up to the home PC. Some pop games dont even take that much hardware to recreate if optimize really well too. Beat Saber being one of the killer apps to have and yet - its simple enough to be play on Quest and have hours of fun playing it. I mean look at todays flat screen games like league of legends that could be played on a potato yet 4-5 years ago took a pretty decent setup.

Correct, so Quest-2-PC would be just that - it would have the ability to be on the go with the headset using Quest-2-Home (Quest 2) hardware - but higher resolution, maybe a few more cameras, better weight control/balance, but will support some type of Link 1.5 that would have access to the ports like HDMI or DP instead. Link 1.0 would still be usable - but would come with some trade off of course. Unless they do some real magic - witch they could as they haven't max out the total bandwidth just yet in terms of tricks they can still pull off. FOVA could also be used a bit more heavily as well and better commutation between devices could help lower the required information that is sent over the cable as well thus opening more space for more detail data. Over all there is a untap 25-30% more bandwidth they could get from a few more tricks - the question is that 25-30% enough? Link 1.0 already looks pretty good and it already allows a BIG jump from a simple "design wise" game like Beat Saber to complex games like BoneWorks! That's already amazing.

Quest-2-PC would be the only one you would pay x amount of dollars for something in the background you might not always use - but over all - even if you use it once - it would already pay for it self pretty quickly. And as someone pointed out - they can always move the electronics out of the headset and some place else (like the back on the strap) to help control weight in the front or even better - off set weight for other features like we see in HD. 

kevinw729
Level 15

TomCgcmfc said:

Kev, most Go users like myself could care less about enterprise.  For now the Go works great and it's well supported imho.



I think you are purposely not recognizing that this is the start of a migration of support. I know there are hundreds of Go users out there VERY happy with their purchase. I only wish it had been a 855 processor and been future proofed, rather than the dead-end it seems to have been deemed - even the Chinese partner. 
https://vrawards.aixr.org/ "The Out-of-Home Immersive Entertainment Frontier: Expanding Interactive Boundaries in Leisure Facilities" https://www.amazon.co.uk/Out-Home-Immersive-Entertainment-Frontier/dp/1472426959

Anonymous
Not applicable

kevinw729 said:


snowdog said:
......
They wouldn't be working on the Half Dome prototype if they weren't planning a Rift 2.
......

Sorry snowdog - but that is not exactly true. Many corporations have "beauty-projects" seen at the various motor-shows, concept cars that claim to be incorporating elements that "will be applied in future models!" Funny one of my fellow journos said the same thing about Half-Dome2, "elements to be seen in CV2"!

If you pay $3b - you have to be seen to be still on the edge, even if your leading CTO leaves to do AI projects, all your R&D leaves to join Apple or you develop a CV1.1 using licensed tech from Sony!




The Half Dome prototype has been a key feature of their Oculus Connect and F8 shows for the last few years. And it's had several revisions. Their latest prototype they've worked on getting the production costs down. This would all imply that they're seeing this as a commercial product rather than a tool for PR.

And if they are launching this as a commercial product then it will be a PC VR headset rather than a standalone/hybrid headset.

Anonymous
Not applicable

dburne said:


snowdog said:


dburne said:

All anyone can do is speculate and guess at this point.
My guess - no to CV2. Future development will be on a Quest style of device which may incorporate some of what has been discussed in the Half Dome technology.

I suspect even Oculus does not know the answer yet either.



They wouldn't be working on the Half Dome prototype if they weren't planning a Rift 2. The Quest line is full of mobile phone components and cooling. They wouldn't be able to fit the Half Dome prototype hardware and cooling into the Quest line of headsets yet and the cost of it will end up being $600+ by the time it releases.

Oculus know the answer because they're not stupid. They've DELAYED the release of the Rift 2, not cancelled it. And we'll see that they've made the correct decision too, same as they did with the Touch controllers.

Why would any of the Half Dome tech that has been discussed not be able to be put in a Quest style headset ?
Like I said, everything at this point is pure guesses and speculation. But I fail to see why what they have shown would be able to fit into a Rift headset but not a Quest style headset.

Heck last they talked was of Half Dome 2 and 3, and we have never seen a Half Dome 1 yet !
RIP Rift LOL.
Go Quest!! 

There is a reason all the focus of late , even in the software releases, has been on Quest with Link. Have a read at the Version 14 release notes.
There is a clue there.
😉



Quite simple really. There isn't enough room in the headset for the mobile phone hardware, cooling and battery as well as the hardware that's inside the Half Dome prototype.

The next version of the Quest, the Quest S, will be a cheaper version same as the Rift S was. Expect a BOE fast-switch LCD or LCDs, no manual IPD adjustment and maybe a Halo strap if Lenovo are manufacturing it.

They also won't be able to have the Quest 2 being the Rift 2 because it'll be too expensive. The Half Dome commercial product will have AT LEAST 2.5K displays, more likely 4K. You don't have eye tracking and foveated rendering in a headset and only have a weak GPU in the thing. So you'll probably be looking at a hundred quid or more just for the GPU alone.

It'll end up being $600+.

They want customers in their Stores, this is why they've been so aggressive with their pricing and selling stuff at cost. They've cut the production cost of the Half Dome prototype because they want to sell it for $399-$499. They can't do that if it has a shitload of mobile phone components, heatsink and fans on top of the tech that's inside the thing now.

Anonymous
Not applicable

snowdog said:


The Half Dome prototype has been a key feature of their Oculus Connect and F8 shows for the last few years. And it's had several revisions. Their latest prototype they've worked on getting the production costs down. This would all imply that they're seeing this as a commercial product rather than a tool for PR.

And if they are launching this as a commercial product then it will be a PC VR headset rather than a standalone/hybrid headset.


Wait, did I miss something ? Last years revision wasn't set on anything about getting production cost down O.o it was simply - how can we make it more complex and simple without adding a complex system of moving parts? And most of that was around the VDOF not anything else. Even then - the solution look a bit costly at the time.

Anonymous
Not applicable

snowdog said:


dburne said:


snowdog said:


dburne said:

All anyone can do is speculate and guess at this point.
My guess - no to CV2. Future development will be on a Quest style of device which may incorporate some of what has been discussed in the Half Dome technology.

I suspect even Oculus does not know the answer yet either.



They wouldn't be working on the Half Dome prototype if they weren't planning a Rift 2. The Quest line is full of mobile phone components and cooling. They wouldn't be able to fit the Half Dome prototype hardware and cooling into the Quest line of headsets yet and the cost of it will end up being $600+ by the time it releases.

Oculus know the answer because they're not stupid. They've DELAYED the release of the Rift 2, not cancelled it. And we'll see that they've made the correct decision too, same as they did with the Touch controllers.

Why would any of the Half Dome tech that has been discussed not be able to be put in a Quest style headset ?
Like I said, everything at this point is pure guesses and speculation. But I fail to see why what they have shown would be able to fit into a Rift headset but not a Quest style headset.

Heck last they talked was of Half Dome 2 and 3, and we have never seen a Half Dome 1 yet !
RIP Rift LOL.
Go Quest!! 

There is a reason all the focus of late , even in the software releases, has been on Quest with Link. Have a read at the Version 14 release notes.
There is a clue there.
😉



Quite simple really. There isn't enough room in the headset for the mobile phone hardware, cooling and battery as well as the hardware that's inside the Half Dome prototype.

The next version of the Quest, the Quest S, will be a cheaper version same as the Rift S was. Expect a BOE fast-switch LCD or LCDs, no manual IPD adjustment and maybe a Halo strap if Lenovo are manufacturing it.

They also won't be able to have the Quest 2 being the Rift 2 because it'll be too expensive. The Half Dome commercial product will have AT LEAST 2.5K displays, more likely 4K. You don't have eye tracking and foveated rendering in a headset and only have a weak GPU in the thing. So you'll probably be looking at a hundred quid or more just for the GPU alone.

It'll end up being $600+.

They want customers in their Stores, this is why they've been so aggressive with their pricing and selling stuff at cost. They've cut the production cost of the Half Dome prototype because they want to sell it for $399-$499. They can't do that if it has a shitload of mobile phone components, heatsink and fans on top of the tech that's inside the thing now.

I got some land in FL I would love to sell ya.
😉 
Keep on believing though, keep the faith!

On a serious note:
My prediction - and prediction is all any of us are doing - next version will be a new Quest updated to handle both PC-VR out of the box and stand alone with it's updated integrated processor. Little higher res, maybe little higher FOV. Further improvements on the hand/finger tracking.

Retail around the same price point as current Quest. 
Released "maybe" in 2021.  Rift future development will remain on a very back burner for a while. Oculus will remain very silent on any Rift news. May never be resurrected depending on what all they can accomplish with a new Quest and how successful it is doing PC-VR.

Now that they have opened the door to the Rift platform and library with Quest Link, that is what they are going to be focused on for a while. Already in the first iteration, it does a pretty darn good job. If my Rift S developed a defect and I needed to send in for replacement, I would have no problem at all playing any of my games including flight sims on my Quest with Link while I waited for my replacement Rift S.